Form 1 Cans and Machine Shops

PaulNoiseLess · Post by **PaulNoiseLess** » Tue May 17, 2011 12:49 pm

Hi,

Let’s imagine you’ve got your Form 1 signed and want to outsource the build to a Machine Shop. Your Machine shop is in a different state, where Suppressors are also legal.

What’s procedure for doing that ?

Best,

Paul

ghostdog662 · Post by **ghostdog662** » Tue May 17, 2011 1:15 pm

As far as I've seen you either have to be present during the machining or they have to be 02 SOT with a copy of your form 1.

If there is no form present then the machine shop is making an illegal sound suppressor.

boatbod · Post by **boatbod** » Tue May 17, 2011 6:56 pm

A Form 1 permits you to manufacture a suppressor yourself. If you outsource it to a company with a SOT, you'd be doing a Form 4 transfer.

dammitman · Post by **dammitman** » Tue May 17, 2011 7:44 pm

boatbod wrote:A Form 1 permits you to manufacture a suppressor yourself. If you outsource it to a company with a SOT, you'd be doing a Form 4 transfer.

OK, what about if no SOT? just outsourcing to someone who has a lathe? is that legal?

RPM509 · Post by **RPM509** » Tue May 17, 2011 8:15 pm

dammitman wrote:
boatbod wrote:A Form 1 permits you to manufacture a suppressor yourself. If you outsource it to a company with a SOT, you'd be doing a Form 4 transfer.

OK, what about if no SOT? just outsourcing to someone who has a lathe? is that legal?

No

delta9mda · Post by **delta9mda** » Tue May 17, 2011 8:55 pm

how many times must it be said? you must be there when parts are being made with form/ tax stamp in hand.

if parts are not complete you must take them with you and bring back to finish.

there are no ifs, ands or buts.

Bendersquint · Post by **Bendersquint** » Tue May 17, 2011 9:52 pm

ghostdog662 wrote:As far as I've seen you either have to be present during the machining or they have to be 02 SOT with a copy of your form 1.

This is accurate. An 07/02 can produce the suppressor without you being present, regardless of the state the SOT or the F1 owner is in.

-B

Bendersquint · Post by **Bendersquint** » Tue May 17, 2011 9:54 pm

boatbod wrote:A Form 1 permits you to manufacture a suppressor yourself. If you outsource it to a company with a SOT, you'd be doing a Form 4 transfer.

Absolutely incorrect.

A Form4 is a transfer of ownership nothing more, so long as the SOT is an 07/02 you need not be present and they can do the work for you, you are subcontracting the work to them, not transferring legal ownership to that SOT.

-B

Bendersquint · Post by **Bendersquint** » Tue May 17, 2011 9:59 pm

delta9mda wrote:how many times must it be said? you must be there when parts are being made with form/ tax stamp in hand.

if parts are not complete you must take them with you and bring back to finish.

there are no ifs, ands or buts.

This is absolutely correct DELTA, so long as the creator of the parts is a non licensee. If they are an 07/02(must be both) then you can leave your parts along with a copy of your approved F1 and ask when you can pick them up.

But there aren't many 07/02's that like to deal with that because more often than not the customers create problems and it drives the 07/02's underground in this regard.

-B

Bendersquint · Post by **Bendersquint** » Tue May 17, 2011 10:02 pm

PaulNoiseLess wrote:Hi,

Let’s imagine you’ve got your Form 1 signed and want to outsource the build to a Machine Shop. Your Machine shop is in a different state, where Suppressors are also legal.

What’s procedure for doing that ?

Best,

Paul

Paul,

We have brought this up many many times and you have chimed in about it as well! Why do you keep bringing this stuff up?

The procedure has been laid out many times in the past. Are you looking for a different answer than you have got in the past??

-B

PaulNoiseLess · Post by **PaulNoiseLess** » Wed May 18, 2011 6:49 am

Hi,

As far as I remember, I did not address this question before. If I already did, sorry, my fault. I did about Form 1 (and it’s clear now for me) and also had some kidding about it but regarding Machine Shops, I don’t remember … (really, no kidding at all). Any way.

So, not looking for a different answer but addressing the issue from a different angle. I’m not familiar with legal procedures that’s why I ask.

Now, it’s more clear for me: You can outsource building to a Machine Shop as long as they are SOT 02 and 07.

Now, another question: Is there any list of Machine Shops in USA that holds both SOT, 02 and 07 ?

And the reason I’m asking is that we have many info requests of People wanting to build their own Can but are lost on legal procedures. So, I was thinking on compiling a List of licensed/legal Machine Shops and probably Form 1 assistants to help them to fulfill the whole process legally.

Best,

Paul

Bendersquint · Post by **Bendersquint** » Wed May 18, 2011 7:11 am

PaulNoiseLess wrote:Hi,

As far as I remember, I did not address this question before. If I already did, sorry, my fault. I did about Form 1 (and it’s clear now for me) and also had some kidding about it but regarding Machine Shops, I don’t remember … (really, no kidding at all). Any way.

So, not looking for a different answer but addressing the issue from a different angle. I’m not familiar with legal procedures that’s why I ask.

Now, it’s more clear for me: You can outsource building to a Machine Shop as long as they are SOT 02 and 07.

Now, another question: Is there any list of Machine Shops in USA that holds both SOT, 02 and 07 ?

And the reason I’m asking is that we have many info requests of People wanting to build their own Can but are lost on legal procedures. So, I was thinking on compiling a List of licensed/legal Machine Shops and probably Form 1 assistants to help them to fulfill the whole process legally.

Best,

Paul

Paul,

No there are not any lists of machine shops that are 07/02 licensees, you have to ask around, talk to your local SOT's and see if they know or present a project online and see if anyone knows an 07/02 that can handle the work without a death grip on their credit card. You won't find it advertised anywhere because 90-95% of the 07/02's won't do custom work and most people wouldn't like to hear the quote for custom work anyways. There are a handful that will do it, and the prices aren't outrageous. Most prices you will find for an 7/02(unless they are starving and late on the mortgage) will be in the arena of popular factory made cans OR HIGHER! Custom labor ain't cheap unless the 07/02 is setup to do it that way and it reflects his business model.

Big reason you won't find a list of 07/02's is because the 02(NFA manufacturer aspect of the license) is tax information and can not be published. Another thing to think about is whether or not the 07/02 would want their information posted out there, some just keep to themselves and cruise along at their speed.

No offense Paul, but I would highly recommend you leave the Form1 assistance to Americans that have done it or do it often, while you may be familiar with how its done you don't live it. What I would recommend is to put together a list of individuals that will help a Form1 individual and refer your customers to those sources.

-B

PaulNoiseLess · Post by **PaulNoiseLess** » Wed May 18, 2011 1:50 pm

Hi,

Your Post is fine, no offens at all.

Yes, that’s exactly what I want to have: A list of people or shops or whatever, who can do the type of things that I can’t or that I just don’t want.

In other words:

“Mr. Customer thanks for trusting in us, here you have your Design and the List of XXXXX that can help you to complete the Building process. You can get in contact with them to ask for quotations, services, ...”

You see what I mean ?

Can you imagine myself teaching others how to fill up a Form 1 ?. No, man; no way … paperwork ?, no, no, no, no, ….

I know where my Business is and beside growing it more, I’m not planning to get into other’s space. I’m plenty of room to grow already.

It’s a real shame to have people willing to build their own Cans and not being able to do just because they lack on information.

I’ll keep trying any way.

Best,

Paul

SRM · Post by **SRM** » Wed May 18, 2011 5:49 pm

Paul,

KInda sucks for me because i`m a machinist of twenty years in job shops. By now one would think I`d have my own machines but I don`t.
The shitty part is I don`t want to ask permission or beg forgiveness to do a form one or I would have by now.
Dont want to until I have my own stuff. I hate sharing my lathe!!!

Most people lack the skill and/or the equipment, so I do see where your ? is coming from. Good luck finding the answers!

PaulNoiseLess · Post by **PaulNoiseLess** » Wed May 18, 2011 6:40 pm

Hi,

SRM, if you are a good Machinist you’ll be doing good Business for sure. No matters where it comes from. Yes, you can !

I do not build/manufacture (except for my own use and Prototypes. Limited to Alu and low speed ammo but having the tools to extrapolate). My private Collection is now 137 Cans. Just for me, you know … Yep !, it's mine !

Yes, I’m not from USA but I don’t think that’s an issue. I don’t think I’m actually a thread – both business and personal - but in case you think so, just go to Police … I just don’t care !, I’m clean !

(Clean in terms of records, my hands and dick sucks, …)

Just to finish, and always taking into account that I do really appreciate you: Your problem is China not PaulNoiseLess.

Best,

Paul

SRM · Post by **SRM** » Wed May 18, 2011 8:46 pm

Thank you sir!

You made me lmao! Wish you the best!
My next beer IS for you. ( Bud Light by the way )

Form 1 Cans and Machine Shops

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