Hiding a hot firearm from infrared cameras.

[decoy00086]

Firearms have a nasty habit of getting very hot when firing.
To someone with a infrared camera your rifle would be so visible that it might as well glow in the dark.

( hiding your own heat doesn't hurt either)

There are some simple and supposedly effective methods to hide a hot gun like covering it with a wet blanket but that sounds clumsy ( don't really see solders going around with a jug of water to dump on their guns ) and hardly a long lasting solution either.

Maybe rapping your gun in some material that can insulate the heat but that you have a problem with the gun overheating rapidly.

If one could figure out the way to circulate air between the insulating material and the gun
(assuming that infrared camera cant see the hot air coming out of the gun and can only see line-of-sight heat from solid objects )

any ideas ?

[doubloon]

http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/military_ ... 00892a.jpg

[82nd airborne]

You can see a fart, literally, with an ITAS, good luck hiding a smoking gun!

[copenhagen]

Vegetation retains heat at night. Farts and guns could be hard to pick out in thick underbrush.

[Mongo]

Here is a video of how a gun looks to a thermal camera when it is fired. Notice that even the brass makes a hot spot when it is ejected.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSoUKqgi8ok

[decoy00086]

Here is a video of how a gun looks to a thermal camera when it is fired. Notice that even the brass makes a hot spot when it is ejected.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSoUKqgi8ok

brass can be collected , that is especially easy with forward ejecting bull-pops

[Crosshair]

Employ a decoy. The Serbs managed to get NATO to spend millions of dollars worth of bombs destroying $10 camp stoves and old Yugo's so I don't see why it wouldn't work here.

[Kramer]

Employ a decoy. The Serbs managed to get NATO to spend millions of dollars worth of bombs destroying $10 camp stoves and old Yugo's so I don't see why it wouldn't work here.

See those old Yugos did have a purpose in life.

[doubloon]

What would you use to circulate the air under your blanket? An electric motor? Are you just talking about recirculating the same air over an over again or are you talking about taking in new air and exhausting the old/warm air? Wouldn't you have to cool down that exhaust air? Do you plan on bringing a compressor. A blanket is clumsy but you're willing to collect the brass?

What are the parameters you're trying to satisfy? You want to get off a shot without any immediate heat signature whatsoever or is it OK for there to be a flash of heat but no residual heat signature?

Go with the decoy, it's the best idea so far.

[Selectedmarksman]

Employ a decoy. The Serbs managed to get NATO to spend millions of dollars worth of bombs destroying $10 camp stoves and old Yugo's so I don't see why it wouldn't work here.

Spy sappin' mah Sentry!

[robpiat]

Light the area around you on fire.

[WhisperFan]

I think Arnold Schwarzenegger covered himself in mud to hide in the movie Predator

[decoy00086]

What would you use to circulate the air under your blanket? An electric motor? Are you just talking about recirculating the same air over an over again or are you talking about taking in new air and exhausting the old/warm air? Wouldn't you have to cool down that exhaust air? Do you plan on bringing a compressor. A blanket is clumsy but you're willing to collect the brass?

What are the parameters you're trying to satisfy? You want to get off a shot without any immediate heat signature whatsoever or is it OK for there to be a flash of heat but no residual heat signature?

Go with the decoy, it's the best idea so far.

what i want is to be able to make a few shots and not end up with a glowing hot weapon that tells everybody in a miles around where i am , hell ... i couldn't even retreat with the thing , it would just keep giving away my position.

my idea so far is to stuff a rifle in a tube like heat shield which would isolate the rifles hot components ( barrel , sound suppressor , ect ... ) from being seen directly by the line of sight by an ir camera and maybe adding a small fan to circulate air between the ends of the tube.

hopefully the hot air seen leaving the tube wouldn't be visible from a distance.
*and please no more "visible fart examples" : )

I am fairly sure they cant see hot air because i have seen a bunch of ir videos and you can never see hot air from peoples breath, add a few hundreds meters distance and that should do it ..

[doubloon]

Take a few shots and not give away your position?

You mean like sit in one place and take a few shots without repositioning?

[decoy00086]

Take a few shots and not give away your position?

You mean like sit in one place and take a few shots without repositioning?

loool, it is a shame you cant take a car with you everywhere to hide in

[JohnnyC]

There's a fairly famous video of a dude running from the cops and the helicopter is watching him with it's FLIR. Long story short dude eats his shotgun in the footage. You can see blood and brain matter very clearly in the video and that's only body temperature. I think this is probably a losing battle. Keep in mind ambient air temp also plays a large part of it. Taking a shot while laying in a snow bank is going to be quite a bit more apparent than if it's in Death Valley in July. Depending on type of firearm used would also play a part.

[jlwilliams]

I'm no expert here, but it sounds like you can't trick the technology but you may trick the operator. If someone is looking at you (with or without a hot rifle) through FLIR, they will see you. If they are looking where you are not, they won't see you. Not being a smart ass, I'm serious. You won't make it look (through the lense of a FLIR rig) like you and your gun aren't there. Trick seems to be to have people looking where you are not. Maybe you use decoys, distractions, whatever. Just shoot and scoot. Don't focus on fooling their hardware, fool the wetware. Get them looking through their infra red scopes at a spot where you aren't.

May I ask what it is that you are contemplating? If this was a real military operation you wouldn't be asking advice online, you'd be planning it behind closed doors somewhere. Are you actually planning on doing something foolish we'll see on the news or is this research for a book, or just random curiosity?

[doubloon]

There's a fairly famous video of a dude running ...

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=8cb_1224350154

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SnQcyyDJLCo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLqwYt7fwN8

[decoy00086]

May I ask what it is that you are contemplating? If this was a real military operation you wouldn't be asking advice online, you'd be planning it behind closed doors somewhere. Are you actually planning on doing something foolish we'll see on the news or is this research for a book, or just random curiosity?

being paranoid much ... it is just random curiosity , i find such things fascinating , if i could write i would write a nice war/sci book but that ain't happening...

[ick]

underground bunker with a network of tunnels deep enough to avoid heat detection... otherwise SOL.

[Hush]

Hm, inside of a Van is more comfortable than the trunk of a car. Also one of those metallic space blankets would cover any heat signature.

[opksrj]

a blind with thermal camo would be my best bet

http://defense-and-freedom.blogspot.com ... flage.html

[decoy00086]

Well , i did some research and i think i figured it out ...

A small air-conditioning device could keep a person ( their clothing ) at neutral temperature making him invisible ( more or less ).
The excess heat would be released as hot air (well , just warm ) that is near invisible to ic cameras.
The system would burn anywhere between 75 W for a slipping person to 450 W for someone exerting themselves , so with average consumption of 250 W a few kg ( ermm ... maybe a bit more ) of modern batteries would last a good 8 h.

as for the rifle i guess one could cool it with the air-conditioning device ( circulating cold water probably ) ... as long as there is not to much heat produced.

now i know this all sound cumbersome but i would rather haul around 10 -15 kg of gear that makes me invisible ( to ir anyway ) and unlikely to get shot that same amount of weight in body armor and getting shot.

if i made a mistake somewhere or if this is a royally stupid idea , do tell , criticism is always welcome

[igpoobah]

Well , i did some research and i think i figured it out ...

A small air-conditioning device could keep a person ( their clothing ) at neutral temperature making him invisible ( more or less ).
The excess heat would be released as hot air (well , just warm ) that is near invisible to ic cameras.
The system would burn anywhere between 75 W for a slipping person to 450 W for someone exerting themselves , so with average consumption of 250 W a few kg ( ermm ... maybe a bit more ) of modern batteries would last a good 8 h.

as for the rifle i guess one could cool it with the air-conditioning device ( circulating cold water probably ) ... as long as there is not to much heat produced.

now i know this all sound cumbersome but i would rather haul around 10 -15 kg of gear that makes me invisible ( to ir anyway ) and unlikely to get shot that same amount of weight in body armor and getting shot.

if i made a mistake somewhere or if this is a royally stupid idea , do tell , criticism is always welcome

I've got you figured out...you must be the producer for SONS OF GUNS trolling for new show ideas.


Confess!

[decoy00086]

I've got you figured out...you must be the producer for SONS OF GUNS trolling for new show ideas.


Confess!

never .....