New Akins Stock

[MPfiveengineer]

Since the stock they come with is garbage, I am designing a new stock for my Akins Accelerator. Here is what I have so far. I was going for a G36C / Stealth Fighter look. I still need to design the top cover (to be bolted on) and VFG rail. The sight will mount on the top of the stock so that it will not move with the action. I am also going to have the VFG rail bolt directly into the accelerator to hopefully give it more rigidity. This stock will be built on a SLS machine so there are no machining limitations, if I can draw it the machine can make it.

I do need some help from you guys. I am going to go the SBR route with a muzzle suppressor (suppressor to be decided) and I am hoping one of you guys has some velocity data for standard velocity ammo VS. barrel length. It would be really nice if I could use standard ammo and keep it subsonic, the barrel in the drawing is 4.5 inches. Also any design changes you guys might suggest are welcome.

[1928A1]

It would be really nice if I could use standard ammo and keep it subsonic, the barrel in the drawing is 4.5 inches.

5 inches generally keeps a CCI Minimag sub

[dieselten]

It would be really nice if I could use standard ammo and keep it subsonic, the barrel in the drawing is 4.5 inches.

5 inches generally keeps a CCI Minimag sub

agreed. however I wouls knock another half inch off to be sure.

you also need to consider what kind of ammo is required to make your gun work. i shot one of these a week ago and it wouldn't work with sub sonic or wally world bulk. it ran like a raped ape with cci mini mags though.

if yours requires mini mags for the utmost reliability, i would make the barrel 4.5".

[MPfiveengineer]

It would be really nice if I could use standard ammo and keep it subsonic, the barrel in the drawing is 4.5 inches.

5 inches generally keeps a CCI Minimag sub

Thanks, does this mean we are friends now? No mention of the "soon to be illegal device", no mention of copying a euro-trash design, no suggestion for me to go have sex with myself. I am impressed.

I think the barrel might need to be < 5 inches. I have a Ruger MKII with what I think is a 5.25 inch barrel that gives me sonic cracks with standard Remington ammo.

Also I was wondering about the twist rate. I saw on Ruger's website that a 10/22 barrel has a 1 in 16 rate but so did their 4 inch barrel MKIII pistol. Therefore I am guessing that I can just turn down a factory 10/22 barrel.

[MPfiveengineer]

agreed. however I wouls knock another half inch off to be sure.

you also need to consider what kind of ammo is required to make your gun work. i shot one of these a week ago and it wouldn't work with sub sonic or wally world bulk. it ran like a raped ape with cci mini mags though.

if yours requires mini mags for the utmost reliability, i would make the barrel 4.5".

I have tried mine with Remington and Federal Bulk packs and CCI Mini-Mags. It seemed to work the best with the Remington and the CCI. I usually run mine with a Norrell integral suppressor that I think is just too heavy for it. That is another reason why I am looking to go SBR with it.

[Fargo]

That looks very cool. I want one.

[[cerberus]]

Agreed, that is a very cool design, very well thought out and a lot of details. looks like a lot of time was spent modeling that.

[silencertalk]

I wonder if a top-cover would make sense to hide the floating action? Also make something that a brass-catcher can snap on to.

[MPfiveengineer]

I wonder if a top-cover would make sense to hide the floating action? Also make something that a brass-catcher can snap on to.

Exactly, and it gets the red dot off the action. I am still working on one. It is going to be a G36C rip-off. The holes you see from the top view are probably going to get brass inserts to bolt the top cover to.

[ArevaloSOCOM]

That looks very cool. I want one.

MAJOR +1

[Artful]

Datz da snizzle - looking gooood

Ya my 5.25 barrel also gets super crack with many High velocity ammo's
I'd suggest 4 inch -

Here are the results collected by Bob Forker. These are muzzle velocities
for barrels of different lengths (determined by cutting the barrel between
test batteries):

Barrel Length___Remington High Velocity__Winchester T22
4 in___________1045 fps_______________1005 fps
8_____________1150__________________1105
12____________1220__________________1155
16____________1240__________________1165
20____________1235__________________1160
24____________1210__________________1140
28____________1170__________________1075

These are from the book Silencer/History and Performance by Allen c. Paulson.
Using a new Ruger 10/22 bbl. and cutting off 2" at a time.
Ammo was Winchester Wildcat 22lr. at 60deg.f

18.5" = 1,229
16.0" = 1,226
14.0" = 1,212
12.0" = 1,197
10.0" = 1,175
8.0" = 1,152
6.0" = 1,088
4.0" = 1,004
2.0" = 794

The 1995 'Shooters Bible' has an article 'Beware the dangers of low-
power ammo' which has a chart on .22 bullet velocity versus barrel
length. They credit D. W. Cochrane, a firearms examiner for the Royal
Canadian Mounted police for the study in 1979.

The chart is for Winchester HV while they say other brands were
included in the study and were the same for practical purposes.

len vel
1 606
2 820
3 940
4 1010
5 1049
6 1087
7 1115
8 1136
9 1158
10 1210
11 1200
12 1200
13 1200
14 1195
15 1205
16 1216
17 1216
18 1212
19 1199
20 1212
21 1237
22 1213

Also Note that Chamber / Bore dimensions can significantly alter velocity between given firearms. IE 10/22 with non-match chamber will have lower velocity than Ruger Mkii Pistol with semi-match chamber vs. Anshutz Match barrel/Chamber all with equal length are not going to have same velocity.

[1928A1]

I have around 35-40,000 rounds down the 5 inch barrel I have. I have gotten about 10-15 supersonic cracks. The muzzle velocity is peak for killing, but just under the SOS (speed of sound).

I had the barrel cut and tested from 8 inches back to 5 with tests every half inch. The velocities were 1056 average with not one over 1065 and not one less than 1025. I have tested nearly every kind of 22 ammo on the market and I would shoot NOTHING but CCI Minimags.

If you are shooting paper, then 4-4.5 inches will do just fine and its all you need.

[1928A1]

Datz da snizzle - looking gooood

Ya my 5.25 barrel also gets super crack with many High velocity ammo's
I'd suggest 4 inch -

Here are the results collected by Bob Forker. These are muzzle velocities
for barrels of different lengths (determined by cutting the barrel between
test batteries):

Barrel Length___Remington High Velocity__Winchester T22
4 in___________1045 fps_______________1005 fps
8_____________1150__________________1105
12____________1220__________________1155
16____________1240__________________1165
20____________1235__________________1160
24____________1210__________________1140
28____________1170__________________1075

These are from the book Silencer/History and Performance by Allen c. Paulson.
Using a new Ruger 10/22 bbl. and cutting off 2" at a time.
Ammo was Winchester Wildcat 22lr. at 60deg.f

18.5" = 1,229
16.0" = 1,226
14.0" = 1,212
12.0" = 1,197
10.0" = 1,175
8.0" = 1,152
6.0" = 1,088
4.0" = 1,004
2.0" = 794

The 1995 'Shooters Bible' has an article 'Beware the dangers of low-
power ammo' which has a chart on .22 bullet velocity versus barrel
length. They credit D. W. Cochrane, a firearms examiner for the Royal
Canadian Mounted police for the study in 1979.

The chart is for Winchester HV while they say other brands were
included in the study and were the same for practical purposes.

len vel
1 606
2 820
3 940
4 1010
5 1049
6 1087
7 1115
8 1136
9 1158
10 1210
11 1200
12 1200
13 1200
14 1195
15 1205
16 1216
17 1216
18 1212
19 1199
20 1212
21 1237
22 1213

Also Note that Chamber / Bore dimensions can significantly alter velocity between given firearms. IE 10/22 with non-match chamber will have lower velocity than Ruger Mkii Pistol with semi-match chamber vs. Anshutz Match barrel/Chamber all with equal length are not going to have same velocity.

Paulson proved that a foot long barrel is really all you need generate max velocity with HV ammo. The stupid law says they have to be over sixteen inches or you need a MG or another tax.

[1928A1]

Thanks, does this mean we are friends now? No mention of the "soon to be illegal device", no mention of copying a euro-trash design, no suggestion for me to go have sex with myself. I am impressed.

I am not your friend, that stupid device will be made illegal, your MP5 is eurotrash and you can go eff yourself.

Just kidding.

[MPfiveengineer]

I used this website

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/sound.html

and got that the speed of sound at sea level is about 1116 fps while at 8000 feet elevation (where I usually shoot) is about 1085. That 31 fps makes a big difference when one is on the borderline.

BTW, thanks for you guys help so far.

[Dan]

have you looked at the evolution stocks? Especially the ones with folders look a lot like your design. http://www.rbprecision.com/id72.htm Maybe you could modify?

I like the idea of it having a lower handguard rail.

Seems like Akins had the right idea at first going with Boyd's but buttler creek was a bad idea. For the money, he should be producing a machined, railed, folding stock with a lifetime warranty...

I hope that you decide to do this project

[MPfiveengineer]

I thought about modifying several designs but I decided I would rather build this stock from scratch. Here is what I have on the top cover, I am not sure that I am happy with it.

[1928A1]

You need a rail system on this thing. The biggest reason why I dislike the 10/22 platform for hunting is you cannot attach anything to it if you needed to.

[MPfiveengineer]

You need a rail system on this thing. The biggest reason why I dislike the 10/22 platform for hunting is you cannot attach anything to it if you needed to.

It will have rails on the top and bottom. Does it need rails on the sides?

[jandbj]

If you build it, I would be very interested in getting one. Then I can switch between the Boyd's wood stock and your g36-like one.

[Artful]

You need a rail system on this thing. The biggest reason why I dislike the 10/22 platform for hunting is you cannot attach anything to it if you needed to.

It will have rails on the top and bottom. Does it need rails on the sides?

It should have option for it - if only the brass Ferrels to screw a standard short rail onto. Are you going to have top rail height work with standard AR removeable sights and mounts? Or are you just going to have that rail on top have built in back up sights that you can affix a scope to as well? Also make sure if you have the extended Magazine in that with forward vertical handgrip installed it won't bump into each other. Ya know the obvious stuff.

That RBPrecison using standard AR stocks does make it versitile.

[jonharoy]

This stock will be built on a SLS machine so there are no machining limitations, if I can draw it the machine can make it.

Are you using a proto shop for your SLS?

[MPfiveengineer]

This stock will be built on a SLS machine so there are no machining limitations, if I can draw it the machine can make it.

Are you using a proto shop for your SLS?

No, I have an SLS at work.

Here is the latest version

[VA3shooter]

That's a nice lookin 10/22 If you offer that for sale I'd have to give some serious thought to buying an Akins

[1928A1]

I don't think you need a rail on the sides, but if you do, make it so the rails can be taken off if somebody doesn't want it. I have no use for siderails and I have been carrying one for 2 years now.