Cone baffle drilling

[Anthonys288]

Good morning new here. Need help with cone drilling for 5.56 can. Any help is appreciated. Any bit sizes and drill patterns would be great. Also is it neccessary to have more than the main hole in the baffles.

[John A.]

You can drill as many holes as you like. There are no set ways of doing it.

However, if they're just drilled all "willy-nilly" it is very likely to DECREASE the efficiency of the baffle.

A good plan going into it will usually pay off better in the end. Otherwise, it's usually apparent on the firing line who has done the least amount of research and work when the safety comes off and they start sending rounds downrange.

Are you asking what drill bit and/or reamer to use to drill the bore of a 223 can?

That largely depends on how well you can center the holes, and how tightly the baffles fit inside of the tube and how straight the threads on the endcap, and the barrel threads are too.

Most folks don't go smaller than about 17/64 (.2656") even with decent equipment with minimal runout.

If you are doing it by hand or on a drill press with one of those solvent trap things, expect to have to go larger to reduce the possibility of baffle strikes. Also reducing efficiency.

[Walkintall_2]

There's a lot of talk about "silencing" a .223/5.56 but you're wasting your time unless you slow down that bullet to below 1100 fps. To do that you needs sonic ammo and you turn your AR-15 into a single shot .22 caliber rifle as the action won't cycle with subsonic ammo. The laws of physics dictate that anything moving at 2,000-3,200 fps is going to create a sonic boom (the crack you hear) when it passes 1,125 fps. Watch the Hickok45 video, on YouTube, and he'll make the folly of trying to suppress an AR-15 perfectly clear. Buy yourself a Ruger 1022 rifle or a 22/45 pistol (both have threaded barrels) and put your "solvent trap" on those. They both cycle subsonic ammo with no problem. You just need a 25/64 drill, a good drill press and a decent vice.

[fishman]

There's a lot of talk about "silencing" a .223/5.56 but you're wasting your time unless you slow down that bullet to below 1100 fps. To do that you needs sonic ammo and you turn your AR-15 into a single shot .22 caliber rifle as the action won't cycle with subsonic ammo. The laws of physics dictate that anything moving at 2,000-3,200 fps is going to create a sonic boom (the crack you hear) when it passes 1,125 fps. Watch the Hickok45 video, on YouTube, and he'll make the folly of trying to suppress an AR-15 perfectly clear. Buy yourself a Ruger 1022 rifle or a 22/45 pistol (both have threaded barrels) and put your "solvent trap" on those. They both cycle subsonic ammo with no problem. You just need a 25/64 drill, a good drill press and a decent vice.

Pretty much every silencer company makes a 5.56/223 silencer. Are you seriously suggesting that they're wasting their time?

Did you really make an account just to inform us that 556 silencers are pointless? You clearly don't know what you're talking about.

[T-Rex]

There's a lot of talk about "silencing"

The name "silencer" came from Hiram Maxim's invention (circa 1902). It wasn't until the National Firearms Act of 1934 that the device was defined. Being such, the ATF used a commonly known word "silencer" for their definition. Anyone who's been around enough knows them by their true name, suppressors; as they suppress: sound, recoil, and muzzle signature.

Suppressing a 223/5.56mm is not difficult at all. I say not difficult because Mfr's have been doing it for decades. It's so easy, in fact, a person with limited skills can buy kits off the internet, to be completed at home w/ minimal tooling.

I used an "N" drill (.302) on my last 5.56mm design.

[John A.]

Everyone knows that silencers don't "silence" the gun shot.

Unless you're some Hollywood movie maker where the writers and directors and sound engineers don't know what they're doing. Most people have noticed the lack of quality coming out of California for quite some time now has been garbage.

My neighbors lawn mower also has a suppressor on it. And I can hear it inside my house and have to turn up my tv every time he mows his lawn with it. Most people don't know that Maxim invented both the firearm muffler and the car muffler simultaneously, and based on the same concept and principles.

~140-160 db is about how quiet a rifle silencer is in real life. And that is on the same scale as the deck of an aircraft carrier with jets taking off.

http://www.industrialnoisecontrol.com/c ... amples.htm

[Capt. Link.]

Drilling a hole is 100% the wrong way of making a bullet passage in a baffle. Bore the hole so its round and concentric to the centerline.If you must use a drill bit spin the work-piece in a four jaw for precision followed by a reamer. I only mention this so more people will have success in building. Poorly made passageways can cause bullets to exit in other than planned paths.....Do it right or ask if your not sure...............
-CL

We can thank Mitch Werbel for the term Suppressor.
A great man who served our country!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell_WerBell_III

[fishman]

I agree link, that's the BEST way to do it. But for those without a lathe, a drill can do the job. The hole will need to be bigger, which reduces how well the silencer works, but it can be done.

[ECCO Machine]

There's a lot of talk about "silencing" a .223/5.56 but you're wasting your time unless you slow down that bullet to below 1100 fps. To do that you needs sonic ammo and you turn your AR-15 into a single shot .22 caliber rifle as the action won't cycle with subsonic ammo. The laws of physics dictate that anything moving at 2,000-3,200 fps is going to create a sonic boom (the crack you hear) when it passes 1,125 fps. Watch the Hickok45 video, on YouTube, and he'll make the folly of trying to suppress an AR-15 perfectly clear. Buy yourself a Ruger 1022 rifle or a 22/45 pistol (both have threaded barrels) and put your "solvent trap" on those. They both cycle subsonic ammo with no problem. You just need a 25/64 drill, a good drill press and a decent vice.

Keyboard commando with little or no real world suppressor experience.

First of all, the sound barrier varies with altitude; it's not 1,125 here at 6,800 ft where I am, closer to 1,030 FPS.

More importantly, while very audible, the sonic crack is too diffuse and too low pressure to be a danger to our ears. The same is certainly not true of the 5.56mm round unsuppressed, which is going to be somewhere in the 155-160 dB range, depending on barrel length and muzzle device. A suppressed 5.56 rifle, while still quite loud, can easily come in under 140 dB.

Finally, what moron would use a 25/64 drill (.391") for a rimfire can? I don't even go that big for .30 cans. .030"-.060" over bullet diameter is ideal; .255"-.280" should be your through bore size on a .22 can if you want it to work worth a crap.

[fishman]

Finally, what moron would use a 25/64 drill (.391") for a rimfire can?

the kind of moron that can't figure out how to properly center a hole in a baffle.

[Walkintall_2]

There's a lot of talk about "silencing" a .223/5.56 but you're wasting your time unless you slow down that bullet to below 1100 fps. To do that you needs sonic ammo and you turn your AR-15 into a single shot .22 caliber rifle as the action won't cycle with subsonic ammo. The laws of physics dictate that anything moving at 2,000-3,200 fps is going to create a sonic boom (the crack you hear) when it passes 1,125 fps. Watch the Hickok45 video, on YouTube, and he'll make the folly of trying to suppress an AR-15 perfectly clear. Buy yourself a Ruger 1022 rifle or a 22/45 pistol (both have threaded barrels) and put your "solvent trap" on those. They both cycle subsonic ammo with no problem. You just need a 25/64 drill, a good drill press and a decent vice.

Keyboard commando with little or no real world suppressor experience.

First of all, the sound barrier varies with altitude; it's not 1,125 here at 6,800 ft where I am, closer to 1,030 FPS.

More importantly, while very audible, the sonic crack is too diffuse and too low pressure to be a danger to our ears. The same is certainly not true of the 5.56mm round unsuppressed, which is going to be somewhere in the 155-160 dB range, depending on barrel length and muzzle device. A suppressed 5.56 rifle, while still quite loud, can easily come in under 140 dB.

Finally, what moron would use a 25/64 drill (.391") for a rimfire can? I don't even go that big for .30 cans. .030"-.060" over bullet diameter is ideal; .255"-.280" should be your through bore size on a .22 can if you want it to work worth a crap.[/quote

Excuse me. I apologize for that error. My big clumsy fingers hit 25 instead of the 15 (15/64") and I didn't catch it. I must look like an idiot for that. I apologize again for my typing error.

[fishman]

Excuse me. I apologize for that error. My big clumsy fingers hit 25 instead of the 15 (15/64") and I didn't catch it. I must look like an idiot for that. I apologize again for my typing error.

Don't worry, you still look like an idiot because 15/64 is way too small. A .005" thou air gap between the baffle and the bullet isnt going to work unless the thing is machined absolutely PERFECTLY. Even then, your poi shift would be horrible. Your accuracy and bullet stability would probably be negatively effected a great deal as well.

1/4" is the smallest anyone should go, and many people go bigger than that. Im doing 0.280" on the one in making now.

[a_canadian]

1/4" is the smallest anyone should go, and many people go bigger than that. Im doing 0.280" on the one in making now.

Yeah, for a number of .22lr and .22" airgun cans I went with 1/4", but found that accuracy occasionally suffered. Going to 0.27" or even 0.28" fixed accuracy problems consistently, and didn't harm suppression efficiency very significantly. A smidge louder but not a big deal. 15/64", or 0.234375" as is being suggested to correct a 'typo' of 25/64", is absurdly close to the bullet's path. Perhaps could work if one were extremely accurate in all things, from centering of the baffles when boring to tolerance of baffle OD to tube wall to concentricity of the can mounting to the bore of the gun, but I seriously doubt it'd work beyond two, maybe three baffles if there's any porting at all which pushes gases across the bore. Which of course is essential in any really quiet design. You'd get horrid POI shift at the very least, and with 8 or 10 baffles you'd get strikes and a destroyed can.

[John A.]

To be honest, I use 25/64 for my 9mm cans. I can solemnly swear that I've never had a baffle strike while shooting 22LR through it.

1030 fps seems rather low even with the variance in altitude and temperature. For me, speed of sound is ~1,114 fps

[300sniper]

Drilling a hole is 100% the wrong way of making a bullet passage in a baffle. Bore the hole so its round and concentric to the centerline.If you must use a drill bit spin the work-piece in a four jaw for precision followed by a reamer. I only mention this so more people will have success in building. Poorly made passageways can cause bullets to exit in other than planned paths.....Do it right or ask if your not sure...............
-CL

We can thank Mitch Werbel for the term Suppressor.
A great man who served our country!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell_WerBell_III

I personally have zero issue using a Guhring Series 5744 drill to size without any boring or reaming op, in stainless, Ti or Al. Even with a HSS jobber bit in a hobby lathe, it shouldn't wonder a significant amount over the length of a baffle. A 4 jaw chuck isn't going to keep a drill from wondering.

[ECCO Machine]

1030 fps seems rather low even with the variance in altitude and temperature. For me, speed of sound is ~1,114 fps

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/elev ... _1534.html

When shooting standard velocity and some "subsonic" ammo here that normally hover around 1,030-1,050 FPS from a rifle, some will have a sonic crack and some won't out of the same batch, same day & time, same weapon.

According to various calculators, the sound barrier is here between 1,027 and 1,089 FPS, depending on temperature from -20°F to 100°F, the temperature range here from the coldest winter days to the worst it gets in the middle of summer.

[a_canadian]

I've had random transitional crack noise with Remington Subsonic at about 100 metres above sea level, from a 10" barrel which averages 1050fps using that ammo. Chalk it up to wildly fluctuating powder loads in Remington nonsense perhaps, but I tend to stick with CCI SV for that reason. Never had such with CCI.

[John A.]

Winchester is terrible for that too.

Though in fairness, I couldn't tell you the last time I saw Winchester rimfire for sale.

[cdhknives]

You can also get a bit of sonic crack from localized airflow going supersonic even when the overall bullet is not. I swore at my 300 Blackout for several range trips when the chrony was reliably showing me to be subsonic around 1075 fps (less than 100' above sea level in the subtropics here in South Texas) but my ears were definitely telling me I was supersonic. It took an aerospace guy I know to explain that little detail to me...