Anyone spent time in the Navy?

[WooD]

I was wondering what these ribbons stand for and if any are combat related.

[CanOfWhooppass]

http://www.public.navy.mil/bupers-npc/s ... Chart.aspx

Ribbons are placed with most important on top. He has a Navy Achievement Medal which are given out at an individual level for a job well done, but could have been for anything. I got one for a tricky repair job on a nuclear submarine. Presidential Unit citation dosnt imply much either. He qualified expert pistol and rifle, but that could be no more ship security stuff. Most the ribbons just show his ship was here or there at some point. Everyone in boot camp during war time gets the national defense ribbon.

Surface Warfare and Air warfare pins means he was probably on a aircraft carrier and show knowledge only, he competed a book and test. Not much need for special warfare guys on a carrier unless they need a ride.

Fancy thing around his neck is just a cerimonial whistle.

He's a bosinsmate 1st class =E6 rank so getting up some rank, but not a big deal yet.

Bosinsmate on ships do all the painting and ropes etc. So probably nothing special, they also could drive the small boats for special opperations.

The odds are slim but he could have had some action, maybe brown water navy, but you can only really know by seeing his discharge papers to see what's listed, especially schools completed. I might get slammed for saying this, but bosinsmate and cooks are the two jobs in the Navy you get with lousy test scores, special warfare guys are sharp so without a seals emblem or bronze star, I would bet against it.

That's not to say his ship didn't launch combat missions with aircraft, missiles etc.

[TROOPER]

Fancy thing around his neck is just a cerimonial whistle.

He's a bosinsmate 1st class =E6 rank so getting up some rank, but not a big deal yet.

That's not to say his ship didn't launch combat missions with aircraft, missiles etc.

I didn't know that was a ceremonial whistle. I'm glad you answered what that was, because I was curious.

I might get slammed for saying this, but bosinsmate and cooks are the two jobs in the Navy you get with lousy test scores, special warfare guys are sharp so without a seals emblem or bronze star, I would bet against it.

That's my understanding as well. However I'd add -- and I'm sure you'll agree -- that doesn't mean he's a bad guy or a dumb guy... some people just don't do well on tests, even if they have a ton of common sense and work ethic. But yes... this has been my understanding as well; that these two jobs have among the lowest, if not the lowest, test score requirements from the ASVAB.

Further agree and add that beyond 'possible' that his ship launched combat missions... in all probability his ship has done exactly that. Does this mean he was part of 'combat'? That's really an opinion discussion... if he's claiming that, then he isn't wrong... it's just hard to point at any one person for a missile launch and say "that guy was in combat", even though there's no doubt that the vessel and its crew have engaged in kinetic activity that directly caused death-and-destruction.

Also, to further expand upon the "Navy Achievement Medal" or "NAM", I've seen a number of guys get that as their end-of-tour award. I don't know what that means as far as that particular medal goes, because in understanding what their job duties were, they were basically GIVEN the NAM as opposed to something outstanding to earn it. I guess it has a lot to do with the write-up on whether or not the COC green-lights it, because I've seen other people at the awards quarters that I know for sure and certain did more during their tour, yet they only got an LOC.

Full-disclosure: I don't have a NAM, I want a NAM, I have NAM-envy. I'm eating sour-grapes because I've seen people around me get NAMs for insignificant BS, whereas my own write-ups have been dismissed.

[TROOPER]

Hey, "Wood", why do you ask? Is this like an extended family member at a barbecue talking about all the awesome stuff he's done, and now you're asking this community if it's true? What's the back-story on this?

Also, how many bronze stars are on that Good-Conduct ribbon? Is it just one? That would put this guy at between 6 and 9 years in, and already an E-6 in a rate with pretty lousy advancement. That's good.

[whiterussian1974]

Bosinsmate on ships do all the painting and ropes etc.

Sounds like "Services" in USAF. They launder towels and clean equipment at Fitness Centers during Peacetime. Pick bodies off the battlefield during Wartime.
It's for people too "slow" to be a cook. Cooks need to be able to count how many cans of something go into the soup.

[WooD]

Hey, "Wood", why do you ask? Is this like an extended family member at a barbecue talking about all the awesome stuff he's done, and now you're asking this community if it's true? What's the back-story on this?

Also, how many bronze stars are on that Good-Conduct ribbon? Is it just one? That would put this guy at between 6 and 9 years in, and already an E-6 in a rate with pretty lousy advancement. That's good.

He's some dude that rides with a few of us. Was sitting around drinking one night and he was telling me he'd spent 9 years in the Navy. I asked him if he did Seal type stuff, and he said he had volunteered for a lot of stupid s--t he should have never done.

He told me later that he was a boatswain...that's what he called it anyhow, so I guess he volunteered to paint some dangerous parts of the ship he was on.

So basically the chances of this dude doing any type of ground combat would be out of the question?

[whiterussian1974]

He told me later that he was a boatswain...that's what he called it anyhow, so I guess he volunteered to paint some dangerous parts of the ship he was on.

So basically the chances of this dude doing any type of ground combat would be out of the question?

Boatswain and "Bosun" are interchangable terms. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boatswain#Job_description

He may have volunteered for some crazy stuff landside, but it would be totally outside of his normal duties.

[Traxxx]

Call it a crazy idea or something, but why not ask him?

[TROOPER]

So basically the chances of this dude doing any type of ground combat would be out of the question?

Ground combat? That's out-of-the-question. Total BS.

The Marines are the Navy's extension of force on land, and while it is true that very few select Navy units do ground-work -- SWCC and SEALs come to mind... possibly SeaBees (if sht goes way wrong)-- this guy never did any such thing.

Here are some oddball caveats: CTIs, CTRs, and to a lesser extent CTNs may sometimes be farmed-out to 'kinetic' units -- and even sometimes to other branches, because they have a skill-set that those door-kickers and FOBs would want, but a deck-hand? A Bosun's-Mate? What the hell would a door-kicker in Iraq want with someone who can paint or work with mooring lines? Oh, Navy Corpsmen also sometimes get assigned to a Marine unit and may end up seeing some combat.

... but a BM1? How does that make a shred of sense?

[CanOfWhooppass]

"getting volunteered" means taking people who know a job to a place where there is a need. They just don't take volunteers to go be part of a unit that relies upon teamwork like a special ops boat unit. Also, commands send top people so the process is far more selection than choice.

BS is a huge part of the military. The level of exaduration and flat out fabrication is bewildering, even among actual operators with no need to do either. If he talks smack again, I'd let it go, it's part of a long tradition. If it really bugs you tell him you would love to see some pictures from his schools and units. Every class I went to had a graduation picture.

[WooD]

Call it a crazy idea or something, but why not ask him?

I did ask him....and he said he had volunteered for a lot of stupid s--t he should have never done.

Thanks for the info everyone, I kinda figured it was BS, he lied about being a certified Harley tech too. I found that out the hard way.

[TROOPER]

I'd further add that some of the folks I work around that have IAs to the Middle East usually end up getting an Expeditionary warfare device. The prestige associated with that pin is much higher than with the Surface pin. The lack of an expeditionary warfare pin in no way indicates that he doesn't have one since his current command or platform probably wants their domain displayed. Also, if he simply didn't get one, that doesn't mean he didn't do ground-work, or support a unit that did ground-work... but it's much less likely that he did actual ground-work.

Like "can-of-whoopass' said; what is your objective, and why is it your objective? Call him out? Why? Let it go? Why? It's just a thing that happens... people want to appear to be important or special.

But here's a sea-story:

USS Toledo, 2012, there's supposed to be a field-day later, and it falls right in the middle of my rack-time. In preparation for this, when I'm done with watch, I plan to shower and hit the rack as quickly as possible so I can get ~3 1/2 hours before we get racked-out. I haul ass to the shower and place my non-shower toiletries on the little shelf beneath the mirror just outside of the shower. Shower quick, get out, and there's a guy -- 100% naked -- brushing his teeth at that particular sink. He and I are the only two in the head, and there's three empty sinks to his right... there is no reason for him to use that sink except to force some kind of social interaction.

I awkwardly reach past him to retrieve my deodorant and toothpaste/toothbrush... no words. I finish and leave and get to that rack lickety-split. Side-note: spooning with a Tomahawk Cruise Missile is incredibly relaxing. It's kind of the perk of berthing down in the torpedo room... the downside is that, at least on the Toledo, you're constantly getting whiffs of the sans-tank. Oh, that and people fkn grunt when they work out just outside of your rack. (wtf?!)

Anyway, 0000 appears, and the 1MC pipes up that we are going to field day. I don't know why this is, but we always stand around for ~20 minutes before we actually get started. Anyway, for no reason what-so-ever, I spontaneously remember my deodorant. I frantically check under the rack, but it isn't there. I haul ass to the head where one guy has already started cleaning, hoping that it would be on that little shelf still... but no luck.

I'm contemplating the next 10 days without deoderant before we (the DSE team) disembark, and my face must've looked sad, because cleaning-guy says, "What's the problem?" I explain that I left my deodorant on the shelf, and that it's now gone. He says someone probably just threw it away - which makes sense, because the 2012 Toledo crew had an alarming number of people hostile to DSE teams, and throwing away toiletries sounds like just the petty nonsense they'd do; which is weird, because NO BODY wins when someone isn't wearing deodorant. Anyway, hope springs eternal, and I thrust my hand into the waste-bin and feel around like an idiot. I pull out some tighty-whities which -- and this still makes me laugh -- someone has 'sneezed on'. I kid you not, I sat there in such a profound state of deep denial that I actually wondered why someone would strip off their underwear just to sneeze on them.

Sweet denial can't last forever. Eventually I had to wash my hands vigorously for several minutes all while trying to not acknowledge what was actually on my the webbing of my hand between thumb and fore-finger.

Eventually I sadly went back to my rack -- no deodorant -- and checked under there again, hoping against all odds that I just hadn't seen it the first go-around? Then I brilliantly deduce that maybe I had put it in between the mattress and rack lid. So I seize that hateful mattress and look... and see a creased vagina staring at me?

I'd seen that vagina before: while taking a dump in the First-Class head. The porno-mag would just sit there on the pile of toilet paper, pages inevitably falling open to the most viewed 'spread'. Usually I'm trying to push out the non-fibrous food while looking anywhere but at that porno-mag since I fervently believe that pooping-is-pooping... jacking-is-jacking... and that these two activities belong in different universes.

... but there it is all-the-same, that hairy 2005 October vagina, staring up at me from under the mattress. Turns out that my rack-mate, Seaman "X", has stolen the first-class head porno and has been rack-jacking in our rack.

This distresses me mightily, because the next time I'm supposed to be sleeping, I can't help but wonder if there's going to be an unexpected *drip* on me.

Also, I never found the deodorant.

It was a disappointing day on many levels. Oh, and the goddamn menu was a lie: fried-chicken? BULLSHIT! We had some amalgam of reconstituted pasta and pancake syrup.

Now to be fair, the next day we had corn-dogs, and they rationed the first part of that meal so heavily that the back-portion could eat as much as they wanted, so I had 5 corn-dogs and gave 0 apologies. Also, a different guy on the DSE team had a spare Axe Deodorant, which he gave me. Double bonus: when we got off in Fujirah, I had the best shawarma I've ever had... and I didn't think any shawarma was going to beat that street-vendor in Dubai.

Look at this hog; it was about twice the size of a 12-ounce can of soda

[Capt. Link.]

I don't want to rock the boat but this guy has been around and worked hard for all that confetti.You may notice that top pin they don't hand them out.Boats often get a bum rap and looked down upon by the twigits & snipes.You don't have to wear a trident to see land combat either.I have known many boats and cooks and to tell the truth I liked more of them than the snobs that looked down upon them.
CL-USN

[CanOfWhooppass]

http://www.vulture.com/2015/01/real-ame ... -lies.html

BS is just part of the culture. The list of real deals who are full of it is a mile long and those are the ones people emulate.

Just saying!

[TROOPER]

I don't want to rock the boat but this guy has been around and worked hard for all that confetti.You may notice that top pin they don't hand them out.Boats often get a bum rap and looked down upon by the twigits & snipes.You don't have to wear a trident to see land combat either.I have known many boats and cooks and to tell the truth I liked more of them than the snobs that looked down upon them.
CL-USN

This was covered: that the boat(s) he has been on has/have likely been 'in combat'. Whether that means that he himself was "in combat" is a philosophical and opinion discussion. As I said, if his boat launches a missile in Libya or Iraqi Freedom during "Shock-and-Awe", then his boat -- and its crew -- engaged in kinetic combat. I don't dispute that portion at all.

However, the portion where this guy did "ground combat", as in he put on some digi-camo, had a rucksack and 800 rounds of ammunition, ate MREs, and "humped for 12 clicks" before engaging in a small-arms fire-fight with the Taliban.... No. Just no. As pointed out, the Navy really doesn't do that, and when it needs to do that, it uses its ground-extension: The Marines. As also pointed out, there are exceptions such as SEALs and SWCC... an HM assigned to a Marine unit... or possibly some of the rates that get farmed out a lot due to specialized, cross-over skill-sets, such as linguists or CTRs. A number of my own immediate co-workers (I am active duty Navy) have been loaned out to the Army, or were stationed at Army FOBs. They didn't go because the Army needs another rifle-man, so those guys had limited opportunities to pick up a rifle and shoot at someone, although it did happen from time-to-time.

But a bosun's mate? The Army has no need to request Navy assistance for that skill-set, and if they did, they wouldn't be in combat situations.

As also pointed out, being a Bosun's mate doesn't mean he's a bad guy, or a dumb guy, so I certainly wasn't dogging on him due to his rate or rank.

However I'd add -- and I'm sure you'll agree -- that doesn't mean he's a bad guy or a dumb guy... some people just don't do well on tests, even if they have a ton of common sense and work ethic.

But ground-combat? No. That's not reality. And this guy was being vague because it didn't happen.

Finally, I've been part of a number of DSE teams, and while the platform doesn't want to be too easy, they also don't want to be too difficult: and I've seen them basically throw that surface-warfare pin at members of the team. Or look at it this way: what looks better on a brag-sheet? "Facilitated the qualification of four members of Direct Support Element" .... or.... "None of the DSE team were able to meet the stringent standards of Petty Officer 'X'."

[WooD]

I don't want to rock the boat but this guy has been around and worked hard for all that confetti.You may notice that top pin they don't hand them out.Boats often get a bum rap and looked down upon by the twigits & snipes.You don't have to wear a trident to see land combat either.I have known many boats and cooks and to tell the truth I liked more of them than the snobs that looked down upon them.
CL-USN

This was covered: that the boat(s) he has been on has/have likely been 'in combat'. Whether that means that he himself was "in combat" is a philosophical and opinion discussion. As I said, if his boat launches a missile in Libya or Iraqi Freedom during "Shock-and-Awe", then his boat -- and its crew -- engaged in kinetic combat. I don't dispute that portion at all.

However, the portion where this guy did "ground combat", as in he put on some digi-camo, had a rucksack and 800 rounds of ammunition, ate MREs, and "humped for 12 clicks" before engaging in a small-arms fire-fight with the Taliban.... No. Just no. As pointed out, the Navy really doesn't do that, and when it needs to do that, it uses its ground-extension: The Marines. As also pointed out, there are exceptions such as SEALs and SWCC... an HM assigned to a Marine unit... or possibly some of the rates that get farmed out a lot due to specialized, cross-over skill-sets, such as linguists or CTRs. A number of my own immediate co-workers (I am active duty Navy) have been loaned out to the Army, or were stationed at Army FOBs. They didn't go because the Army needs another rifle-man, so those guys had limited opportunities to pick up a rifle and shoot at someone, although it did happen from time-to-time.

But a bosun's mate? The Army has no need to request Navy assistance for that skill-set, and if they did, they wouldn't be in combat situations.

As also pointed out, being a Bosun's mate doesn't mean he's a bad guy, or a dumb guy, so I certainly wasn't dogging on him due to his rate or rank.

However I'd add -- and I'm sure you'll agree -- that doesn't mean he's a bad guy or a dumb guy... some people just don't do well on tests, even if they have a ton of common sense and work ethic.

But ground-combat? No. That's not reality. And this guy was being vague because it didn't happen.

Finally, I've been part of a number of DSE teams, and while the platform doesn't want to be too easy, they also don't want to be too difficult: and I've seen them basically throw that surface-warfare pin at members of the team. Or look at it this way: what looks better on a brag-sheet? "Facilitated the qualification of four members of Direct Support Element" .... or.... "None of the DSE team were able to meet the stringent standards of Petty Officer 'X'."

You and your knowledge have been most helpful.

Thanks!

[stengun]

Howdy,

Just my opinion based on being in both the AF and the Navy:

No Army 11B style combat.

Engineman rating are the ones that drive the boats for Seal teams and UDTs not BM.

To make it to E-6 in the boatswain's rating in less than 9 years means he was a pretty good butt kisser.

His ribbons come from being on a ship that did something or were given to him because he was a pretty good butt kisser.

Here's a Sea Story:

Without going into details that I can never prove happened in a billion years, while in the Navy I did something and was award a Letter of Commendation and a "medal' from a non-DoD gov't agency but the LOC and medal where sent to my Command to be presented to an unknown service member.

Did I get the LOC and medal added to my service record? Nope.

The brown nosing little weasel that worked in the Command's office get the LOC and metal? Yep. Then he got to use it as "proof" he was CWO matail so he be selected as a CWO.

28 years later it still pisses me off.

Just my $.02.

Paul

[TROOPER]

That's kind of a thing with the military (or at least my own limited experience): from the outside, a person might think that honest, smart, polite hard-workers are assured promotion... and that less-than-ideal service-members are weeded out. This isn't the case.

Don't misunderstand me: positive traits are correlated with advancement... it's just that the correlation isn't as strong as you'd think it would be. Being very good at what you do is in no way a guarantee of promotion. And sadly, on the other side of that, there can be lazy or stupid or rude or pick-a-trait, and they do get promoted from time-to-time.... and they don't get weeded out.

I had a shipmate who was always late, always fraternized, just flat wasn't useful, and nothing ever came of it. The thing is, there's a lot of mobility. The chain-of-command is ALWAYS changing, and often, superiors aren't exposed to the problem often enough to understand that it's a result of a personality trait as opposed to a one-time-thing. And, quite often, when the middle-higher-ups do figure out that "sailor X" sucks, they just wait it out... because either they're going to be leaving soon, or the dirt-bag sailor will be leaving soon... and nobody wants to put that mark in the record.

I went to a training class with an E-8 who was fantastic: funny, smart, humble, but a confident leader... just the total-package. I commented at one point that i wished he was in my chain-of-command, to which a different guy responded, "No, he's great here, but he's no fun to work with: he'll write you up for being late just one time." As this was said in front of the E-8, I looked at him and he nodded and said, "Too often the chain let's that slide, and when someone finally gets mad enough to do something about it because it's an actual problem, they have to wait another five times because there has to be a paper trail. I write them up on the first time... and if it really is a one-time thing, that write-up goes away.... it doesn't mean anything. But if it is a pattern of behavior, then it starts the ball rolling on actually addressing the issue."

Mother of God... I've never had a bigger man-crush in my entire life. Because what that other sailor didn't understand was that for the people who show up on time and do their work... lazy, late, a**holes are the BANE of our existence. No BS; those same lazy, late, a**holes hurt retention, because when I think about if I want to continue working in the military two years from now, I'm going to think back on the people I had to carry, which the chain-of-command never did ANYTHING about... and they KNEW it was a problem!

I'm not dogging on the military -- really, I'm not. But for people who haven't been in... Look; before I was in, I thought he military was made up of people who wanted to do well at whatever task they had to do, wanted to serve their country, and wanted to be part of a group of like-minded people.

There are people in the military who are like that... but they are NOT the majority. The military is made of up of the same population that it comes from, and will have smart people and dumb people... nice people and rude people... hard-workers and lazy. And this is key: the system is not good at separating these groups out.

I'm too old to had have learned that lesson when I did, but... better late than never, I guess... and it sure was a sad day to come to grips with that realization.

[Capt. Link.]

I loved my time in service but some individuals also made it a time in hell.We called these defects "lifers" as they could never hold any position on the outside and sucked the life out of their subordinates.
Upon the decommissioning of my first ship I witnessed the Capt give a letter of accommodation to my LPO for his spectacular work in keeping a piece of navigational equipment in good repair on the last deployment.This moron did not even have the prerequisite schools to even maintain it and never even touched it. I did as it was my job and was the only one who had the training to work on it.What did I get other than a hard time from this dope headed looser you guessed it zip.
I will always have a place in my heart for the good hard working sailor and the Navy in general but wished some of theses men were fed to the fishes.
-CL

[stengun]

Howdy CL,

I feel your pain Brother!

There isn't much worse than being an PO3 with 3 years service that has his s--t together that has to work for an E-5 with 15 years that's a total rock. I wanted to toss this idiot down a ladder so bad.

I also worked for another E-5 that was also a 15 year man that was a great guy, heck of a worker, etc but sucked at taking test so he was kinda stuck as an E-5. The Navy told him he had to make E-6 before his enlistment was up or they were going to deny his reelistment.

I spent a big part a couple of hours a day, usually while on watch, helping him study for his E-6 exam, which he passed. He was allowed to reup for 4 more years which allowed him to hit the 20 year mark.

Paul

[Capt. Link.]

Paul all I can say is thank God for the men who serve and God dam the ones who abuse the privilege of service.

[stengun]

Howdy,

Amen to that!

When I was young like HS age Inthought it was every young man's duty to Serve but after being in the Air Force and the Navy I have since changed my mind and realize that it's not for everybody and some people have no business being in the military.

We usually called the dead beats "No Loads". If you've ever been around a screw type air compressor you'll know what I'm talking about.

What really ticks me off is all the fakes and posers that you run into at the LGS, gun shows and gun forums.

A few years ago I was at a gun show in Dallas, Tx and the was a gunsmith there selling his version of the M40A1 sniper rifle and there was a "customer" talking to him and bragging about his experiences as a Army sniper.

The sniper was wearing the old woodland BDU shirt, jeans blouses at the top of his jump boots. He was outfitted with his name, rank ( Major ), w/ airborne, Ranger and sniper patches.

Later listening to the Major for a few minutes I told the gunsmith not to listen to him because he was lying.

Major got all pissy and started to demand an apology but I cut him off by saying "Dude! We went to school together. I've known you since the 4th grade and you never Served much less being a Major or a sniper in the Army."

At this point I pulled out my VA ID card and showed it to the gunsmith. The Major looked down at his boots then split as fast as he could.

Paul

[Capt. Link.]

I got a friend who was a door gunner during Vietnam.He never left the USA and never lied about his job and if asked would tell you where he was stationed.He never lied but many had the wrong impression.I served and have the scars to prove it.I'm also a retired gunsmith and chuckle at some of these wannabees around here.
I figured in your story the jig was up for the Major if he said he was trained on the M-40.

[stengun]

Howdy CL,

He never claimed to have used a M40, but while I was flying on C-130s going to Central America he was working in the kids cloths section at Walmart.

He did have a pretty believable "story" and had done a lot of research about being a sniper. He got a lot of info from several of us from HS that actually Served.

I too have scars, can't hear crap out of my left ear and would someone stop torturing all the freakin' crickets!

Plus I get a nice check from the VA every month but I would give it all back with interest if the pain would stop and I could hear things except for the pissed off crickets.

Paul