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Yes, it can be legal to make a silencer. For everything Form-1, from silencer designs that are easily made, to filing forms with the BATF, to 3D modeling. Remember, you must have an approved BATF Form-1 to make a silencer. All NFA laws apply.

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Post by Enfield577 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:51 am

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by doubloon » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:16 am

Quite the re-entrance, wow that's a lot of ports.

Besides Silencerco the only person I recall with experience suppressing shotguns is Tits. There was a guy here a while back thinking about making a 4lb can to suppress everything from 9mm to shotguns but he could never get any traction convincing people it was a good idea.

I had to look up exhaust packing, I still don't know what it's made from but from the picture I found it looks like it has all the stiffness of a bathroom rug.

Have you looked at some of the flexible "stone fiber" insulation like Roxul? it may be a little more sturdy and have more resistance to packing. Or Chore Boy copper pads?

The only other thing that comes to mind is to wrap some kind of light stainless hardware cloth or mesh in with the packing to add rigidity like a stent. Maybe about 2 3/4" wide by (eyeballing the length of the first chamber) 4"?
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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by crazyelece » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:22 am

Some of the older tech silencers here in the states used brass eyelets (like the type used for boots to run the laces through), might be able to get your hands on something like that to try.

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by T-Rex » Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:59 am

I was looking for BCJ's shotgun suppressor link and found this one. Some good info in it for you. I'll keep looking for the original one and post if I find it.

It's this gun I'm trying to find the disassembled picture of.
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Post by Enfield577 » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:08 pm

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by John A. » Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:52 pm

I don't think shoelace eyelets would be a very good idea, given all the large ports that would likely allow them to migrate into the direct path of the bullet/bore. At least I wouldn't attempt it, specifically without some sort of screen in place over the ports.

Copper chore boy has worked as a packing.

Even "magic erasers" foam cleaner work (for little while).

Fiberglass muffler packing sucks. Perhaps some fireproof "cloth" loosely wrapped between your baffles may help. That may be what you're referring to as a fire blanket.

If you don't have a chronograph, I strongly suggest getting one. It may just be loud because it's loud, not because it's still going supersonic. That's a lot of holes to be building 1100 foot+ feet per second.
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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by alordnapa » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:32 pm

You can buy 100% copper screen material which has a close to ideal specific heat, and can be rolled tightly and will have minimum lateral ( End to end) compression due to the nice boxy composition. The same companies that sell this screen ( Very much like window screen) also sell a 100% copper mesh ( Like a ChoreBoy) these are used for ratproofing things. ( Have you ever tasted pure copper? And I am not even a rat...) Good luck with your interesting project!

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by doubloon » Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:17 pm

Well, after looking at the barrel trex posted your build appears to be port poor.

I was afraid the screen would crumble too. The only other thing I could think of in terms of support for the cloth was difficult to describe but it would end up being something more rigid with "struts" running lengthwise secured by rings not unlike a ladder safety cage.

It would appear there is ample room between the tube and the barrel for something substantial.

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by T-Rex » Wed Nov 15, 2017 8:32 am

So, the issue is your screen/insulation material is sliding forward?
How about making a piece, similar to an AR15 bbl nut, and placing it near the chamber end to allow the material to hook onto?

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You can make as many "points/hooks" as needed and as sharp as you like.
For added security, leave 3/4" of material free and wrap wire around it and the new piece. You can fold the material over and wrap another length of wire around.
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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by Enfield577 » Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:45 pm

Great ideas thanks gents, I will try them out today.

Mmmm just thinking maybe a combination of both ideas.

I also borrowed a Chrono so I can try to see if the projectiles are still supersonic even after all those ports. I really think that is the key, I have to drop it down to sub sonic to get suppression that I want.

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by Capt. Link. » Thu Nov 16, 2017 8:36 pm

E-mail sent.
The only reason after 243 years the government now wants to disarm you is they intend to do something you would shoot them for!

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Post by Enfield577 » Fri Nov 17, 2017 2:23 pm

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by John A. » Sat Nov 18, 2017 12:43 pm

If I were to make a guess, Even though the barrel is heavily ported, and the exterior tube is somewhat larger diameter, it is still holding a lot of the pressure in, which is still allowing the wad/projectile to reach a supersonic velocity.

Can you try a larger diameter outer tube? Or put more chamber/baffles in there to maybe seperate the gasses more?

I remember the old sionics cans, they had a larger (two stage) outer tube to further seperate the gas, allowing the inner pressure to be lower which may help in your case.

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by Enfield577 » Sat Nov 18, 2017 3:31 pm

John A. wrote:If I were to make a guess, Even though the barrel is heavily ported, and the exterior tube is somewhat larger diameter, it is still holding a lot of the pressure in, which is still allowing the wad/projectile to reach a supersonic velocity.

Can you try a larger diameter outer tube? Or put more chamber/baffles in there to maybe seperate the gasses more?

I remember the old sionics cans, they had a larger (two stage) outer tube to further seperate the gas, allowing the inner pressure to be lower which may help in your case.

Image

Thanks for the reply John, I did try multiple baffles last weekend as you indicated but it actually got louder. Quite a challenge this one, I am getting to thinking sub-sonic ammo is the only way but not quite beaten yet. I might try larger dia tube or maybe just in the chamber area, maybe a second outer tube, like in the can you show....Mmmmm another idea to try.

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by doubloon » Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:18 pm

Enfield577 wrote:...
Doubloon - I might try your idea if I can find a gage material, the next step is to try some Copper wool, I have to try to find some and give that a go as many suggest that would work.
...
I may have underestimated the pressures :D

I see CaptL sent a email that guy is a wizard.
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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by John A. » Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:28 pm

Yeah, Capt is a legend here in his own right.
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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by Enfield577 » Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:10 pm

Yea he is the man, a wealth of knowledge and a really nice guy.
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Post by Enfield577 » Wed Nov 22, 2017 4:28 pm

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by doubloon » Sat Nov 25, 2017 11:31 pm

Most interesting.

The eyelets are a nice twist.

Yet another mundane item the ATF can add to the list as a danger to humanity.
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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by T-Rex » Sun Nov 26, 2017 10:34 am

Very interesting
Yeah, I could see that spring being adversely affected by the intense heat. Just keep adding eyelets to pick-up the slack :lol:
So, is the endcap suppressor after the muzzle or still over the barrel?
doubloon wrote:Yet another mundane item the ATF can add to the list as a danger to humanity.
Done! :wink: :wink:
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Post by Enfield577 » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:44 am

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Re: 410 Shotgun Suppressor, any experience out there ?

Post by doubloon » Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:36 am

Enfield577 wrote:...
You say about the ATF and the eyelets, I understood it was a very old idea first used in the US years ago.
...
Thanks for that tip, a little searching turns up a couple references, even one on this board from 2007 with M baffles. All of it predates my active interest in suppressors. An interesting thread you started here.

viewtopic.php?p=902447#p902447

The picture is of a Sionics suppressor.

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