NFA items safe in possible ban ?

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onate210
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NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by onate210 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:57 am

I dont know too much about the previous AWB, but from what Ive read NFA items weren't affected by the AWB ?

is the best way for avoiding dealing with a possible AWB buying all the NFA rifles you can get your hands on ?

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by nice shot » Tue Dec 18, 2012 4:12 am

. . . not quite following.

Anything you have now will be grandfathered in. Anything you purchase now (regardless of the approval time, will also be grandfathered in.

A new AWB will be published soon, my personal advice is to get anything and everything you can afford now, because real soon you wont be able to get ANYTHING.
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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by GTFord1 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:46 pm

nice shot wrote:. . . not quite following.

Anything you have now will be grandfathered in. Anything you purchase now (regardless of the approval time, will also be grandfathered in.

A new AWB will be published soon, my personal advice is to get anything and everything you can afford now, because real soon you wont be able to get ANYTHING.
Speaking in absolutes doesn't make for rational posting.

See also:

Literally tens of thousands of posts on gun forums in 2008.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by onate210 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:34 pm

Afaik in the previous AWB it was certain features that where banned. Collapsable stock in combination with a flash hider or pistol grip made a weapon an "assault weapon"

I have understood from what I've read that NFA weapons such as SBRs or machine guns were not regulated by the AWB because they are no longer "rifles"

I'm wondering if I understood that correctly and if that was the case, speculating if that could happen again. In which case we should all just go ahead and form 1 all of our lowers in case they make a possible AWB retroactive.

My fear would be that if the dems are going to go through with another AWB they may not allow grandfathering due to how many at-15s and similar weapons are already in people's hands.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Bendersquint » Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:49 pm

onate210 wrote:Afaik in the previous AWB it was certain features that where banned. Collapsable stock in combination with a flash hider or pistol grip made a weapon an "assault weapon"

I have understood from what I've read that NFA weapons such as SBRs or machine guns were not regulated by the AWB because they are no longer "rifles"

I'm wondering if I understood that correctly and if that was the case, speculating if that could happen again. In which case we should all just go ahead and form 1 all of our lowers in case they make a possible AWB retroactive.

My fear would be that if the dems are going to go through with another AWB they may not allow grandfathering due to how many at-15s and similar weapons are already in people's hands.
If you made a SBR during the last ban it had to comply with the AWB as well if it was a post-ban receiver, if it was pre-ban then no issues. Made the ban a pain for NFA as well. Not to mention no threaded barrels!

If they ban AR15's from civilian ownership it won't matter if it is a NFA weapon or not, an all out ban will get those as well.

I don't think it will go to that extent though, I can see grandfathering in whats out there but not much more.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by onate210 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:05 pm

Suddenly them making Ar-15 nfa weapons sounds like the lesser of two evils when compared to an all out ban.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Bendersquint » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:09 pm

onate210 wrote:Suddenly them making Ar-15 nfa weapons sounds like the lesser of two evils when compared to an all out ban.
Won't even get to that, it would be easier for them just to put through another AWB. Getting them into the NFA would be insane, let alone the time requirement for everyone to submit their amnesty documents etc.....won't happen. That would get far more scrutiny than just signing the AWB.

AWB won't really cost the .gov much fiscally, adding millions and millions of guns to the NFRTR would cost millions and millions in hired labor.

You complain about the transfer times now! :shock:

Enough said, it won't happen too many things against it.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by beanfield33 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:17 pm

Looks like Feinstein released her proposed legislation. http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/public/ ... w-congress

Says it also prohibits the transfer of named firearms. Not sure they could do that without registering them first. In the unlikely event this passes unmodified....would it be beneficial to move some of my NFA items that are registered in my name over to my trust so they can be passed on to my son?

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Bendersquint » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:31 pm

beanfield33 wrote:Looks like Feinstein released her proposed legislation. http://www.feinstein.senate.gov/public/ ... w-congress

Says it also prohibits the transfer of named firearms. Not sure they could do that without registering them first. In the unlikely event this passes unmodified....would it be beneficial to move some of my NFA items that are registered in my name over to my trust so they can be passed on to my son?
It will most likely be negotiated into a pre/ban situation like the last one if it goes anywhere.

Registration would be the only way to prevent transfers.

Your trust WILL NOT protect you at all, if they are banned it applies to everything whether it be owned by a company/LLC/Trust/Individual.

Don't forget that in order for the trust to you have to do a Form4 transfer, therefore another $200 and 6+ months of waiting!

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by No2sc2 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:20 am

There is no ban nor anything ANYTIME SOON. Rumors starts and that's how things get stirred up and people freak out and buy everything in sight. If anything going to change, it will be the "Assault Weapons" which I believe will be moved to NFA rather than outright banning it, but there was once a ban on it, so it might be easier to reintroduce that instead of NFA. Most anti-guns supporters don't even know of NFA so yeah a ban might be first thought. Honestly like I said, if there was one, it would be long time till it even gets looked at and by then, it probably won't get passed. The only offense the people are using is "Why does a regular civilian need an assault weapon designed for combat?". Well if you hadn't noticed, alot of hunters now use the ARs to hunt and the 3 gun shooting sport is blowing up so fast it's crazy. There are many competitions now that people are using ARs to compete.

I heard gun stores pass couple days was chaotic. I personally witnessed it today in Jacksonville, FL. People were piling in lining up buying any ARs they can and people mass stocking high cap pmags. It was crazy and what's even worst is they paying top dollar for it because dealers taking advantage of it.

Whatever it is they "try" to do, It will cause a big dent in economy and surely ton of jobs will be lost. Don't forget, most firearms now are made in America.

Just wait till they start on NFA. I heard they removing CLEO sign off but also removing the ability to use entities to register.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Bendersquint » Wed Dec 19, 2012 12:32 am

No2sc2 wrote:There is no ban nor anything ANYTIME SOON. Rumors starts and that's how things get stirred up and people freak out and buy everything in sight. If anything going to change, it will be the "Assault Weapons" which I believe will be moved to NFA rather than outright banning it, but there was once a ban on it, so it might be easier to reintroduce that instead of NFA. Most anti-guns supporters don't even know of NFA so yeah a ban might be first thought. Honestly like I said, if there was one, it would be long time till it even gets looked at and by then, it probably won't get passed. The only offense the people are using is "Why does a regular civilian need an assault weapon designed for combat?". Well if you hadn't noticed, alot of hunters now use the ARs to hunt and the 3 gun shooting sport is blowing up so fast it's crazy. There are many competitions now that people are using ARs to compete.

I heard gun stores pass couple days was chaotic. I personally witnessed it today in Jacksonville, FL. People were piling in lining up buying any ARs they can and people mass stocking high cap pmags. It was crazy and what's even worst is they paying top dollar for it because dealers taking advantage of it.

Whatever it is they "try" to do, It will cause a big dent in economy and surely ton of jobs will be lost. Don't forget, most firearms now are made in America.

Just wait till they start on NFA. I heard they removing CLEO sign off but also removing the ability to use entities to register.
So where do you propose the funds will come for the hundreds of NFA employees that will have to be hired and the system built to handle millions and millions of new addiotions to the NFA?

.Gov tends to go the way of least resistance which WOULD be a ban similar to the previous one. Very few dollars would be tied up in that. We are on a 'fiscal cliff' ya know.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by No2sc2 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:05 am

Bendersquint wrote:
No2sc2 wrote:There is no ban nor anything ANYTIME SOON. Rumors starts and that's how things get stirred up and people freak out and buy everything in sight. If anything going to change, it will be the "Assault Weapons" which I believe will be moved to NFA rather than outright banning it, but there was once a ban on it, so it might be easier to reintroduce that instead of NFA. Most anti-guns supporters don't even know of NFA so yeah a ban might be first thought. Honestly like I said, if there was one, it would be long time till it even gets looked at and by then, it probably won't get passed. The only offense the people are using is "Why does a regular civilian need an assault weapon designed for combat?". Well if you hadn't noticed, alot of hunters now use the ARs to hunt and the 3 gun shooting sport is blowing up so fast it's crazy. There are many competitions now that people are using ARs to compete.

I heard gun stores pass couple days was chaotic. I personally witnessed it today in Jacksonville, FL. People were piling in lining up buying any ARs they can and people mass stocking high cap pmags. It was crazy and what's even worst is they paying top dollar for it because dealers taking advantage of it.

Whatever it is they "try" to do, It will cause a big dent in economy and surely ton of jobs will be lost. Don't forget, most firearms now are made in America.

Just wait till they start on NFA. I heard they removing CLEO sign off but also removing the ability to use entities to register.
So where do you propose the funds will come for the hundreds of NFA employees that will have to be hired and the system built to handle millions and millions of new addiotions to the NFA?

.Gov tends to go the way of least resistance which WOULD be a ban similar to the previous one. Very few dollars would be tied up in that. We are on a 'fiscal cliff' ya know.

Hahah oh yeah I forgot.... Have no idea. Adding ARs in NFA will only increase maybe 50%? It might not even increase at all since its no different from SBR. Well lets see what they do IF they do anything. I know NFA won't go away as that's a big guaranteed income for federal funding.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Bendersquint » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:26 am

No2sc2 wrote:
Bendersquint wrote:
No2sc2 wrote:There is no ban nor anything ANYTIME SOON. Rumors starts and that's how things get stirred up and people freak out and buy everything in sight. If anything going to change, it will be the "Assault Weapons" which I believe will be moved to NFA rather than outright banning it, but there was once a ban on it, so it might be easier to reintroduce that instead of NFA. Most anti-guns supporters don't even know of NFA so yeah a ban might be first thought. Honestly like I said, if there was one, it would be long time till it even gets looked at and by then, it probably won't get passed. The only offense the people are using is "Why does a regular civilian need an assault weapon designed for combat?". Well if you hadn't noticed, alot of hunters now use the ARs to hunt and the 3 gun shooting sport is blowing up so fast it's crazy. There are many competitions now that people are using ARs to compete.

I heard gun stores pass couple days was chaotic. I personally witnessed it today in Jacksonville, FL. People were piling in lining up buying any ARs they can and people mass stocking high cap pmags. It was crazy and what's even worst is they paying top dollar for it because dealers taking advantage of it.

Whatever it is they "try" to do, It will cause a big dent in economy and surely ton of jobs will be lost. Don't forget, most firearms now are made in America.

Just wait till they start on NFA. I heard they removing CLEO sign off but also removing the ability to use entities to register.
So where do you propose the funds will come for the hundreds of NFA employees that will have to be hired and the system built to handle millions and millions of new addiotions to the NFA?

.Gov tends to go the way of least resistance which WOULD be a ban similar to the previous one. Very few dollars would be tied up in that. We are on a 'fiscal cliff' ya know.

Hahah oh yeah I forgot.... Have no idea. Adding ARs in NFA will only increase maybe 50%? It might not even increase at all since its no different from SBR. Well lets see what they do IF they do anything. I know NFA won't go away as that's a big guaranteed income for federal funding.
There are far far far more AR15's than there are items in the NFA registry. Not to mention all the other type guns that would be included.

Not as big income as you think, and you thought your wait was long now?

Adding to the NFA won't happen fiscally doesn't make sense. Dems don't make sense but they do have an idea about money.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Sdustin » Wed Dec 19, 2012 5:05 am

Dont worry pretty soon all semi autos will be NFA weapons anyway
When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by GTFord1 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:55 am

Sdustin wrote:Dont worry pretty soon all semi autos will be NFA weapons anyway
Yeah, let's keep making statements with no basis in reality.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Historian » Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:36 am

GTFord1 wrote:
Sdustin wrote:Dont worry pretty soon all semi autos will be NFA weapons anyway
Yeah, let's keep making statements with no basis in reality.
Diane the Phony Feinstein ... she is one of the few to have a carry permit in San Francisco ...
and Chuck Schumer have stated this very thing over the years; " There is no need for anyone to have
these 'automatic', multi-capacity magazines, etc. ...".

The point of the statement is to rouse the complacent out of their torpor and initiate immediate
counter action to electronically "Occupy Politicians and news media"; galvanize friends telling the truth succinctly,
effectively, often, and with a Charlton Heston class and dignity. Sheep People are going to get sheared.

Lay the blame on the daily violence that Hollywood, the wrappers, and actors are shoving out.
How about showing everywhere the black speaker who recently stated that he wanted to kill all white
people and their babies. Anyone who threatens little children, no matter what color, creed, or
origin must be yank up by the leash of human decency and love and pilloried. Enough already
with the spewing of hatred of any sort ... no matter their entertainment status. Isn't it not make fun on TV
and to spew hatred for Christians, White People, 'Rich', brilliant African Americans who are
Republicans such as Mia Love, Condi RIce, and Col. West?

The political sewers are not letting the tragedy that was perpetrated on those wonderful innocent souls
go to waste. No shame. With present day technology protected by that rascally First Amendment let the entrenched
politicians reap the whirlwind of Americans who want to, and shall, protect the Constitution.

Can the Obama's deliberate and continual polarization of each group, calling for "revenge" by re-electing him,
not have contributed in part to the atmosphere of violence that fed the demented murderer? Let us discuss
his role in the hatred.

For those familiar with the concept of Indications and Warnings, you do not wait for final arrival of evil intent
to take immediate counter action. Look at the progress of the Iranian program and their final goal of wiping out
Israel. "Let us not jump to conclusions."

The pen is indeed mightier than the sword. But the sword protects the pen user. Start penning.

God Bless Our Constitution. [And Glenn Beck].

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by Libertarian_Geek » Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:36 am

No2sc2 wrote: ...Adding ARs in NFA will only increase maybe 50%?
Can you show your work. We all know your math is off, I just want to make fun of how much it's off.
No2sc2 wrote:It might not even increase at all since its no different from SBR.
:lol: What?
https://www.facebook.com/DareDefendOurRights

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by GTFord1 » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:15 am

Historian wrote:
GTFord1 wrote:
Sdustin wrote:Dont worry pretty soon all semi autos will be NFA weapons anyway
Yeah, let's keep making statements with no basis in reality.
Diane the Phony Feinstein ... she is one of the few to have a carry permit in San Francisco ...
and Chuck Schumer have stated this very thing over the years; " There is no need for anyone to have
these 'automatic', multi-capacity magazines, etc. ...".

The point of the statement is to rouse the complacent out of their torpor and initiate immediate
counter action to electronically "Occupy Politicians and news media"; galvanize friends telling the truth succinctly,
effectively, often, and with a Charlton Heston class and dignity. Sheep People are going to get sheared.

Lay the blame on the daily violence that Hollywood, the wrappers, and actors are shoving out.
How about showing everywhere the black speaker who recently stated that he wanted to kill all white
people and their babies. Anyone who threatens little children, no matter what color, creed, or
origin must be yank up by the leash of human decency and love and pilloried. Enough already
with the spewing of hatred of any sort ... no matter their entertainment status. Isn't it not make fun on TV
and to spew hatred for Christians, White People, 'Rich', brilliant African Americans who are
Republicans such as Mia Love, Condi RIce, and Col. West?

The political sewers are not letting the tragedy that was perpetrated on those wonderful innocent souls
go to waste. No shame. With present day technology protected by that rascally First Amendment let the entrenched
politicians reap the whirlwind of Americans who want to, and shall, protect the Constitution.

Can the Obama's deliberate and continual polarization of each group, calling for "revenge" by re-electing him,
not have contributed in part to the atmosphere of violence that fed the demented murderer? Let us discuss
his role in the hatred.

For those familiar with the concept of Indications and Warnings, you do not wait for final arrival of evil intent
to take immediate counter action. Look at the progress of the Iranian program and their final goal of wiping out
Israel. "Let us not jump to conclusions."

The pen is indeed mightier than the sword. But the sword protects the pen user. Start penning.

God Bless Our Constitution. [And Glenn Beck].
I'll PayPal you a shiny cent piece ($0.01) if semiautomatic guns are made to be NFA regulated.

Save this post, it's your receipt.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by doubloon » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:20 am

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDtd2jNIwAU MUSAFAR!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI This is Water DavidW
Complete Form 1s http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by kaotic504 » Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:34 am

what a lot of people are failing to see here, is that gun sales are part of our GDP. we MAKE, BUY, and SELL firearms, right here in the US. an outright ban on sales would hurt the entire supply chain. unemployment would go up and GDP down, therefore tax revenue down. i know someone in washington must understand the economics now of an outright ban. but of course Obama doesn't believe in small business.

the smart thing to do is to move it to the AR-15's, AK's, M1A's, etc. to the NFA process. Hire more staffers for the BATFE (increase in jobs!), continue sales, turn around forms in 2-4 months, and the people willing to wait, are going to be true enthusiast in my opinion.

Also, if the NRA doesn't come out w/ a great statement Friday, completely DEFENDING the right to possess and purchase our rifles, i want a refund on my Lifetime membership.

to add to my rant: there are a lot of people who have never seen, shot, handled an AR or "assault-type" firearm and they are purchasing whatever they can in case a ban comes in place. i do not blame them for doing so. but now, these firearms are in the hands of a bunch of people who don't really know how to use it and what the firearm is capable of. the world is not MORE dangerous than before.

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by MV10 » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:15 am

The amount is largely insignificant in GDP terms. Depending on whose numbers you use, the 2011 GDP was somewhere in the range of $14 trillion to $15 trillion. The Professional Gun Retailers Assoc says the annual firearms industry average has remained flat for the past 20+ years at about $3.5 billion per year ... just 0.025% of GDP.

For comparison, the US coal industry contributes an estimated $1 trillion to US GDP annually, and this is the same administration which identified them as an enemy and vowed to destroy them.
Modern American political discourse: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tpAOwJvTOio

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by doubloon » Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:59 am

Obama and his toadies have done nothing but wage war on private sector economics since they've taken office. They definitely won't stop at the gun business.

Also, don't confuse "ban" with non-existence. Governments and acronym agencies would not be affected by any ban, only private ownership by law abiding citizens would be banned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDtd2jNIwAU MUSAFAR!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI This is Water DavidW
Complete Form 1s http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by DarkPhoenix » Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:29 am

Agreed, the NRA better have an earth shattering press conference on Friday.

Amazing how most of the guns in the "buybacks" are bolt action rifles and shotguns. Where are all of the guns that the real life criminals use? Oh wait, they would never just turn in their guns...

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by urban assault » Thu Dec 20, 2012 11:34 pm

DarkPhoenix wrote:Agreed, the NRA better have an earth shattering press conference on Friday.

Amazing how most of the guns in the "buybacks" are bolt action rifles and shotguns. Where are all of the guns that the real life criminals use? Oh wait, they would never just turn in their guns...
It's gonna be worse than useless.

Washington D.C. is going to be essentially deserted as the Hill-rats scurry back home for Christmas, and if the lefty media pays any attention to the NRA's press conference, it will be to line up to deride it, call it in insensitive, contrast it with images of the kids funeral, bring up why they would hold it so close to Christmas, etc

The NRA really are not thinking clearly right now. Public perception is everything, and when everyone in the media is your enemy you have to think smarter, not be reactionary.

I would have waited until sometime in January, then started with a print campaign talking about how often legally-owned weapons are used to deter crime and violence in this country, and also really start pounding the mental health angle very hard.

-urban

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Re: NFA items safe in possible ban ?

Post by wacki » Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:00 am

Man i hate reporters:
and this is what they focus on:
Gun homicide rates fell.
Because death by "gun" is so much worse than death by knives.

Interestingly enough New Zealand, their neighbor, is heavily armed and has a LOWER homicide rate:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_g ... 00-000-pop

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