MP5K SBR / Pistol swap

[dan9591]

I have an MP5K clone pistol. I would like to form 1 it into an SBR and attach a retractable stock.

After I do this would I be allowed to temporarily remove the stock and return it to a pistol form?

If yes:

1. What about the VFG (Vertical Forward Grip)? I know that while it’s in SBR mode the AFG is OK, but if I temporarily convert it back to pistol mode would I be able to leave the VFG on?

2. In either case, would I have to have the retractable stock somewhere near me? For instance, do I need to keep the stock in my range bag?

[strobro32]

Yes

1. Yes

2. No, but you should carry a copy of your F1 with your SBR.

[RWBlue]

As I understand it...

With stock = SBR.
Without stock = pistol
With VG and no stock = can be SBR or can be AOW. If registered SBR you are ok.

[Sdustin]

SBR= SBR always. If you stake the stock off you have a SBR with the stock removed. If you were traveling with it you would have to treat it as a SBR regardless of if it had the stock on it or nit. Oh and let's see it.

[Garrett]

SBR= SBR always...

Well, maybe. Or not.

Anyway, here's what ATF has to say regarding SBRs: http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/nationa ... tguns.html

Additionally, ATF published the following with regard to converting a pistol to rifle and back: http://www.atf.gov/files/regulations-ru ... 2011-4.pdf
On the last page they state:
...a firearm, as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(3) and (a)(4), [meaning, an NFA firearm] is not made when a pistol is attached to a part or parts designed to convert the pistol into a rifle with a barrel of 16 inches or more in length, and the parts are later unassembled in a configuration not regulated under the NFA (e.g., as a pistol).

[dan9591]

SBR= SBR always...

Well, maybe. Or not.

Anyway, here's what ATF has to say regarding SBRs: http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/nationa ... tguns.html

Additionally, ATF published the following with regard to converting a pistol to rifle and back: http://www.atf.gov/files/regulations-ru ... 2011-4.pdf
On the last page they state:
...a firearm, as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(3) and (a)(4), [meaning, an NFA firearm] is not made when a pistol is attached to a part or parts designed to convert the pistol into a rifle with a barrel of 16 inches or more in length, and the parts are later unassembled in a configuration not regulated under the NFA (e.g., as a pistol).

I looked through these, but I think it's a little different because I'm going temporarily from an SBR to an AOW. It's not a rifle because the barrel is shorter than 16".

[RWBlue]

I looked through these, but I think it's a little different because I'm going temporarily from an SBR to an AOW. It's not a rifle because the barrel is shorter than 16".

But you are papered as a SBR, so you are OK.

[Garrett]

I looked through these, but I think it's a little different because I'm going temporarily from an SBR to an AOW. It's not a rifle because the barrel is shorter than 16".

Prior to the "Pistol-to-rifle-to-pistol" ruling, what you had was still an SBR, since it was "made from a rifle".

Currently, I would expect it would not be a problem with ATF, as it is still NFA registered. As noted, it is just an SBR with the stock temporarily removed.

[dan9591]

I looked through these, but I think it's a little different because I'm going temporarily from an SBR to an AOW. It's not a rifle because the barrel is shorter than 16".

But you are papered as a SBR, so you are OK.

I don't know... as I interpret it, the issue is this:
With stock and VFG = SBR
With stock only = SBR
With VFG only = AOW
With nothing = pistol

So by removing the stock and leaving the VFG, it goes back to being an AOW/pistol, which is a different configuration than An SBR, even if its temporary. This isn't the same as temporarily changing an SBR length because you are changing the approved configuration of the gun...

This is way be too gray of an area to where a gun range commando could make my day very bad...

[strobro32]

This is not that difficult. Once you register a firearm as a SBR, it will always be a SBR until you ask the BATFE to remove it from the registry. It will be a SBR regardless of furniture, stocks, barrels, sights or FVGs. You can add or remove anything unless it makes the firearm a DD or MG. If you take the SBR across state lines, each state must allow SBRs and you will need to file a 5320.20.

[fsteinba]

I SBR'd a Century Uzi clone and had to send it back to Century for warranty repair. Although I told them I was sending it in normal configuration (16" barrel), and provided a link to the ATF web site that talks about this. They freaked out and insisted that I need an ATF form (form 5, I think) approved before I could send it to them. I gave up talking to them and submitted the form to the ATF with a note explaining that I was shipping the firearm with the 16" barrel installed. The ATF refused to approve the transfer because it was unnecessary since the firearm was not in SBR configuration.

[Prince Yamato]

It was originally a pistol. He made it into an SBR. He can return it to title 1 pistol configuration and can even sell it as a pistol.

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/nationa ... tguns.html

AOW doesn't even play into this.

[strobro32]

[quote="Prince Yamato"]It was originally a pistol. He made it into an SBR. He can return it to title 1 pistol configuration and can even sell it as a pistol. /quote]

True... but it would need to be removed from the NFA registry to be a title 1 firearm. If he wanted to put a Stock and FVG (SBR $200) or just FVG (AOW $200) he would need to register and pay again.