New lathe purchase, is this enough?

[BinaryAndy]

You want that Takisawa Webb. That's a real machine. They were really mid-to-upper-end industrial lathes. There is an enormous difference between that and the Chinese hobby machines you're looking at. If everything is in reasonably decent shape, the Takisawa will make the PM seem floppy by comparison.

From the pictures, it looks like it was probably well taken care of (I notice everything looks a bit dirty except the ways and lead screw, that's a good sign) and it comes with what seems to be good tooling. It is 3-phase, so if you don't have a 3-phase circuit you'll need a VFD, but they're not too expensive these days.

It's not American iron. I'm not sure of the actual origin for this machine, but I believe Takisawa made lathes in Japan, Korea and Taiwan. Most likely it's Taiwanese, which is not a bad thing; these are very well made. The Webb-branded ones are often copies of Mori-Seiki designs (some of the best). The ways are hardened, so there should be less to worry about there.

Only downside I know of is that the spindle speed is much lower than I prefer, although I'm spoiled by 4000 RPM and constant surface speed on the CNC. On silencer-sized parts with good carbide I rarely end up below about 2500 RPM except for drilling or threading. And I don't even use aluminum, this is for 4140 steel. You don't need that much speed if you're not in a hurry, but it is nice to have, especially for aluminum.

I honestly find that American lathes are almost always either too big, too old or too slow. The Japanese and Korean lathes from the 70s and 80s are often better quality, and they sometimes have reasonable max spindle speeds, like 2000 to 3500. However, I think the two absolute best manual lathes you could pick if you were getting one solely for silencer work are both American: the Monarch 10EE and the Hardinge HLV-H.

Now back to what you're actually asking about, in addition to what was already mentioned, another point in favor of the Grizzly over the PM is that the Grizzly gunsmithing lathe actually has decent spindle bearings. Looks like the PM 1127 might as well. That should help in a lot of ways, and may be worth half the price difference by itself.

Sorry for the long post, I get a little verbose when I talk about machine tools.

[mr fixit]

If everything is in reasonably decent shape, the Takisawa will make the PM seem floppy by comparison.

That is the biggest issue. I am lacking the knowledge to evaluate what shape a used machine is in.

[BinaryAndy]

If everything is in reasonably decent shape, the Takisawa will make the PM seem floppy by comparison.

That is the biggest issue. I am lacking the knowledge to evaluate what shape a used machine is in.

This site covers most of it: http://www.mermac.com/

[MMH]

Just great... Now I want to get a lathe.

[Capt. Link.]

Just great... Now I want to get a lathe.

The first ones cheep then you'll get interested in meehanite and chrome ways w/ DRO.Its a gateway turn back now or be hooked for life.Its a rough road when you get into the heavy stuff and adding a trap door to your living room is a viable option for the equipment.

[mr fixit]

The first ones cheep then you'll get interested in meehanite and chrome ways w/ DRO.Its a gateway turn back now or be hooked for life.Its a rough road when you get into the heavy stuff and adding a trap door to your living room is a viable option for the equipment.

Are they as addictive as suppressors?

[BinaryAndy]

Are they as addictive as suppressors?

In my experience, generally yes. However, unlike suppressors, lathes tend to become less addictive as you acquire machines of higher quality and mass.

For example, my first lathe was an 11" made by Sidney in the roaring 20's, originally for use with a lineshaft but converted to a 1/2HP electric motor. It's not a bad lathe at all, but it's not very heavy, rigid or powerful, the bronze bearings in the spindle are worn out, the ways have just enough wear to be occasionally irritating, and the tailstock can't be trusted to center up any better than .006". I was looking for a new lathe within six months.

I looked for a better manual lathe for some time, and then I decided to get a bit more serious and ended up with a 16,000 lb CNC turning center with a 20HP 4000RPM spindle, a subspindle, two turrets, live tooling, constant surface speed, high-pressure coolant and enough rigidity that it seems perfectly happy taking a cut .2" deep at .01" per rev in 4140. I don't often get tempted by lathes anymore. (A Mazak Integrex doesn't count as a lathe, does it? )