Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Discuss anything with like-minded people.
No posting of copyrighted material.

Moderators: mpallett, bakerjw, renegade, Hush

User avatar
hedonistic
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 1614
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2007 1:24 am
Location: Mormonville, USA

Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by hedonistic » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:07 am

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=14319284

I told them I am not spending a dime there
Islam is an intolerant, oppressive, social, political, governmental institution that preaches hatred and murder it was created by a man who married a six year old child.

User avatar
Twinsen
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 7693
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:34 pm
Location: AZ

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by Twinsen » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:16 am

Any big company would do that. Not saying you can't avoid big companies. It can be difficult though.

User avatar
lilfuzzybuny
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 688
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:07 pm
Location: west virginia
Contact:

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by lilfuzzybuny » Thu Feb 10, 2011 5:22 am

i've worked for walmart and they told us the same thing dont bother stopping them yell at them maybe but dont bother stopping them. im not going to risk my life or anyone elses for a pos mic product. of course losses affect year end bonuses but the mangers screwed that for us anyway
smooth is learned, fast is practiced, precision is earned.

User avatar
TROOPER
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 7440
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 2:24 pm
Location: Augusta, Georgia

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by TROOPER » Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:57 am

I have to be honest with you, the day a manager fires me for something like that is the same day he/she doesn't get to go home. Their face can join the sad little montage of black-and-whites that welcome you into Wal-Mart. If I am feeling generous - if - then I won't set fire to their home while they sleep and then twist a blade in their guts when they stumble out, half-choking, half-asleep, and completely fucked - courtesty of the one who defended himself once.

700PSS
Elite Member
Posts: 6266
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:36 am

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by 700PSS » Thu Feb 10, 2011 12:53 pm

25% of violent attacks occur when the victim is between home and work, during 6 AM-6 PM. If you become a victim because you were unable to defend yourself due to Wal Mart's policy, provided you survive, then sue them for forcing you to be an unarmed victim and failing to provide for your security, for which they’ve now assumed responsibility. Beyond that…"Don't ask. Don't tell." It's not just for gays in the military. :wink:

User avatar
lilfuzzybuny
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 688
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:07 pm
Location: west virginia
Contact:

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by lilfuzzybuny » Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:11 pm

the good thing is they have a million dollar life insurance policy if anyone dies on the premissis employee or customer of course there are restrictions and they'd do a number to refuse payout but its a mill so go figure
smooth is learned, fast is practiced, precision is earned.

brianb
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 623
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2006 10:41 pm
Location: Oregon

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by brianb » Thu Feb 10, 2011 1:57 pm

It would be one thing to let a fleeing suspect with a weapon to just leave, but if they're trying to get THROUGH you, isn't that a different deal? This isn't about a guy just trying to leave is it, really? He pulled a gun on loss prevention after they had him in their custody in their office and they were between him and the door - and they were between him and the customers. Then it becomes a matter of letting him get to where the customers are. One would think that if they let him out, and he shoots up the store and civilians are hit, Walfart is going to be owned by the customers...

So (1), its a matter of self-defense on the employees' part (Loss Prevention - who should have some modicum of training in this area, eh?) , and (2) safeguarding customers' exposure to a REAL threat, which is a desperate GUNMAN (not a frickin' shoplifter).

The way I see it, the company owes these guys big time for stopping this creep and ending a big liability situation. The black and white language of the policy and the mindless idiots (henceforth refereed to properly as idjits) who both instituted it and enforced it afterwards deserves some serious legal scrutiny and punishment by some savvy lawyer types with money hungry eyes (never really thought I'd be in favor of that, honestly).

brianb
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 623
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2006 10:41 pm
Location: Oregon

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by brianb » Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:00 pm

lilfuzzybuny wrote:the good thing is they have a million dollar life insurance policy if anyone dies on the premissis employee or customer of course there are restrictions and they'd do a number to refuse payout but its a mill so go figure
Yeah. So, you're willing to die to collect? Go for it.

Or did I miss the sarcasm?

User avatar
Blaubart
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 4962
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:22 pm
Location: Bozeman, MT

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by Blaubart » Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:14 pm

So, according to the policy, they were simply supposed to comply with the demands of the guy holding the gun.

I can understand that. Despite the fact that the people found themselves in a good position to disarm the guy before he went back out into the sea of customers only to be confronted by the police at the door. If that happened, I can almost guarantee it would have been suicide by police. The would have been great for PR. But hey, policy is policy and it probably would have been safer for the employees involved to simply let the guy go.

That being said, what if the gunman demanded to be led to the office of the store manager? I'm thinking they would be looking for a job despite complying with company policy.

In the end, Wal-Mart did them a favor. Wal-Mart is the suckiest place to be a customer and it's even worse to work there from everything I've heard...
"And by the way, if you're gonna take up a hobby of letter writing, you might want to learn how to spell "writing" you stupid F--k." - Nighthawk re kwikrnu

700PSS
Elite Member
Posts: 6266
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:36 am

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by 700PSS » Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:15 pm

How often do victims get killed by armed robbers, despite fully complying with the robber's demands? It happens all too frequently around Metro Atlanta. They kill the victims, even AFTER the victims have complied and given the robbers what they demanded.

So my question is...Do you feel lucky? I mean, how many times can you afford to be wrong? You cannot rely on the mercy of a savage to ensure you live through a deadly encounter.

User avatar
lilfuzzybuny
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 688
Joined: Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:07 pm
Location: west virginia
Contact:

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by lilfuzzybuny » Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:08 pm

brianb wrote:
lilfuzzybuny wrote:the good thing is they have a million dollar life insurance policy if anyone dies on the premissis employee or customer of course there are restrictions and they'd do a number to refuse payout but its a mill so go figure
Yeah. So, you're willing to die to collect? Go for it.

Or did I miss the sarcasm?
well i typed that with only have 2 hours of sleep to cover the 30 hours or so since ive been awake
but i guess i meant to make that more sarcastic but tis ish the interwebs go figure :lol:
smooth is learned, fast is practiced, precision is earned.

brianb
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 623
Joined: Sat Sep 30, 2006 10:41 pm
Location: Oregon

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by brianb » Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:07 pm

700PSS wrote:How often do victims get killed by armed robbers, despite fully complying with the robber's demands? It happens all too frequently around Metro Atlanta. They kill the victims, even AFTER the victims have complied and given the robbers what they demanded.

So my question is...Do you feel lucky? I mean, how many times can you afford to be wrong? You cannot rely on the mercy of a savage to ensure you live through a deadly encounter.
Damn 700PSS - right on! that's exactly on point. If you're going to let them dictate how you're going to risk your life based upon some "policy"... sucks to be "you" then. It's a no-win working there. Libertard policies abound.

700PSS
Elite Member
Posts: 6266
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:36 am

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by 700PSS » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:57 pm

I believe that most such corporate anti-defense polices are predicated on the assumption that most people use weapons for criminal OFFENSE, rather than DEFENSE against criminals and thus, they assume the approved presence of weapons is the greater of the two liabilities they can choose.

Ultimately, the business expects to not incur a loss if something goes wrong. That is, YOU will be the one to incur a loss as YOU are the victim. Life goes on for the business. You can be replaced. The business can afford to be wrong on this. You cannot.

User avatar
continuity
Elite Member
Posts: 4554
Joined: Thu Dec 11, 2008 8:39 am
Location: Ohio

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by continuity » Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:31 am

Interestingly enough, the concept of being a sheeple is what, at least one other large corp., expects. My nutcase neighbor says that in his interations with E.I.Dupont, they counsel they're "subjects" to comply with airline hijackers directions without any question.

My nutcase neghbor is quite the connected person.
What amount of a man is composed of his own collection of experiences... and the conclusions that those experiences have allowed him to "know" for certain as "Truth"? :Ick

solitary.phoenix
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 567
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 2:52 pm

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by solitary.phoenix » Sat Feb 12, 2011 1:10 am

TROOPER wrote:I have to be honest with you, the day a manager fires me for something like that is the same day he/she doesn't get to go home. Their face can join the sad little montage of black-and-whites that welcome you into Wal-Mart. If I am feeling generous - if - then I won't set fire to their home while they sleep and then twist a blade in their guts when they stumble out, half-choking, half-asleep, and completely fucked - courtesty of the one who defended himself once.
No, really man. We want to know how you feel about this. Don't be shy.

User avatar
silencertalk
Site Admin
Posts: 33985
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:31 am
Location: USA

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by silencertalk » Sat Feb 12, 2011 10:00 am

Why did the state let him plea simple robbery?

User avatar
hedonistic
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 1614
Joined: Tue Jan 02, 2007 1:24 am
Location: Mormonville, USA

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by hedonistic » Mon Feb 14, 2011 1:00 pm

silencertalk wrote:Why did the state let him plea simple robbery?
Because I am not in Texas and in this over taxed state the bus service comes before the scales of justice.
Islam is an intolerant, oppressive, social, political, governmental institution that preaches hatred and murder it was created by a man who married a six year old child.

User avatar
smcharchan
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 2268
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2007 8:06 am
Location: VA

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by smcharchan » Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:04 pm

I attribute much of this "you should cower and let the professionals handle it" to the popular 1980's mantra of "tell the bad guy to 'take it all, but please don't hurt me!'".

I'm not saying that we should all be vigilantes, but anyone who does not stand up to criminal activity sends a clear message to criminals: they do not have to fear that people will stand up to them.

User avatar
jppd47
Silencertalk Goon Squad
Posts: 1305
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:20 pm
Location: CT
Contact:

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by jppd47 » Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:38 pm

Bank employees are trained to do exactly that. Just do as asked. Is it wrong?
pro-gun gun owners are a minority.
Fair Use applies (U.S. Code Title 17 Chapter 1 Subsection 107)

User avatar
TROOPER
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 7440
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 2:24 pm
Location: Augusta, Georgia

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by TROOPER » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:04 pm

jppd47 wrote:Bank employees are trained to do exactly that. Just do as asked. Is it wrong?
Only you know what is wrong and what isn't based on the infinite number of subtle variables that play in any given criminal situation. If that moment comes and I fervently believe that my death is imminent and absolute, then company policy is for living people only, and not for people in-transition. Priorities change fast, and while I can appreciate the store policy for what it is, it simply doen't apply in every instance.

Logically, from the flip-side of this? If the company policy was that all bank clerks (or Wal-Mart employees) resist all crime by all means possible, how enforceable would that be?

Really, businesses are in a no-win situation on this one. That said, firing a man for defending himself... what the hell? Like if he hadn't defended himself perhaps they could retain the robbers future business? It makes no sense. And I condemn every single person who was in the chain on that decision and thought that surely someone else would make the courageous stand so they wouldn't have to.

User avatar
jppd47
Silencertalk Goon Squad
Posts: 1305
Joined: Thu May 22, 2008 11:20 pm
Location: CT
Contact:

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by jppd47 » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:31 pm

agreed
pro-gun gun owners are a minority.
Fair Use applies (U.S. Code Title 17 Chapter 1 Subsection 107)

User avatar
Blaubart
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 4962
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 2:22 pm
Location: Bozeman, MT

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by Blaubart » Tue Feb 15, 2011 11:31 am

The best store/bank policy would make it clear that company property is fully insured and isn't worth dying over and to practice de-escalation techniques whenever possible. If the situation deteriorates to the point where you feel that the bad guy is going to kill you regardless of whether or not you fulfill their demands, then you do what you have to do to defend yourself and the company will stand behind you 100%
"And by the way, if you're gonna take up a hobby of letter writing, you might want to learn how to spell "writing" you stupid F--k." - Nighthawk re kwikrnu

User avatar
SuperTige
Senior Silent Operator
Posts: 109
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:13 pm
Location: Northern AZ

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by SuperTige » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:52 am

Interesting story - frustrating. I understand the liability issue to the business and the point they want to make.

However, at which point is it established that the employees were defending themselves and their peers to preserve their certainty of life...who give a F--k about company policy in that situation?! If either me or my co-workers (incidentally most of which are my close friends) were confronted by some crack-head, gun wielding shoplifter, I can guarantee with a more than reasonable degree of certainty that his bitch ass is gonna' get owned.

Whatever the company decides to do with me from there is their decision, but I'm not going to let that block my sight of what the "right" course of action is!
~ST
I do what I do best; I take scores. You do what you do best; try to stop guys like me.

solitary.phoenix
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 567
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 2:52 pm

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by solitary.phoenix » Wed Feb 16, 2011 12:56 am

If you lost your wal-mart job as a result of defending yourself and others then I'm sure there are some decent law enforcement agencies around that would pick you up, give you better pay and better benefits. Consider it a present given in ugly giftwrapping.

User avatar
Maser
Silent But Deadly
Posts: 1101
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2008 9:45 pm
Location: Mysterious Cities of Gold
Contact:

Re: Can't defend yourself if you work at Walmart

Post by Maser » Wed Feb 16, 2011 1:53 am

Don't like a store policy then don't work there. Problem solved.
My intelligence is like a suppressed rimfire pistol. You may not be able to hear it, but it certainly always hits its mark.

Post Reply