How's the HF 7x10 lathe?

[Bendersquint]

You will be better off geting a 40 year old clasuing, southbend or other "good" lathe than a new one from china. As a bonus you will likely get hundreds of dollars of tooling thrown in the deal.

All depends on which "chinese" lathe you go for. There are some really good ones that make old iron look ill performing.

[HankB]

. . . I've wanted a small lathe & mill for some time, but due to space & budget constraints I need to keep them on the small & cheapish side. And 120V. That really limits my choices . . .

The HF 7x10 is actually more like a 7x8, and comes out of the same Sieg factory in China that most of the 7x imported lathes come from. I have a 7x14 MicroMark which really only differs from the HF in length and in having inch threads. Cost is an issue when buying a lathe, but size matters, too - my situation is that I need something that's at least somewhat "man portable" since it shares workspace with other things, and a 7x is the largest I can manage . . . and it runs on regular 115VAC. (Looked at an 8x14, but at 200 lbs, it was too much for me. )

The 7x lathe design is fundamentally sound, but they are roughly finished in places - http://www.mini-lathe.com has a lot of information and links to modifications to take the 7x lathe to the next level - I fabricated tapered gibs and fitted them (fitting is VERY important!) to my machine, lapped in the carriage, cross slide, and compound, etc., and it changed the entire character of the machine - MUCH smoother travel and slop with respect to the bed was reduced from 0.005" down to around 0.0002" - 0.0003" as near as I can measure. I've done good work in both aluminum and steel and am very satisfied with the results - within its size limits, it now does a very credible job. For me, it does what I want it to within my space limitations.

But it is NOT repeat NOT equivalent to a full size machine. Try to take the same cuts on a tabletop 7x lathe that you would on a full size lathe and you'll be disappointed. You really have to manage speeds and feeds and take smaller cuts - it simply doesn't have the power/torque of a larger machine. And of course, it doesn't have the rigidity of a bigger lathe, either.

If I were buying a full size machine, unless I could be assured that a larger Chinese lathe was finished better than the 7x lathes, I'd avoid them and look for a Clausing, South Bend, etc., probably in the "used but not abused" category. Modding my 7x is one thing (luckily I had access to a mill at work to make the tapered gibs) but I really wouldn't want to go through that on a larger & more expensive machine.

One final disclaimer: I'm a hobbyist, not a trained machinist, so my perspective may be a little different from someone who really knows what he's doing.

[mg81]

I agree with the above statement about getting older US when you can. It is what I have.

It is understandable though if you don't think you have the space for a larger lathe. But take a serious look at the South bend 9" bench lathes (or any US made bench lathes). They can be pretty small and will do so much more than a tiny HF lathe.

The only problem is that they are in higher demand than the larger machines because hobbyist want them. You can find larger machines (by that I mean 1500+ lbs) for scrap weight prices. So you would likely pay the same for a hobby level benchtop 9" machine as a 13" machine that can do light production work.

[timkel]

Question about the Harbor Freight mini lathes--Can these machines cut the really fine threads required for suppressor build? How about knurling steel?

[Bendersquint]

Question about the Harbor Freight mini lathes--Can these machines cut the really fine threads required for suppressor build? How about knurling steel?

Threads possible, knurling no way.

[bakerjw]

I would love to have a HF small lathe. For small work that can be accomplished with a small lathe. For anything else I'll go with good old American iron any day.

Given the choice between old American iron that needs some TLC and decent quality Chinese equipment? I'll take old American every time because Old American doesn't support our #1 enemy. I do the same with every other purchase as well.

Just my rant.

[Bendersquint]

I would love to have a HF small lathe. For small work that can be accomplished with a small lathe. For anything else I'll go with good old American iron any day.

Given the choice between old American iron that needs some TLC and decent quality Chinese equipment? I'll take old American every time because Old American doesn't support our #1 enemy. I do the same with every other purchase as well.

Just my rant.

China is our #1 enemy?

[bakerjw]

Well perhaps #2 after our elected officials. But yeah, China is anything but out friend. Hence my dollars are spent elsewhere whenever I have the opportunity.

[Bendersquint]

Well perhaps #2 after our elected officials. But yeah, China is anything but out friend. Hence my dollars are spent elsewhere whenever I have the opportunity.

Considering that 90+% of all lathes and mills manufactured were made in China/Taiwan its an odd rant.

[CMV]

Found a 7x12 with a lot of upgrades done to it. Comes with the matching HF metal bench/stand, quick change tool post, lots of tooling, spare parts, etc for $500. If it doesn't work out, I figure I can get that back out of it pretty easily. Will go check it out tomorrow.

Owner claims it holds .0005-.001 for him but he does plastic & soft aluminum on it. Harder metals might be a different story...

[Capt. Link.]

I wish we could get good Polish or Czech lathes here at affordable prices. I have used some manual Japanese ones I would take home to.I thought Taiwan was a friend to the US?

[Historian]

I wish we could get good Polish or Czech lathes here at affordable prices. I have used some manual Japanese ones I would take home to.I thought Taiwan was a friend to the US?

Out of curiosity, does anyone have any experience with lathes made
in India? Recently I got a large end mill holder that is of exceptional
quality and accuracy and at least I humorously imagine I am contributing
to India's eventual counterbalance to China in their inevitable
contre temps. Geopolitics still is fun.

[Capt. Link.]

I wish we could get good Polish or Czech lathes here at affordable prices. I have used some manual Japanese ones I would take home to.I thought Taiwan was a friend to the US?

Out of curiosity, does anyone have any experience with lathes made
in India? Recently I got a large end mill holder that is of exceptional
quality and accuracy and at least I humorously imagine I am contributing
to India's eventual counterbalance to China in their inevitable
contre temps. Geopolitics still is fun.

I personally would love to tap into the Indian market the first acquisition I would make would be a 12" Crank Shaper.

[Historian]

Talking about American Iron there is on evilBay [ #310355105669 ]
a South Bend 9" Precision Lathe Model C with Hardwood Stand, Tooling, 110V, 1-PH
that might be considered by the LATHE-comers to the joys
of making chips and spare cash pit.

[mg81]

That 9" is the type of small starter lathe that I was thinking of. But the price is double what I would pay around me. A change gear lathe is not something I would pay a premium for. But if you had enough tooling that lathe could be a good deal compared to a smaller import that would cost the same and not be able to do as much work.

What is nice about the small 9" machines is that they are too small to have seen factory production work. So unless someone was really abusive or neglectful they are normally not worn out.

The bed by the head stock and spindle bearing normally being the things I see most worn out, that matter.

Most other wear can be tolerated on machine that you are learning on. Backlash (slop) in the feeds, loud gears, a worn half nut all can be tolerated and worked around. Most things can be shimmed, spaced, peened into tightness that will work to learn on.

The important thing to remember on a machine that you are learning on is to stop worrying about modifying/rigging them. A 50-80 year old machine that you paid $1,000 is not a collector piece. These machines are one angry owner away from being scrapped and melted into rebar/plumbing pipe/soup cans.

I go crazy when people try to fix these machines to better than factory. Fix the machine well enough to do the job that you want to do. Spending all of your time making the machine look and function like it just left the factory is foolish in my mind. Plenty of shops use some very worn machines to do excellent work, you just have to understand that it is worn and work around those issues.

The "It has to be fixed up to perfection." is the kind of mindset is what keeps people from buying these old, beat up looking machines and just using them as is. Seriously, what is with all of the people that spend all of the time painting their lathe? The damn thing gets covered in oil after your first job, it will not rust. Don't you have some projects that you really want to do instead of wasting your time striping, prepping and painting your tools?

Sorry for the rant, I am getting really far from the original topic.

[sonmtn]

Just wondering if anyone knows of Bolton Lathes
i was looking to move up from my old South Bend and saw one on e bay
13"x40" gear driven Thanks

[CMV]

The few that Bolton has are the same as some that Grizzly has. At first glance it looks like the Bolton ones are a lot cheaper, but Grizzly includes more stuff that Bolton charges extra for - like steady rest, 4-jaw chuck, live center, drill chuck, etc. So you might be able to get the lathe you want with the accessories you want by comparing the same lathe and specing them out from both places. For just the machine & a 3-jaw chuck you'll save a lot with the Bolton. There's other vendors that carry some of the same ones too like micromark, Northern Tool, Lathemaster, etc.

I finally decided on exactly what I want - Precision Matthews PM30MV mill & PM1127VF-LB lathe. Both are made of unobtainium sadly & have lead times of 6+ months. I tried to find the same thing under other names but the Weiss factory stuff from China seems to have much less distribution in the US than the Sieg stuff. A couple places in Canada that may or may not have similar in stock, but freight, tariff, customs, and higher selling price are pretty big turn offs.

Still looking at used stuff, but now that I have that 1.5" spindle bore & power cross feed in my head, I think I'll have a hard time settling & may just have to wait for the PM one to eventually get here.

Looking at what Grizzly has in stock, the G9972Z lathe & G0619 (super X3) mill could work for me. Overall the Grizzly stuff costs a little less, but the value is in the PM stuff considering what I'd get for a few $ more. But their stuff (these 2 items anyway) is ready to ship & could be here in 3-5 days. But after a phone call to customer service I wasn't really impressed and the only thing that seems to justify Grizzly's higher price tags from what I've read is their CS. Their spring sale should be anytime now so since I had a cart full of $4k+ of machines & tooling (not a lot for machine tools, but for what it is, a lot), I didn't want to pull the trigger & then see it for 10% off in a couple weeks. They frequently run sales so I figured I could get them to manually give me a small % off or make an adjustment if/when the spring sale begins assuming it's within a reasonably short time from now. No joy either way. So I'll wait & see what the spring sale ends up being - if it can save me $400 I don't mind waiting a few more weeks.

In the meantime, I'm still playing around on the HF 7x10 I bought off CL. It's so small it gets in its own way, but it's fun for little stuff. I actually like it for what it is. it's really only 8" between centers and if you put a drill chuck in the tailstock you really have no room to do much. But it's cutting T6 al & 316 stainless just fine. If I do my part getting the workpiece set up (and the 3 jaw chuck is poor & takes a lot of fiddling to get down to .002 r/o), the lathe does it's part and makes good clean cuts and holds it tolerance from one end to the other.

I'll ditch the HF lathe when I get something bigger. It came with a very heavy steel machining table that's a nice sized, rock-solid bench which alone was worth what I paid for the whole setup. Came with lots of tooling & spare parts too so I doubt I'll have any trouble getting my $ back out of it.