ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Machine Gun Matt
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ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Machine Gun Matt » Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:37 am

So You think its cute to F--k everyone else on the Efile

I hear You like to tie up bandwith on the Gov Efile system through a backdoor in he system!

My understanding is Your going to be audited for Your little stunt just for starters.......

Well here's a little message for You. There are now plans in the works to bring You F tards to Your knees.

You want to control the market? The wheels are already set in motion for an all out Boycott of Your Company! :evil:
07/02 FFL-SOT

a_canadian
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by a_canadian » Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:24 am

Huh? Perhaps posted as a new thread in error, missing the intended target discussion? What company? What is this about?

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by StoneyGherkin » Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:29 am

I would be interested in a little background on this, too.
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by 66427vette » Fri Mar 21, 2014 9:22 am

Props to silencer shop for getting the system to work.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Bendersquint » Fri Mar 21, 2014 10:52 am

Props to SilencerShop for doing so well as a business that they are submitting so many transfer forms that the crappy .gov transfer system is having a hard time keeping up!

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Machine Gun Matt
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Machine Gun Matt » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:04 am

Bendersquint wrote:Props to SilencerShop for doing so well as a business that they are submitting so many transfer forms that the crappy .gov transfer system is having a hard time keeping up!
That's not the issue!

Good on them for having the business, shame on them for how there doing the filing.

Its not the Gov. system, that's fine, its the way their using the system. Lets just say their not playing by the rules, and submitting one file at a time......

Guess Your out of the loop B?
07/02 FFL-SOT

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Bendersquint
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Bendersquint » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:06 am

Machine Gun Matt wrote:
Bendersquint wrote:Props to SilencerShop for doing so well as a business that they are submitting so many transfer forms that the crappy .gov transfer system is having a hard time keeping up!
That's not the issue!

Good on them for having the business, shame on them for how there doing the filing.

Its not the Gov. system, that's fine, its the way their using the system. Lets just say their not playing by the rules, and submitting one file at a time......

Guess Your out of the loop B?
Not really out of the loop Matt, I am aware of how they do their filing.

I guess I don't play by the rules either since I submit multiple files at a time as well.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by 66427vette » Fri Mar 21, 2014 1:20 pm

Doubt the ATF gives a s--t. Good luck boycotting a company with top notch customer service. Everyone loves those guys.The only people I have ever heard hate on them are over priced dealers.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by grrifles » Fri Mar 21, 2014 1:29 pm

So you are mad at them because they figured a way to help their customers? Seems to me they are doing the right thing for their customer base.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by jt526 » Fri Mar 21, 2014 2:07 pm

Thanks man! I totally forgot to order my next one from them for this year. I'm staggering them out in 3 month windows so I get new toys before I really want them. Post up again in about 3 months.

Image
Stupid, stupid NFA items.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by doubloon » Fri Mar 21, 2014 3:33 pm

Need to get my order in before the boycott
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDtd2jNIwAU MUSAFAR!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI This is Water DavidW
Complete Form 1s http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by 66427vette » Fri Mar 21, 2014 3:37 pm

I might even order a few to show support lol.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by tsands974 » Sat Mar 22, 2014 9:33 am

I am a hardcore Silencer Shop customer for life, they have always gone out of their way for me. They are consistently offering the lowest prices around and have excellent customer service. What makes you think they will get audited for acting in accordance with the law?

I don't get baseless rants from people who should appreciate what companies like Silencer Shop are trying to do.

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Machine Gun Matt
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Machine Gun Matt » Sun Mar 23, 2014 10:52 am

Bendersquint wrote:
Machine Gun Matt wrote:
Bendersquint wrote:Props to SilencerShop for doing so well as a business that they are submitting so many transfer forms that the crappy .gov transfer system is having a hard time keeping up!
That's not the issue!

Good on them for having the business, shame on them for how there doing the filing.

Its not the Gov. system, that's fine, its the way their using the system. Lets just say their not playing by the rules, and submitting one file at a time......

Guess Your out of the loop B?
Not really out of the loop Matt, I am aware of how they do their filing.

I guess I don't play by the rules either since I submit multiple files at a time as well.
No I guess You don't?
I've honestly lost a lot of respect for you B, I thought you had business ethics, integrity, higher than normal standards in this community. Clearly I was wrong.
Just because you can take advantage of situation doesn't mean it's right. It just shows greed, lack of respect for people who are honest, and pure selfishness. I'm rather ashamed of You!
You've tarnished Your good name with Your Statements and if you don't see the malice.....Then you must be profiting from the scam and somehow can justify it? I won't be sending you anymore business or recommending You to my clients.
Good Day Sir
07/02 FFL-SOT

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by chrismartin » Sun Mar 23, 2014 11:33 am

MGM,

To blame Silencer Shop (and now Bender) on slowing down the system is laughable.
You need to point the finger at the ATF and their developers for making such a craptacular system that they need to shut it down for most of the day. I've designed and written these types of software systems and deployed them.
Any batch submission that is available would have had to be specifically programmed into the system. If the ATF didn't want it used, it wouldn't be public. Systems like these are MUCH better at batch processing than individual submissions, that's why payroll uploads, banking transactions, etc. are all batch when you go from large company to company. Once you have more than a single transaction or two, batch is much more efficient for the company submission and the actual processing.
Imagine this...
If SS had to hand enter and submit 100 transactions by hand, they would have to hand enter those in, clicking all the links and submit. That's 500 (5 steps per form IIRC) pages back and forth, the server would have to process all those pages, back and forth with all the validation and look up. This is especially problematic when you have as large of an inventory as SS. That first page where they need to pick the existing item out of their inventory must be a huge look up. So, if you want it REALLY SLOW, make silencer shop STOP batch processing. That will really be slow.

Imagine you have a congested one lane road. Would you rather SS drive 100 cars down that road, or a single tractor trailer? Yes, the tractor takes up more room on the road, but not nearly as much as 100 cars would be. Then, you get made at SS for the tractor trailer when you should get made at the people to designed the one lane road.

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Machine Gun Matt
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Machine Gun Matt » Sun Mar 23, 2014 12:19 pm

chrismartin wrote:MGM,

To blame Silencer Shop (and now Bender) on slowing down the system is laughable.
You need to point the finger at the ATF and their developers for making such a craptacular system that they need to shut it down for most of the day. I've designed and written these types of software systems and deployed them.
Any batch submission that is available would have had to be specifically programmed into the system. If the ATF didn't want it used, it wouldn't be public. Systems like these are MUCH better at batch processing than individual submissions, that's why payroll uploads, banking transactions, etc. are all batch when you go from large company to company. Once you have more than a single transaction or two, batch is much more efficient for the company submission and the actual processing.
Imagine this...
If SS had to hand enter and submit 100 transactions by hand, they would have to hand enter those in, clicking all the links and submit. That's 500 (5 steps per form IIRC) pages back and forth, the server would have to process all those pages, back and forth with all the validation and look up. This is especially problematic when you have as large of an inventory as SS. That first page where they need to pick the existing item out of their inventory must be a huge look up. So, if you want it REALLY SLOW, make silencer shop STOP batch processing. That will really be slow.



Imagine you have a congested one lane road. Would you rather SS drive 100 cars down that road, or a single tractor trailer? Yes, the tractor takes up more room on the road, but not nearly as much as 100 cars would be. Then, you get made at SS for the tractor trailer when you should get made at the people to designed the one lane road.
While I respect Your opinion, I can't even believe that You guys don't have an issue with a company that is impacting interstate/ intrastate commerce and doing so knowing their actions are doing so intentionally monopolizing the electronic system. If You don't see the problem with this it speaks volumes to me about Your own character.
Respectfully, MGM
07/02 FFL-SOT

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by chrismartin » Sun Mar 23, 2014 1:08 pm

Machine Gun Matt wrote: While I respect Your opinion, I can't even believe that You guys don't have an issue with a company that is impacting interstate/ intrastate commerce and doing so knowing their actions are doing so intentionally monopolizing the electronic system. If You don't see the problem with this it speaks volumes to me about Your own character.
Respectfully, MGM
Seriously? Please post proof that SS is impacting the system at all with batch processing.
It's more likely that form 1 submissions and the increase in the public accessing the system that is impacting the system more.
Did you not understand my analogy? Again, blaming the end user (SS) rather than the ATF is just stupid and speaks volumes about YOUR character (see how that works both ways, as do most ad hominem attacks)

Even if SS is at fault, it's still up to the ATF to beef up their system to support the volume.

Stop Hating on successful businesses and start hating on the incompetence of the ATF's programmers and deployment people.

Never mind... Just go sit in your little corner and keep chowing down on those sour grapes.

Seriously though, you should find out how to batch submit as well. It might fix the problem for you.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by a_canadian » Sun Mar 23, 2014 2:04 pm

Laughable is indeed the operative descriptor here. Does machinegunmatt seriously have no concept of how blazingly FAST computers relay information? 1 form or 100 forms, the difference can be measured in a handful of nanoseconds. The slow part is the data processing at the human end; whenever that is involved everything grinds almost to a halt as compared to computer processing rates. The sense I'm getting is that butthurt is the issue here, because Mr. Machinegun is impatient waiting for his forms to process through the HUMAN part of the equation. Entering the forms has got to be the most trivially time-consumptive part of the process. Actually examining those forms and deciding a yay or a nay is the most time consuming, by a million-fold or more.

Besides which, now that the intent of this thread has been made clear, one has to wonder how Matt speaks for the ATF? What else is missing from his comments here, what's not being spelled out? I'm just not seeing anything more than irrational butthurt and a weakly flailing 'threat' with no substance to it.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by doubloon » Sun Mar 23, 2014 3:12 pm

I really want to care about this one way or the other but I find it extremely difficult in the absence of factual data about how e-file works and why it would matter if someone submitted 100 forms in a row one at a time or 100 forms in a batch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDtd2jNIwAU MUSAFAR!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI This is Water DavidW
Complete Form 1s http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by L1A1Rocker » Sun Mar 23, 2014 8:27 pm

Machine gun dude, how do you know that SS's sales practices are going to result in an audit? Why is the "ATF coming for them in a Major Way!!!!!!!!!!"? Such a statement indicates that you have knowledge that they are being "targeted" by the ATF; How did you come by this information, and on what grounds will SS be "targeted"? Why would SS's sales practices make them a "target" of the ATF? Also, since you seem to have inside knowledge on what is going on at the ATF and what they are planning, why have you not used the knowledge/information to improved your sales practices to be on par with SS?

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by RJT » Mon Mar 24, 2014 2:08 pm

Apparently MGM just isn't cranking out the sales like Silencer Shop.

Haters gonna hate.......

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/0 ... ore-305631
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by jt526 » Mon Mar 24, 2014 2:50 pm

I think this is way less about batch processing through some supposed back door or hack and more about simple scripting by a smart guy who doesn't want to spend all day entering forms. No back doors, no uploading mass forms, just a script that does the right actions at the right times with information pulled from a database they created to record all the information needed for the transactions and forms.

To use the highway analogy, it is all 100 cars on the road, but at off peak hours and taking the human component out. Run it during the day, and run it hard enough, and it'd probably will slow it down for all the users, since it really is all 100 cars. Launch 1000 all at once and you probably have the equivalent of a DDoS attack.

Look up Selenium or WebDriver. I'd do the exact same thing if I had to submit as many forms as they do. Link purchase info and uploaded forms in a database, record the script to interact with the webpage, and smile in smug self satisfaction. Plan B which involves hand submitting that many forms would suck.

ETA: And now I see that plenty of web guys on that article also point out the ease of scripting it.
Stupid, stupid NFA items.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by L1A1Rocker » Mon Mar 24, 2014 7:08 pm

RJT wrote:Apparently MGM just isn't cranking out the sales like Silencer Shop.

Haters gonna hate.......

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2014/0 ... ore-305631
From the email quoted in the article:
they are apparently contacting SOT’s, and offering to do ALL of the paperwork on the SOT’s behalf. Form 3 from them to the SOT, then the Form 4 to the customer. All they need is for you to make them a submitter under your eForm account so they can complete the Form 4, they will do the rest and be in contact with the customer.
Folks, this is EXACTLY what professional medical billing companies do. They have the software to talk to insurance companies and greatly reduce the time it takes a doctor (or ambulance company) to get paid. The banking analogy referenced further is not accurate. There is nothing wrong with using a third party billing company.

I see that machine gun dud has left us, and with so many questions unanswered too.

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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Conqueror » Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:21 pm

LOL @ blaming Silencer Shop for this problem.

The E-forms website looks and functions like it was designed by high schoolers in 1997. Any system that can't handle four submissions per minute at off-peak hours is a joke and the people who designed it should be fired immediately.
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Re: ATF is Coming for You Guys in A Major Way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Post by Sigproshooter » Sat Apr 12, 2014 4:01 pm

They obviously helped develop the obamacare website as well.
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