Silver

[Blaubart]

I just finished reading Survivors by James Wesley Rawles. In it (of course) he not only espouses the value of silver as a SHTF currency, but as a good way to stand your ground against inflation.

Silver prices are currently about $32/oz. A year or two ago, it was almost $50/oz. But ten years ago, it was around $5/oz. While $32/oz is a good price compared to $50/oz, I have a real hard time buying it for 6x what it was 10 years ago...

When you look at 50 year historical graphs of silver prices that are adjusted for inflation, there have only been 4 very brief spikes where silver was over $32/oz.

What are you guys' thougts? Is anyone buying silver right now? Is it because you're expecting it to go higher, or simply to be prepared? I have some silver (about $10 in pre-1965 coins), but that's not enough to really consider an investment or being prepared by any means. Right now I'm probably too heavily invested in lead, brass and copper. (Which eventually became more precious than silver in the book) Perhaps it's time to diversify?

[doubloon]

I heard China is gobbling up copper.

Mostly I've been staying out of precious metals and just buying copper and lead.

[Blaubart]

Same here, but it would be nice to have something a little more portable than 2,500 lbs of ammo.

[ick]

Don't forget adequate supplies of brass, sulfur, charcoal, and potassium nitrate.

Other than common jewelry like wedding rings, engagement rings, watches, chains...... I think silver is about the only metal that is functional in a SHTF situation. $300 of 99.0% pure gold is simply not $300 worth of impressive.

[Hush]

Silver also has medicinal uses going back to the Greeks.

If you have a cut or burn you can mix silver filings with any cream or salve and it will kill infection.

I touched on this in Survival / Preparedness where I put a link or two for those who would like to read more about it.

[Blaubart]

What got me to thinking about this today was a link for an ad on one of Hush's news posts that advertised how to buy silver for $3. In it, the guy talks on and on about the merits of silver. One of his selling points was when silver is used to produce the many things it's used in today, from electronics, to clothing, it's used up. It cannot be re-used. It's gone. So there will always be a demand for silver.

That left me scratching my head. Is it just me, or is that not possible, unless we're using fusion/fission in the production of goods nowdays...

It could very well be that it isn't cost effective to recover the silver, but it isn't "gone". It isn't "used up". The title of his article also included the words "government created silver", which also left me confused. Does the government "create" silver? If it did, is that anything like Obama giving away free health care?

Anyway, the guy wants to charge money to send people information on how to buy pre-1965 silver coins for 1% above the spot price of silver. In other words, you'd be able to buy a silver dime for $3. Wow! I'm there! (I love the Internet. I just searched for the title of the article "How to buy US government created silver for $3" and there were a number of people giving away his "secret" for free. ) It wasn't really a secret. I was thinking it was going to be some way to abuse the system by buying coins from the mint where the content of silver was worth more than they were charging for the coins.

[rogerme]

That left me scratching my head. Is it just me, or is that not possible, unless we're using fusion/fission in the production of goods nowdays...

You are thinking of your old science teacher telling you matter is never destroyed. You forgot the second part where it can be BROKEN down into its core elements thus while the matter was not destroyed the links holding the various matter together to form said metal ( silver) when broken does in fact destroy the silver but not the matter it is made of.

[Blaubart]

You forgot the second part where it can be BROKEN down into its core elements...

Silver is a core element.

... the links holding the various matter together to form said metal ( silver) when broken does in fact destroy the silver but not the matter it is made of.

Yes, but only if we're talking about a compound, like steel. You can use silver to make other compounds, you can even dissolve silver into solutions, but the silver atoms are still there. To change a silver atom into something else requires either fusion or fission.

I'm thinking he meant that it may as well be gone or used up. An industry purchases X amount of silver each year to put that silver into their products, none of which is expected to be recovered, then it's as good as gone.

[ick]

I would agree with most of that except there are a lot of elements that are completely useless without significant amount of effort... even in their base state. It may be aluminum through the entire process, but the powder is a lot more useless than the other states.

Aluminum powder

Processed

After additional processing.

[MJF1911]

I like silver. Its super easy to buy and it stores easily. I have quite a bit of silver, for no particular reason I suppose. It is easier for me to save money by buying silver than to watch it sit in my bank account and do nothing but tempt me to buy things that degrade in value.

The 'trick' is to buy quality silver, stuff that is certified or in desireable mintage like Silver Eagles. It always commands a premium over junk silver which is basically what pre-1965 coins are considered. They aren't pure silver.

Everything I've purchased is worth more now than when I bought it, so I'm not worried. I don't flip investments, I'm a saver.

[J Krammes]

I like silver. Its super easy to buy and it stores easily. I have quite a bit of silver, for no particular reason I suppose. It is easier for me to save money by buying silver than to watch it sit in my bank account and do nothing but tempt me to buy things that degrade in value.

The 'trick' is to buy quality silver, stuff that is certified or in desireable mintage like Silver Eagles. It always commands a premium over junk silver which is basically what pre-1965 coins are considered. They aren't pure silver.

Everything I've purchased is worth more now than when I bought it, so I'm not worried. I don't flip investments, I'm a saver.

Ok... So say I have $1000 to buy some silver. Would you buy all eagles, or get some junk silver with the Eagles? I have seen where people will get the junk silver for preping to use as a currency after something like an economic collapse. I guess the Eagles will be better for long term investments and to try and beat inflation. I also wonder if anyone would even take silver coins if the SHTF. I don't think I would. Bullets, food and the like would probably be more valuable. .22's would probably be like gold.

[Blaubart]

I also wonder if anyone would even take silver coins if the SHTF. I don't think I would. Bullets, food and the like would probably be more valuable. .22's would probably be like gold.

Because (some) people are always looking forward. They want to have some wealth whenever stability is restored and either the dollar, or whatever currency takes it's place will have value. When that day comes, how much is a five year old box of .22 ammo of questionable quality going to be worth in trade? How much is an ounce of silver going to be worth?

Near the end of Survivors, silver and gold were universally accepted currencies. .22 ammo was almost worth its weight in silver and reliable guns were basically "name your price". Of course, that was while the s--t was still hitting the fan...

[ick]

I wonder what choices the top German brass made when fleeing to Argentina? I wonder what that tells us about what works?

[J Krammes]

I also wonder if anyone would even take silver coins if the SHTF. I don't think I would. Bullets, food and the like would probably be more valuable. .22's would probably be like gold.

Because (some) people are always looking forward. They want to have some wealth whenever stability is restored and either the dollar, or whatever currency takes it's place will have value. When that day comes, how much is a five year old box of .22 ammo of questionable quality going to be worth in trade? How much is an ounce of silver going to be worth?

Near the end of Survivors, silver and gold were universally accepted currencies. .22 ammo was almost worth its weight in silver and reliable guns were basically "name your price". Of course, that was while the s--t was still hitting the fan...

Good point on after things settle down. I read Patriots, but not Survivors, so I know what Rawls thinks about silver.

[MJF1911]

I like silver. Its super easy to buy and it stores easily. I have quite a bit of silver, for no particular reason I suppose. It is easier for me to save money by buying silver than to watch it sit in my bank account and do nothing but tempt me to buy things that degrade in value.

The 'trick' is to buy quality silver, stuff that is certified or in desireable mintage like Silver Eagles. It always commands a premium over junk silver which is basically what pre-1965 coins are considered. They aren't pure silver.

Everything I've purchased is worth more now than when I bought it, so I'm not worried. I don't flip investments, I'm a saver.

Ok... So say I have $1000 to buy some silver. Would you buy all eagles, or get some junk silver with the Eagles? I have seen where people will get the junk silver for preping to use as a currency after something like an economic collapse. I guess the Eagles will be better for long term investments and to try and beat inflation. I also wonder if anyone would even take silver coins if the SHTF. I don't think I would. Bullets, food and the like would probably be more valuable. .22's would probably be like gold.

I can agree with your assessment, if you want it as an investment get the Eagles or bars, for post collapse get a mix of pre 1965 quarters and dimes & certified coin or bars. Canadian coins are also a good investment as they are certified.

Society would just revert to the middle ages, where coins were only part of currency. Remember we're not talking days or weeks, but years to decades. Silver and gold functioned where traditional barter would not.

[Blaubart]

Just a quick note to anyone looking to get into silver: Steer clear of "German Silver". I've been looking at stuff on FeeBay and there are a lot of auctions right now for stuff like "1 Troy Ounce Oz German Silver Buffalo Bullion Bar .999".

Sounds good, right? The image even looks like a nice ingot.

*BUT* - "German Silver" is not silver. In fact, it doesn't even contain any elemental silver. It is a silver colored alloy of copper, nickel and zinc, also known as nickel silver. With the price of silver up around $32/oz, it's got the scammers coming out of the woodwork...

[Hush]

Just a quick note to anyone looking to get into silver: Steer clear of "German Silver". I've been looking at stuff on FeeBay and there are a lot of auctions right now for stuff like "1 Troy Ounce Oz German Silver Buffalo Bullion Bar .999".

Sounds good, right? The image even looks like a nice ingot.

*BUT* - "German Silver" is not silver. In fact, it doesn't even contain any elemental silver. It is a silver colored alloy of copper, nickel and zinc, also known as nickel silver. With the price of silver up around $32/oz, it's got the scammers coming out of the woodwork...

The bolsters, hilts and guards on good knives are usually made of nickel silver aka German silver but it will usually be advertized as nickel silver.

[rogerme]

You forgot the second part where it can be BROKEN down into its core elements...

Silver is a core element.

Yes it is. However the elements are made up of a atomic structure consisting of electrons protons and neutrons. Thus silver in fact can be destroyed but the atomic particles that made it up can not.