.44mag integral ruger

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jarrodl
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.44mag integral ruger

Post by jarrodl »

I'm thinking about making an integral .44mag out of a Ruger 96/44. What do you think about porting the barrel to get some of the gas out behind the muzzle? I understand some of the commercial rifles are ported. How many holes would be needed? What size and how far from the chamber? I plan on controlling velocity by handloading, so the ports wouldn't be needed to bleed off excess pressure, just give the initial gas a place to go and make it so there is less of it coming out the muzzle for the baffles to deal with.
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Fudmottin
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Post by Fudmottin »

Not sure if this helps. But I have a 3" barreled 629 that will push 180gr JSPs supersonic. My 240gr LSW hand loads tend to be subsonic using Unique, the dirty powder from heck. I still get a bit of leading. No gas checks.
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Post by Taldin »

I bought a Ruger 44 Carbine to do an integral. I haven't filed that form 1 yet.

From what I've read the heavier loads one would tend to go for on subsonic are difficult to stabilize with the 44 Carbine barrel twist. I don't know if the twist is different. Offhand I would guess the {44 Carbine, 44 Deerfield, 96/44} successively use the same barrel specs if not blanks).

Load info from anybody who's done this would be useful. I'll try to dig up my references (Paulson perhaps).
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Post by jarrodl »

I had some cast 300gr bullets loaded to about 1000fps that I shot through it just to see if they would stabilize. I haven't shot paper yet to see how they group, but I can hit a 12-16" wide pine tree at 150-200 yrds. I figure if they weren't stabilizing, they should be off by then. I originally loaded them for a NEF .44mag, and they grouped decent in it. I think I have read they aren't supposed to be able to stabilize them either. I could bust milk jugs at 100yrds. I figure that is about max range on a .44 300gr 1000fps load anyway.
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

Barrel porting on my 44/77

Image


Porting is inside the expansion chamber.

Image



The whole thing.

Image
Last edited by dead-bird on Sat Apr 11, 2009 7:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
jarrodl
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Post by jarrodl »

for some reason your pictures didn't post. Only a box with an x shows up. Can you please re post them. Or email them to me at JARRODL(at)NETEASE(dot)NET
Thanks
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

Maybe I have it figured out this time...

Apparently, I can't link to my photo storage at cox.
drew2
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Post by drew2 »

dead-bird wrote:Barrel porting on my 44/77
Thanks for those pics, Dead-bird. Is that the standard barrel you've got there? and which brand integral is it?
I'm keen on making one of these up, so these pics are really interesting.
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

It's the standard barrel. Made by S&H Arms, http://www.sandharms.com/

You might also look at SRT Arms, http://www.srtarms.com/7744.htm

If I were doing it all over again, I might opt for the SRT with the optional Douglas barrel.
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Fudmottin
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Post by Fudmottin »

Very cool.

I was thinking that I might do my Marlin as an integral. Main reason is that it has a bull barrel and doing it as an integral could make it look like the standard rifle barrel.

I can see myself spending as much on tax stamps as machines.
drew2
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Post by drew2 »

dead-bird wrote:
If I were doing it all over again, I might opt for the SRT with the optional Douglas barrel.
What's the heaviest projectile you use subsonic through the standard barrel? I've heard those Douglas barrels are 1 in 11" twist (standard 1 in 20" i think), but I have to stick to a standard barrel (in Australia - no available fast twist option unfortunatley).
I read on THR forum that a nice load with the standard barrel (not sure if it was shortened from the standard 18.5") is:
"Sierra 250 gr silhouette bullets and with 9.0 gr of Trail Boss, groups are under 1" at 100 yds.
Velocities are in the 1000 fps range with less than 15 fps deviation and Trail Boss burns relatively clean".

Sounds good i thought.
jarrodl
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Post by jarrodl »

Thanks so much for those pictures. I have been wanting to form 1 one of these for a long time. Can you tell me the diameter of the tube? Also can you tell me about how long the barrel is and how long the baffle stack is in front of it?
Thanks again.
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Post by Crosshair »

I always thought the ports would be smaller than that. :shock:
drew2
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Post by drew2 »

dead-bird wrote:Barrel porting on my 44/77..........

Porting is inside the expansion chamber.
Are there any holes in the expansion chamber, eg. do the gases move from the barrel porting into the expansion chamber then escape through holes into the baffles area, or is the expansion chamber closed once it is screwed on?
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

I haven't forgotten about your questions. My wife has been in and out of the hospital and I've had no time to get more photos taken.

Hopefully by the beginning of next week, things will return to what passes for normal around here.
drew2
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Post by drew2 »

well, i hope she gets well soon. thanks for the email.
drew
jarrodl
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Post by jarrodl »

Yes. I hope all is well. Take your time.
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Post by IAC533 »

My best wishes for you and your wife.
"The only day that doesn't end in "day" is tomorrow"...Sandra Willoughby
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

drew2 wrote:
dead-bird wrote:Barrel porting on my 44/77..........

Porting is inside the expansion chamber.
Are there any holes in the expansion chamber, eg. do the gases move from the barrel porting into the expansion chamber then escape through holes into the baffles area, or is the expansion chamber closed once it is screwed on?
The expansion chamber is sealed

Image
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

There are actually two chambers. The first, from the chamber end (right to left) to the first threads, is sealed. The second is open to the baffle stack and is between the first threads to the threads on the end of the barrel.

The sealed chamber tends to accumulate unburned powder that might otherwise be blown out the barrel...

Image
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Post by gaucho1 »

Very interested in the size of the ports and how that effects
velocity and any other aspects of performance.

8)
jarrodl
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Post by jarrodl »

How long is the barrel? How long is the expansion chamber? How long is the baffle stack in front of the barrel? Is the can diameter 1.25" or 1.5"? Does the space around the barrel on the muzzle side of the threaded divider act as a secondary expansion chamber? What holds the bafffle stack in front of the muzzle? Sorry, I'm strarting to sound like I'm playing 20 questions. Thanks.
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Fudmottin
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Post by Fudmottin »

Crosshair wrote:I always thought the ports would be smaller than that. :shock:
This response is rather late as they say.

Gas has momentum like any other matter. Getting it to do a 90 degree turn is not as simple as you would expect. It sure helps that there is a bullet blocking its path and thus forcing it into the expansion chamber.

But at the end of the day, the gas is still being forced to effectively come to a complete stop, do a 90 degree turn, and start moving again.

My MKII design will be using a sealed expansion chamber for the gas ports in the barrel. I suspect SRT does the same. Any SRT owners feel free to show me the internals of their MKII! :)

I plan on using just four slot shaped ports. The first trick is working out how close to the muzzle I should be. Once that is done, then it is a simple matter of using a chronograph to determine the actual length of the slots. Measure, mill, measure again, mill again. Repeat as needed.
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dead-bird
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Post by dead-bird »

All measurments are approx.

Sealed expansion chamber is 7"

Expansion chamber open to baffle stack is 7"

Baffle stack in front of barrel is 6"

OD of the tube is 1.5"

Barrel is 16.5"

The space around the barrel on the muzzle side of the threaded divider is open to the baffle stack and could be considered a secondary expansion chamber. Or maybe just a very large blast chamber.

There is another threaded divider (not really a divider as it has four slots cut in it) on the very end of the barrel that bears on a step inside the main tube, holding it on. The baffle / spacers stack on top of that and the end cap is threaded into the tube.
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Post by jmorris »

This one interests me as I’m thinking along the same lines, sort of. It’s a 458 socom that I didn’t want to turn into pool cue length with a suppressor. I was thinking of filling the remainder with K baffles but the valve retainer style would be less hassle to make. How does the one pictured sound and what is the ID on the baffles?



Here are some photos of what I have so far.


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