is there such as a thing as too big?

Yes, it can be legal to make a silencer. For everything Form-1, from silencer designs that are easily made, to filing forms with the BATF, to 3D modeling. Remember, you must have an approved BATF Form-1 to make a silencer. All NFA laws apply.

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kutworksinc
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is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by kutworksinc » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:12 pm

Ok, so one of the form 1's I want to build is for a GSG 5pk. For those that dont know, its a .22LR clone of an MP5.

We went and shot it over the weekend with my dads GM-22 on the end. Worked great, but it looked goofy.

Is there any downside to having an oversized suppressor? Granted, I know I don't NEED that much space, and the weight, ect ect ect. This is pretty much a range toy for my kid to shoot. Its already a massive firearm for such a tiny caliber, so adding on some extra "Tacti-Cool" weight isn't really anything I'm concerned about. I was thinking instead of a 1"x6" can, more like 1.375x8 or 9. Thats a HUGE increase in volume. So unless I literally made the worst baffles ever, it should work pretty well.

So that brings me to my question, is there ever a situation where there is too much volume?

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yondering
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by yondering » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:30 pm

You're thinking of something basically the size of a Liberty Mystic X. I have one, and it's quieter on all my 22 LR guns than my Outback II, which is already way (WAY) quieter than the GM22.

Go for it, but IMO you might as well make it a 9mm can while you're at it. With that much volume and length, I don't think the larger bore hurts the suppression very much.

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doubloon
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by doubloon » Wed Sep 19, 2018 7:47 am

What he said.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDtd2jNIwAU MUSAFAR!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI This is Water DavidW
Complete Form 1s http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895

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Capt. Link.
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by Capt. Link. » Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:51 pm

Building a 30 caliber 1.375x9.00 to work on the GSG .22 would look good and perform well.I love the old school look though smaller than the 12-15" x 2.00" 9mm suppressors of yesteryear.If you build the 30/.22lr the use of hemispheric baffles are a good compromise and easy to make.
-CL

To big in volume ? area alone is not insurance of performance.
There needs to be a investigation if anyone in the Democratic party has ties to America.

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kutworksinc
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by kutworksinc » Thu Sep 20, 2018 3:08 pm

Ill do a search for hemispheric baffles. Cant say Im familiar with that term.

I was planning on machining a G-core style monocore similar to Gemtech. I have a rotary index head on my CNC mill and Im ready to cut something on it.

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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by a_canadian » Thu Sep 20, 2018 6:06 pm

The thread got partially withdrawn by its author some years ago, but these hemispherical spun stainless baffles look pretty darn nice, and if memory serves the guy who made them said the result was a decently quiet can:

Image

He said in that thread - viewtopic.php?t=69193 - that the holes were later opened up with wire EDM. I'd suggest something with a clip would likely be a bit better still, but hard to incorporate that in such a dome. Maybe pressing one edge down into a groove in a matching mandrel with an arbor press?

kutworksinc
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by kutworksinc » Thu Sep 20, 2018 10:25 pm

a_canadian wrote:The thread got partially withdrawn by its author some years ago, but these hemispherical spun stainless baffles look pretty darn nice, and if memory serves the guy who made them said the result was a decently quiet can:

Image

He said in that thread - viewtopic.php?t=69193 - that the holes were later opened up with wire EDM. I'd suggest something with a clip would likely be a bit better still, but hard to incorporate that in such a dome. Maybe pressing one edge down into a groove in a matching mandrel with an arbor press?
I could easily clip it with the mill. Im assuming by clip, you mean cut the hole slighly elongated to one side?

Honestly, with it being .22, and the possibility of non FA 9mm, i would machine them from 5053 or 6061 alum. Ive got piles of 1" and 2" scrap plate sitting around. I could prolly mill them, bore the center hole, and cut a clip in one operation.

With all that said, if I were to cut the hemispherical baffles, cut the clip, machine a spacer tube to seperate baffles, would it be wise to sandwhich in a flat washer style baffle in between, making a crude K baffle?

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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by a_canadian » Thu Sep 20, 2018 11:37 pm

kutworksinc wrote:I could easily clip it with the mill. Im assuming by clip, you mean cut the hole slighly elongated to one side?
I suppose so, though opening out the bore in the baffle makes for slightly reduced efficiency in terms of trimming gas flow. Well... I guess there are various opinions about that. But if I were making dome-shaped baffles for some reason, I'd probably want to leave some extra material around the middle so as to allow some clips being carved without widening the bore.
kutworksinc wrote:With all that said, if I were to cut the hemispherical baffles, cut the clip, machine a spacer tube to seperate baffles, would it be wise to sandwhich in a flat washer style baffle in between, making a crude K baffle?
If you want K baffles, make K baffles. A dome or cone sandwiched with a flat washer doesn't make a K baffle at all. The venting is radically different, with a proper face clip and matched waist vent being central in the efficient function of a K baffle.

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yondering
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by yondering » Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:12 am

kutworksinc wrote:
I could easily clip it with the mill. Im assuming by clip, you mean cut the hole slighly elongated to one side?
That's not all of what a good baffle clip really is though; typically you want some material moved or removed on one side along the bullet path, not just off to the side. The point is to direct gas flow in a non-linear and non-concentric manner to create turbulence, just elongating the hole to one side may not do that, and may cause issues with bullet stability; it certainly can in muzzle brakes. Pressing a dimpled or raised section on one side of the hole could do the trick; I've seen some like that before.

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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by a_canadian » Fri Sep 21, 2018 1:26 am

As yonderling suggests, a simple pressed dimple can be an effective 'clip' towards redirecting gas flow outwards from the bore. Here's some freeze plugs with dual pressings in opposite directions, taken from another old thread:

Image

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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by Capt. Link. » Sat Sep 22, 2018 12:57 pm

Those spun baffles are exactly what I was thinking of thank you a_Canadian. The hemispheric baffle is a very good one but I would not clip them if maximum suppression is wanted for .22LR. One of the most quiet rifle suppressors I've ever shot was built using Hemi baffles.
The stamped dimpled baffles were sold by Lakeside Machine pre 86 for suppressor kits. While many have given up on the HPA Historian & myself both have erected small temples where we burn pictures of anti gun hooplaphobes until it passes.
-CL
There needs to be a investigation if anyone in the Democratic party has ties to America.

Knowledge cast's out the shadows in one's own mind -

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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by Historian » Sun Sep 23, 2018 9:39 am

Capt. Link. wrote:Those spun baffles are exactly what I was thinking of thank you a_Canadian. The hemispheric baffle is a very good one but I would not clip them if maximum suppression is wanted for .22LR. One of the most quiet rifle suppressors I've ever shot was built using Hemi baffles.
The stamped dimpled baffles were sold by Lakeside Machine pre 86 for suppressor kits. While many have given up on the HPA Historian & myself both have erected small temples where we burn pictures of anti gun hooplaphobes until it passes.
-CL
+2! :)

In ancient times they knew the power of offering sacrifices to get help.

E.g., << https://sites.google.com/site/biblecode ... sacrifices >>

Perhaps we need to up date this underrated process
and see if offering up a DemoNrat will work speeding things along!
And the judge would not let them out on BAAL! :) :)

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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by kutworksinc » Mon Sep 24, 2018 9:09 am

I haven't given up on HPA at all, but I'm also not waiting around for it either.

I find it insane we have file paperwork, wait for an absurd amount of time, and subject ourselves to background checks, just to own a tube with zero moving parts.

And whats worse, the fact that, on record, the ATF wants you to send your form1 can in to an SOT for repair, because making a new baffle would require a new stamp

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Capt. Link.
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Re: is there such as a thing as too big?

Post by Capt. Link. » Mon Sep 24, 2018 3:11 pm

[quote="kutworksinc"]I haven't given up on HPA at all, but I'm also not waiting around for it either. [quote]

That's a good way to deal with it though burning pictures in effigy is not bad either.I hope that the November elections may clear the way.

I'm on record for the dislike gun laws of any sort.That said I built them under NFA laws for over three decades.I see it simply in that in order to not disturb the public I must muffle everything in my life including speech why should a firearm be any different.Its not a firearm why is it under the NFA?

Even under the current laws you can still build a very good suppressor and many people here will give you "sound" advice.

Best of luck
-CL
There needs to be a investigation if anyone in the Democratic party has ties to America.

Knowledge cast's out the shadows in one's own mind -

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