Engraving

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ready_on_the_right
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Engraving

Post by ready_on_the_right » Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:18 pm

Why not RLT instead of Revocable Living Trust?

It's not like the ATF doesn't know what it means and nobody else really cares!!!!

Mike
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redtazdog
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Re: Engraving

Post by redtazdog » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:22 am

ready_on_the_right wrote:Why not RLT instead of Revocable Living Trust?

It's not like the ATF doesn't know what it means and nobody else really cares!!!!

Mike
RLT is my initials and or it could stand for something else other than Revocable Living Trust is why they want it spelled out.
Everything should be spelled out to avoid possible confusion on any legal document.

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copenhagen
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Re: Engraving

Post by copenhagen » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:23 am

Write BATFE on your check and see if that legal document gets cashed...

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Re: Engraving

Post by redtazdog » Fri Jan 13, 2012 12:40 am

copenhagen wrote:Write BATFE on your check and see if that legal document gets cashed...
On a legal document for them its ok, On a legal document for you it could get you trouble.
Remember they can twist the rules and we cant :?

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Re: Engraving

Post by copenhagen » Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:40 am

It would be my assumption that if the BATFE is taking issue with your registered SBR/SBS/Suppressor/AOW/Etc. having the term RLT rather than Revocable Living Trust, that that is the least of your worries, and you have already caught their eye in some much more glorious and noteworthy fashion.

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Re: Engraving

Post by jaredr » Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:08 pm

i don't know of any engraving vendors that charge by the word, so if it's the same cost to spell out the trust, why not?

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Wahnsinn
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Re: Engraving

Post by Wahnsinn » Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:35 pm

There are engraving guys that charge by the letter.

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Re: Engraving

Post by jaredr » Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:39 pm

Wahnsinn wrote:There are engraving guys that charge by the letter.
np, i stand corrected. I'd only heard of orion and a few others that all seemed to charge a flat fee.

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ready_on_the_right
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Re: Engraving

Post by ready_on_the_right » Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:44 pm

I'm not having any troubles just making a statement!

Some things just irritate me :D

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Re: Engraving

Post by dtom29 » Fri Jan 13, 2012 9:15 pm

I have 4 SBR's everyone is engraved RLT.....Just sayin....

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Re: Engraving

Post by ready_on_the_right » Fri Jan 13, 2012 10:08 pm

Is your trust "official" name RLT or did you spell out Revocable Living Trust?

I think they want it the same on both, even though it makes sooooo much since to abrreviate on the actual engraving.

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Re: Engraving

Post by Bendersquint » Sat Jan 14, 2012 2:46 pm

FWIW, ATF told me that RLT is a commonly accepted and understood abbreviation for Revocable Living Trust, with that said they also told me that if RLT did NOT stand for Revocable Living Trust it had to be spelled out.

I don't charge by the letter though, who really does that?

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Re: Engraving

Post by Wahnsinn » Sat Jan 14, 2012 6:59 pm

I saw a couple gun places that charged that way when I was looking to get my Draco AK engraved. Also a couple places that don't specifically do guns (jewelry, trophy).

The guy I had do it (also does my transfers, threading, etc) said the reason he charges what he does, is because the finish on the guns eats up the bits it's so tough. He runs it on a cnc mill as well, maybe some guys that do it by hand would have an issue doing a ton of letters for a single price.

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Re: Engraving

Post by Bendersquint » Sat Jan 14, 2012 7:14 pm

Wahnsinn wrote:I saw a couple gun places that charged that way when I was looking to get my Draco AK engraved. Also a couple places that don't specifically do guns (jewelry, trophy).

The guy I had do it (also does my transfers, threading, etc) said the reason he charges what he does, is because the finish on the guns eats up the bits it's so tough. He runs it on a cnc mill as well, maybe some guys that do it by hand would have an issue doing a ton of letters for a single price.
Your guy must not be using sharp engraving bits or is using bad settings if his are getting chewed up, I can engrave titanium all day long and thats far tougher than steel or anodized aluminum and my inserts last quite awhile!

I do mine on a CNC engraver designed specifically for engraving though so maybe thats the difference?

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Re: Engraving

Post by Wahnsinn » Sat Jan 14, 2012 9:40 pm

Could be, but it was still only $40 :D So I couldn't complain, fair price plus he's local. I thought about using a Dremel, but after doing some testing, my engraving skills are crap :lol:

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Re: Engraving

Post by srt-4_uk » Sat Jan 14, 2012 9:59 pm

Wahnsinn wrote:Could be, but it was still only $40 :D So I couldn't complain, fair price plus he's local. I thought about using a Dremel, but after doing some testing, my engraving skills are crap :lol:
Dremel is too hard to control. We used an etcher at work to engrave tools. It turned out decent but we switched to a laser engraver now because it looks better.

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Re: Engraving

Post by Wahnsinn » Sun Jan 15, 2012 9:34 am

That's what I came across, the Dremel wanted to go every which way, so my testing came out looking kinda like the first time I learned to write letters in crayon.

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Re: Engraving

Post by TEXMEX » Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:51 pm

Bendersquint wrote:FWIW, ATF told me that RLT is a commonly accepted and understood abbreviation for Revocable Living Trust, with that said they also told me that if RLT did NOT stand for Revocable Living Trust it had to be spelled out.

I don't charge by the letter though, who really does that?
Is "ATF told me" the same as "ATF said"? How do you explain this?

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/trusten ... notice.jpg

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Re: Engraving

Post by Bendersquint » Sat Feb 04, 2012 3:22 pm

TEXMEX wrote:
Bendersquint wrote:FWIW, ATF told me that RLT is a commonly accepted and understood abbreviation for Revocable Living Trust, with that said they also told me that if RLT did NOT stand for Revocable Living Trust it had to be spelled out.

I don't charge by the letter though, who really does that?
Is "ATF told me" the same as "ATF said"? How do you explain this?

http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/trusten ... notice.jpg
RLT is an accepted abbreviation for Revocable Living Trust, that is guidance per NFA branch, per my examiner and per Industry Operations.

Without seeing what was written on that application and denied that letter means nothing. It could have been BJRLT instead of Bobby Joe's RLT. Who knows.

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Re: Engraving

Post by purehavoc » Tue May 01, 2012 11:40 am

Bendersquint wrote:
Wahnsinn wrote:I saw a couple gun places that charged that way when I was looking to get my Draco AK engraved. Also a couple places that don't specifically do guns (jewelry, trophy).

The guy I had do it (also does my transfers, threading, etc) said the reason he charges what he does, is because the finish on the guns eats up the bits it's so tough. He runs it on a cnc mill as well, maybe some guys that do it by hand would have an issue doing a ton of letters for a single price.
Your guy must not be using sharp engraving bits or is using bad settings if his are getting chewed up, I can engrave titanium all day long and thats far tougher than steel or anodized aluminum and my inserts last quite awhile!

I do mine on a CNC engraver designed specifically for engraving though so maybe thats the difference?
Im in the process of waiting on my tax stamp also , engraving is my question for you since you do this . can it be done on flat on the bottom of the trigger area , basically if you were holding the gun it would be facing down towards the trigger guard , I really dont want it out in plain sight but I know it needs to be on there , it never really states what sizing it needs to be just a certain depth , Looking to have it laser etched locally in this area and want it to look decent , name on one side , city and state on the other .
Thanks
PH

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Re: Engraving

Post by Bendersquint » Tue May 01, 2012 3:51 pm

purehavoc wrote: Im in the process of waiting on my tax stamp also , engraving is my question for you since you do this . can it be done on flat on the bottom of the trigger area , basically if you were holding the gun it would be facing down towards the trigger guard , I really dont want it out in plain sight but I know it needs to be on there , it never really states what sizing it needs to be just a certain depth , Looking to have it laser etched locally in this area and want it to look decent , name on one side , city and state on the other .
Thanks
PH
Reread the regs, it DOES states size of the lettering and required depth.

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Re: Engraving

Post by TEXMEX » Thu May 10, 2012 11:58 pm

Bendersquint wrote:
purehavoc wrote: Im in the process of waiting on my tax stamp also , engraving is my question for you since you do this . can it be done on flat on the bottom of the trigger area , basically if you were holding the gun it would be facing down towards the trigger guard , I really dont want it out in plain sight but I know it needs to be on there , it never really states what sizing it needs to be just a certain depth , Looking to have it laser etched locally in this area and want it to look decent , name on one side , city and state on the other .
Thanks
PH
Reread the regs, it DOES states size of the lettering and required depth.
There is a height requirement for the serial number only, no smaller than 1/16". There is no height requirement for other information.

TITLE 27 CFR CHAPTER II PART 479. Specifically 479.102 covers this.

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Re: Engraving

Post by Wahnsinn » Sat May 12, 2012 9:11 am

This does appear to be the case. For all the other info, only a depth requirement is stated.
For firearms manufactured, imported, or made on and after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting, or stamping (impressing) of the serial number must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch and in a print size no smaller than 1/16 inch; and
For firearms manufactured, imported, or made on and after January 30, 2002, the engraving, casting, or stamping (impressing) of this information must be to a minimum depth of .003 inch.
"This information" is in regards to the other info (name, city, etc).

Interesting. Not that I really need it to be smaller than 1/16" in height :lol: That's pretty small as it is.

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Re: Engraving

Post by tepin » Thu May 31, 2012 6:48 pm

The attorney that put my NFA trust together said it didn't matter what the trust was called as long as the name of the trust on the trust paperwork matched what was engraved on the gun which matched what was entered on Form #1. The name of my trust is "102 NFA TRUST" which is what is engraved on the gun and what appears on Form 1. "Revocable Living" Trust, as outlined in my trust document, describes the type of trust but is not part of the trust name.

If I had titled my trust, "102 NFA REVOCABLE LIVING TRUST" then this is what I would have had to engrave. Hence, shorter is better.

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Re: Engraving

Post by towerofpower93 » Fri Jun 01, 2012 11:57 am

tepin wrote:The attorney that put my NFA trust together said it didn't matter what the trust was called as long as the name of the trust on the trust paperwork matched what was engraved on the gun which matched what was entered on Form #1. The name of my trust is "102 NFA TRUST" which is what is engraved on the gun and what appears on Form 1. "Revocable Living" Trust, as outlined in my trust document, describes the type of trust but is not part of the trust name.

If I had titled my trust, "102 NFA REVOCABLE LIVING TRUST" then this is what I would have had to engrave. Hence, shorter is better.
I did the same. Had the trust named "1234 Revocable Living Trust" aka "1234 Trust"

Now if I just didn't live in "Charlottesville, VA" I could really hide that info in plain sight :)

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