What tools are needed with the mini lathe?

[Nypto]

OK, I just purchased a 7-14 mini lathe. Now I ...being less than a novice need to know what tools I need to get to build a suppressor.
I understand wood lathing tools but not sure exactly what I need for metal work. I am viewing the videos, and see what I need but do not know what their names are.

I intend to build 4 suppressors

I am fully aware of the BATF forms.

I thought I would ask before I bought all kinds of tools that I may not need, other than safety gear.

I intend to( Practice Practice after I get the stamp) cut my own baffels, perhaps a monocore, barrel threading and end cap threading.
I also understand that I probably will run through lots of metals before I get it where I want it.
I went to a machine shop to ask what tools I needed and they seem to be afraid of guns cuz they said they want nothing to do with building suppressors even tho I explained the Form 1. They would not tell me a thing??
Anyway I really would appreciate the info/help

[twodollarbill]

You can find almost everything you need at the "littlemachineshop.com"
But to limit your search there.....
Start with a quick change tool head for the 7", carbine cutter set, boring bar, threading bar, digital caliper.
Pick up a few extra inserts too.
Start stocking up when you figure out which ones you need.

[Bendersquint]

OK, I just purchased a 7-14 mini lathe. Now I ...being less than a novice need to know what tools I need to get to build a suppressor.
I understand wood lathing tools but not sure exactly what I need for metal work. I am viewing the videos, and see what I need but do not know what their names are.

I intend to build 4 suppressors

I am fully aware of the BATF forms.

I thought I would ask before I bought all kinds of tools that I may not need, other than safety gear.

I intend to( Practice Practice after I get the stamp) cut my own baffels, perhaps a monocore, barrel threading and end cap threading.
I also understand that I probably will run through lots of metals before I get it where I want it.
I went to a machine shop to ask what tools I needed and they seem to be afraid of guns cuz they said they want nothing to do with building suppressors even tho I explained the Form 1. They would not tell me a thing??
Anyway I really would appreciate the info/help

I am sure you are already aware that you can not practice making baffles, or replace baffles or repair baffles(if it means adding material). Once you make a baffle thats it, no changing out materials or remaking etc...there are thousands of things you can make that don't cross the line for practicing and when you are ready, hold your breath and go to town.

You stated that you are making 4 suppressors, you really should have spent a little more money and bought a better lathe, the 7-14 will not do much for what you are hoping. You won't be threading barrels on it(or have a difficult time), you can do aluminum easily but good luck on stainless or anything exotic. What exact model did you buy? Most likely you won't be able to put the barstock through the spindle(a 7-16 has around .75" spindle bore) and you definitely are limited in the rigidity department. You may be able to to do it just fine but it could be painful and full of headaches depending on a number of things happening.

I don't blame the machine shop, if they are unfamiliar independently with the laws some Joe off the street won't convince them that you aren't intending to do something illegal. Way too much risk for them.

Some stuff to start researching.......

Quick Change ToolPost.
Collets.
Chucks.
Indexable Tooling vs. Carbide.
Calipers(digital and analog).
Machinery Handbook.
What materials you want to cut, and post processing(anodizing, heat treating etc...)?
What baffle design are you wanting.

micromark has a bunch of tools that would work well with your machine and some pretty cool accessories that aren't available on some of the larger lathes.

That should give you enough to research for the next month to 3 months.

[bakerjw]

I am a well known proponent of buying as much machine as you can. A mini-lathe, although useful for some work, is really an absolute bare minimum machine for most of the turning operations that you will need to be able to do to effectively build a silencer. You can certainly learn the techniques that will be required but you will also face a lot of frustration in the machine itself.

Bender gives good advice. Heed that.

[jlwilliams]

The mini lathe may not be able to do all you want to do with it, but don't despair just yet.

First things you want to do are to get some tooling for it. Little machine shop is a good place to start. You also want to dig into some of the home machinist sights and publications.

Then you need to practice. As already pointed out, the law says no practice baffles. Suppressor parts are reguated so 'spairs' and 'practice' pieces are not allowed. I know, that bit of law does make it fairly impractical to figure out how to get off the ground. It wasn't made to help. What you can do and should do is make yourself all sorts of tools. When I was in vocational high school most of the student projects were tools, some of which I still use 25 years later. You can learn and practice just about any machining process by incorporating those processes into tools. Look at baffle designs, figure out what you want your baffles to look like. Then look at the design and say 'what can I put that inside countour on?', then make that. You will end up with tap wrenches and reamer handles with recurves and all sorts of groovey shapes on them, and you will learn what you need to.

The machine you have may well not be what you need for all four of your planned suppressors. It is the machine you have. Start with what you have. You can certainly learn a lot with it (not least of what you learn will be that you should get the biggest, best machine you can possably afford and fit into your work space). Once you have your first approved form in hand and a small pile of home made tools on your bench, you can certainly make the first one. Then, with one can down, you will have a firm grasp on the strengths and limitations of your machine and first design. That puts you ready to design another and submit another aplication. Will you make all four cans on this machine? Will you make more? Will you get another machine? I don't know, but I hope you post here to tell us all about it.

Go get 'em.

[Historian]

A steady rest [ if already mentioned sorry, bleary eyed from pulling
an 'all nighter' ]; a milling attachment; most importantly a full-face
safety shield.

[Capt. Link.]

The mini lathe may not be able to do all you want to do with it, but don't despair just yet.

First things you want to do are to get some tooling for it. Little machine shop is a good place to start. You also want to dig into some of the home machinist sights and publications.

Then you need to practice. As already pointed out, the law says no practice baffles. Suppressor parts are reguated so 'spairs' and 'practice' pieces are not allowed. I know, that bit of law does make it fairly impractical to figure out how to get off the ground. It wasn't made to help. What you can do and should do is make yourself all sorts of tools. When I was in vocational high school most of the student projects were tools, some of which I still use 25 years later. You can learn and practice just about any machining process by incorporating those processes into tools. Look at baffle designs, figure out what you want your baffles to look like. Then look at the design and say 'what can I put that inside countour on?', then make that. You will end up with tap wrenches and reamer handles with recurves and all sorts of groovey shapes on them, and you will learn what you need to.

The machine you have may well not be what you need for all four of your planned suppressors. It is the machine you have. Start with what you have. You can certainly learn a lot with it (not least of what you learn will be that you should get the biggest, best machine you can possably afford and fit into your work space). Once you have your first approved form in hand and a small pile of home made tools on your bench, you can certainly make the first one. Then, with one can down, you will have a firm grasp on the strengths and limitations of your machine and first design. That puts you ready to design another and submit another aplication. Will you make all four cans on this machine? Will you make more? Will you get another machine? I don't know, but I hope you post here to tell us all about it.

Go get 'em.

"It is the machine you have."is the quote of the day as cash is a issue I would buy a good bench grinder and HSS tool bits first.Little machines have little power and tooling can make or break your day.LS Starrett makes a students guide to the machinery bible most of what you will need is in that book a good used copy a few bucks.If you are looking for a copy of the bible find a 1940-1950s copy or get one of the AUDEL'S of the same era.The reason is ease of use.The old copy's were designed to make engineer's out of farm boys as that what was needed at the time.Building your own tooling is rock solid advice I still build most of my own and I always will.If you try to cut SS may I suggest 416 I don't think you will be able to but that is one of the easy ones to cut.Good luck.

[Nypto]

Thank you for the replies. They are appreciated. What got me into the mini lathe was a fellow who made one .30 cal with removable end caps on a 7-10 mini lathe. He works for a software co. but has long since transferred to Australia...of all places. haven't been able to get in contact with him.

I bought the red 7 x 14 550W Mini Precision Metal Lathe 2500RPM Variable Speed Mini Lathe 3/4HP

Another question..
I see on ebay, all kinds of metal tubes tubes..fairly cheap..mostly .012 thickness. Is this strong enough?
What wall thickness should work with steel, and SS, and is chrommoly ( I think that is right)OK?

I understand that I cannot "practice" making baffels until I get the stamp back, so practicing afterwhich is fine.What about "brass" for baffels instead of aluminum? Seems like it would handle the heat and pressure better?
I also understand I probably will tear much of my hair out before I get even one working can..part of the fun huh?

Since I was injured (50 percent) in the Military back in the 60's I have plenty of time on hand, and decided this is what I want to do. I have several type 2 weapons and I want suppressors to use as to not bother my neighbors, who are a few hundred yards away..AND the nearest gun range is over 40 miles away. Just too much just to get there.
Lastly my hearing is shot..thank you Vietnam. After shooting my M-14 with muffs my ears ring hollow all day . Hoping Suppressors with muffs will work for me.

Thanks again for the advice and links.

[Bendersquint]

You will need wall thickness of at the least .045 up to .08 depending on caliber and baffle design.

Again material is dependent on baffle design and caliber

NO PRACTICING, regardless if you have a stamp or not. You can not replace or experiment with your baffles, if you cut one and you break it you can not replace it. Everyone complains about this but everyone that has asked the ATF learns that you can not do that, only an 07/02 manufacturer can replace baffles or other parts(except the engraved tube).

Make an ashtray/keytray, a powder funnel for your reloading, Make a set of nesting cones(with no hole), there are thousands of things you can do to practice on without making something that you shouldn't be making. Let us know the design you are using and we can contribute ideas on stuff to practice on.

Some have used brass but I wouldn't ever recommend putting it in a silencer as a baffle, there is a reason that brass isn't used by manufacturers. Aluminum works fine for baffles and spacers in pistol/rimfire cans. Use steel for rifle cans or an exotic material. Need help on deciding what materials to use? Visit commercial manufacturers webpages and look at what materials they are using.

Top performing suppressors don't cause most peoples ears to ring but they do ring after extended use as you can't take away the noise from a centerfire rifle bullet breaking the sound barrier. My dad has bad tinnitus from his service and it causes his ears to ring after shooting around 20 rounds of suppressed supersonic centerfire. Perhaps if you haven't already you should go and check out some commercial cans so you know what the supersonic crack sounds like and if it bothers you.

[Handloader]

I have to disagree tha the 7x14 is too small of a machine to make a suppressor. Albiet the minimum lathe needed. They are great to learn on, and crashing tools is a little less expensive. I have to include that I am NOT a machineist, just a guy with a mini-lathe.

Stainless requires many LIGHT cuts, and takes a quite a while when using a cut off/parting tool. Aluminum cuts great. Make a steady rest that can handle 2in tube stock (just a little welding (think of a stop sign made of square tubing with threaded brass inserts)).

Smaller barrels (<0.75in) can be turned/threaded concentric to the bore with a Spider (SLOWLY).

This will get you started after you get all the needed measuring tools (also include to your list a good indicator with a magnetic base):

http://littlemachineshop.com/products/p ... 1070498684

Additionally, a good tool grinder goes a long way. The smaller lathes work best with razor sharp tools.

A four jaw chuck is a must (the three jaw is only good to about 0.003in, after a light clean-up with a turning tool of your choice).

In no way am I suggesting that I have attempted to make a suppressor on a lathe, but I am awaiting approval on a form-1

[Rangerjoe2]

Nypto,

I feel your pain. I just bought a new 14x40 lathe and a crap load of tooling. I'm researching a .30 cal and .223 design for a build in the future. I'm pretty lucky, my neighbor is a machinist and a former instructor at the local college. The guys over at the home machinist site have been very helpful and the guys on this site seem to be as well. Good luck and if your not sure when it comes to the law, ask, ask, then ask again. I've been LE for 15 plus years and have worked many cases with the Feds, they don't mess around, as they shouldn't.

Joe

[SRM]

Nypto,

I feel your pain. I just bought a new 14x40 lathe and a crap load of tooling. I'm researching a .30 cal and .223 design for a build in the future. I'm pretty lucky, my neighbor is a machinist and a former instructor at the local college. The guys over at the home machinist site have been very helpful and the guys on this site seem to be as well. Good luck and if your not sure when it comes to the law, ask, ask, then ask again. I've been LE for 15 plus years and have worked many cases with the Feds, they don't mess around, as they shouldn't.

Joe

What lathe did you aquire, ifn ya dont mind.

[Nypto]

I bought the Harbor Freight "Central Machinery" 7-14 mini-lathe

I want to thank you all for the help. I now know where to start
Well, first I have to get the permission from my wife whom I must obey.
Seems after 43 years my Wife has turned into my Mother.
All kidding aside, the 7-14 is the best I will ever be able to get, looking
at the accessories I must have just to start.

Curious..
I bought a Tactical 16 can and sent off the Form 1's for the other cans I want to build.
Now, after a month Tactical is still waiting to get permission from the ATF to
ship the can to my dealer. Wonder how long "that" takes? Seems faster for the form 1's
If I had known it would take months just to ship it to my dealer, then months to get the
stamp, I would never had bought the Tactical 16 can.

[Bendersquint]

Curious..
I bought a Tactical 16 can and sent off the Form 1's for the other cans I want to build.
Now, after a month Tactical is still waiting to get permission from the ATF to
ship the can to my dealer. Wonder how long "that" takes? Seems faster for the form 1's
If I had known it would take months just to ship it to my dealer, then months to get the
stamp, I would never had bought the Tactical 16 can.

Form3's generally take 3-4 weeks to be approved.

Of course a Form1 is faster to get approved than buying a can if your dealer doesn't alread have it. It has to be transferred from the manufacturer to the dealer then to you.

Why don't you cancel the order? Its not too late if its still pending transfer, they can cancel the transaction. There are better cans than the TAC16 for the sam price anyways.

[Historian]

One of the old arts before indexable cutter tools were around
was the grinding of one's own tools.

There are many excellent articles on various hobby sites such as Practical Machinist
and YouTube tutorials.

You might want to consider a tool that ancient machinists used to consistently obtain
correct angles. South Bend used to make a holder with rotating index.

A newer version is South Bend Lathe Cutter Tool Bit Holder as seen on EvilBay: #110717144023.
I know that the stars on this site will consider that the equivalent of 'paint by the numbers' canvas
for the beginning artist.

I found for my small lathe that sharpening HSS tools that were given to me when I purchased the lathe
was satisfying not just because it brought back memories of my admiring the machinists of my youth but
I actually got better surface cutting and finish.

For final tool finishing I use a flat, not too expensive, diamond file to get a razor finish.

The only thing left is to hone the mental and dexterity tools that cannot be purchased from a tool catalog.

Best.

[Historian]

I bought the Harbor Freight "Central Machinery" 7-14 mini-lathe

I want to thank you all for the help. I now know where to start
Well, first I have to get the permission from my wife whom I must obey.
Seems after 43 years my Wife has turned into my Mother.
All kidding aside, the 7-14 is the best I will ever be able to get, looking
at the accessories I must have just to start.

Curious..
I bought a Tactical 16 can and sent off the Form 1's for the other cans I want to build.
Now, after a month Tactical is still waiting to get permission from the ATF to
ship the can to my dealer. Wonder how long "that" takes? Seems faster for the form 1's
If I had known it would take months just to ship it to my dealer, then months to get the
stamp, I would never had bought the Tactical 16 can.

Nypto, for us younger guys who have been married for only 42 years our wives are still
our girlfriends whom we continually, starry eyed and embarrassingly nuts about, want to please and it is
reciprocated daily. But thanks for the heads up on what to expect when we get old.


Best.

[Rangerjoe2]

Nypto,

I bought a new Grizzley 14x40 "gunsmith" lathe. I'm really happy with it.

[Bendersquint]

Nypto,

I bought a new Grizzley 14x40 "gunsmith" lathe. I'm really happy with it.

THats only multiple times the cost of what he spent on his mini lathe!

[David Hineline]

The most expensive silencer you will ever own is the low bidder piece of crap you spent a $200 tax on and it does not work well.

You are going to own these items for life and perhaps pass them down to your children, buy the best once and cry never.

[Historian]

The most expensive silencer you will ever own is the low bidder piece of crap you spent a $200 tax on and it does not work well.

You are going to own these items for life and perhaps pass them down to your children, buy the best once and cry never.

+2

No wiser words have ever been spoken, in all aspects of life.

[epicdoom]

NYPTO do a search for upgrades on the HF 7x14 lathe there are lots of things you can do to made that a great littlle lathe. I own one and have installed acme screws in it as well as built better bushings and bearings for it, its not as good as the CNC machines i have run in the past, but it will get the job done if you use some forthought. Do what ever you can to take up as much lash from the moving parts and always start with whatever lash you cant remove in mind. I have turned several precission parts with the little machine including some parts for my motorcycle as well as very tiny parts for micro RC planes and cars.

As for tooling you can go cheaply and get the quick change system Harbor frieght sells they also sell an accesory kit that will give you calipers boring tool and bits as well as lathe dogs and a few other things i cant remember. The only thing i wouldnt buy cheap is cutting bits get good quality carbide cutters ebay is a good source for them as will as the links others have provided. You will need to know how to use the tool to its fullest and to your benifit. example dont bore a hole through solid stock line drill it first then inlarge to needed dimentions. another good thing for these little machines is you can CNC them easily I am working on that now for my lathe and Mill. I could buy whats needed but I like to build my own stuff so im making the components building the drive circuits and writing the programing myself. I build small 6" wingspan airplanes you can fly in your living room and I build them from scratch meaning I build the transmitter and reciever systems, micro brushless motors, props, everything. All need is determination and a good plan and creating things will come easy. If you need any help or information Im happy to help a fellow brother in arms I also do my own sand casting and anodizing so when a part cant be found I can cast, machine and color it if I want.

Good luck Brother
Joe

[m4colt]

The most expensive silencer you will ever own is the low bidder piece of crap you spent a $200 tax on and it does not work well.

You are going to own these items for life and perhaps pass them down to your children, buy the best once and cry never.

+4 and an amen. Don't accept crap ever. Go for quality or just go home.