I need some advice please.
My AR is smoking me to death
I am running a NFA 7" upper with a Gemtech m4-02
I have replaced the FA to the one that is a gas port only
I have regulated the gas port
It runs nice but the "smoke" is killing me.
So, the questions are:
1. is there anything else to do to lessen this on the existing platform?
2. If I need to increase the barrel length, should it be 10.5/14.5 or 16- which works best?
3. Other suggestions?
Thank you.
Terrible issue on supressed AR
Moderators: mpallett, mr fixit, bakerjw, renegade
- Bendersquint
- Industry Professional
- Posts: 11357
- Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 7:19 pm
- Location: North Carolina
- Contact:
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Welcome to suppressed 5.56 shooting, its nasty!wetboyz wrote:I need some advice please.
My AR is smoking me to death
I am running a NFA 7" upper with a Gemtech m4-02
I have replaced the FA to the one that is a gas port only
I have regulated the gas port
It runs nice but the "smoke" is killing me.
So, the questions are:
1. is there anything else to do to lessen this on the existing platform?
2. If I need to increase the barrel length, should it be 10.5/14.5 or 16- which works best?
3. Other suggestions?
Thank you.
The short barrel is definitely not doing you any favors and aside from masive backpressure its killing your can! Most manufacturers won't warrant anything under 10".
I would do a couple things if I were dealing with this.
Get a longer barrel like a 10-11.5" and see if that helps. The longer the barrel the less the pressures inside the can which translate into less blowback.
Tweak the gas flow(adjustable gas block). If you have one already its not working.
Look into heavier buffers to slo the action and keep it locked a fraction longer, that dwell may be enough to drop that backpressure to more tolerable levels.
- Capt. Link.
- Silent But Deadly
- Posts: 2829
- Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 9:05 pm
- Location: USA.
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Shooting a MP5SD is no picnic either just learn not to breath.
Have you tried the gas buster charging handle.
Have you tried the gas buster charging handle.
The only reason after 243 years the government now wants to disarm you is they intend to do something you would shoot them for!
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Yes good point to both of you.Capt. Link. wrote:Shooting a MP5SD is no picnic either just learn not to breath.
Have you tried the gas buster charging handle.
I have the GB handle and the Pneumatic buffer.
So those two options are already there. It looks like the longer barrel is the key.
I have also been looking at adding this gas block.
http://micromoa.com/
- Capt. Link.
- Silent But Deadly
- Posts: 2829
- Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 9:05 pm
- Location: USA.
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Honestly the greatest gain would be a different suppressor that featured low back pressure.You may consider a pigtail tube plus a cyclic reducer in addition to the rest.wetboyz wrote:Yes good point to both of you.Capt. Link. wrote:Shooting a MP5SD is no picnic either just learn not to breath.
Have you tried the gas buster charging handle.
I have the GB handle and the Pneumatic buffer.
So those two options are already there. It looks like the longer barrel is the key.
I have also been looking at adding this gas block.
http://micromoa.com/
The only reason after 243 years the government now wants to disarm you is they intend to do something you would shoot them for!
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Well that part is a waste of good money. It offers nothing for a semi-only gun.wetboyz wrote:Yes good point to both of you.Capt. Link. wrote:Shooting a MP5SD is no picnic either just learn not to breath.
Have you tried the gas buster charging handle.
I have the GB handle and the Pneumatic buffer.
So those two options are already there. It looks like the longer barrel is the key.
I have also been looking at adding this gas block.
http://micromoa.com/
-
- Senior Silent Operator
- Posts: 131
- Joined: Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:21 am
- Location: central missouri
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Actul smoke is mostly lubricant burning. Use a lube with higher smoke point.Bendersquint wrote:Welcome to suppressed 5.56 shooting, its nasty!wetboyz wrote:I need some advice please.
My AR is smoking me to death
I am running a NFA 7" upper with a Gemtech m4-02
I have replaced the FA to the one that is a gas port only
I have regulated the gas port
It runs nice but the "smoke" is killing me.
So, the questions are:
1. is there anything else to do to lessen this on the existing platform?
2. If I need to increase the barrel length, should it be 10.5/14.5 or 16- which works best?
3. Other suggestions?
Thank you.
The short barrel is definitely not doing you any favors and aside from masive backpressure its killing your can! Most manufacturers won't warrant anything under 10".
I would do a couple things if I were dealing with this.
Get a longer barrel like a 10-11.5" and see if that helps. The longer the barrel the less the pressures inside the can which translate into less blowback.
Tweak the gas flow(adjustable gas block). If you have one already its not working.
Look into heavier buffers to slo the action and keep it locked a fraction longer, that dwell may be enough to drop that backpressure to more tolerable levels.
A 10.5 and longer barrel will/should have a carbine length gas port. Shorter have pistol ports... means more burning powder blowing back into the action. This means your bolt and action heat up FAR faster with far more gas at higher temp and pressure coming into the receiver.
Personally I wouldn't go shorter 11.3" barrel lengths, the difference in baffle wear even compared to a 10.5" barrel and velocity/range is quite a bit... but still short enough that with a can you are still nice short and not getting too long.
Suppressors cost less than hearing aids..
-
- Silent But Deadly
- Posts: 4289
- Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 11:37 pm
- Location: South Sioux City, NE
- Contact:
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Switching to a higher volume 30 cal silencer will have the most effect.
NFA shooters blow their load with only one pull of the trigger.
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Thanks for considering my block.wetboyz wrote: I have also been looking at adding this gas block.
http://micromoa.com/
BTW, I do have a few customers using it for 7.5" 556 uppers.
We used the following port sizes:
.0625 for the unsuppressed position
.052 intermediate (for weaker ammo suppressed like PMC or reloads)
.043 for optimal suppressed using milspec ammo - LC M193 or LC M855
Note these were tested to work with a standard power (white Sprinco spring) and H2 buffer.
Some ammo is more gassy than others. PMC seems to be pretty gassy and much weaker than LC. Although the LC is much hotter than the PMC it is not as gassy.
Customers have been been very happy with these port sizes on their 7.5" uppers.
Below is a picture of one setup with our patented gasblock w/ a Silencerco Saker mounted.
Let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks!
http://micromoa.com
http://micromoa.com
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
My thoughts exactly.David Hineline wrote:Switching to a higher volume 30 cal silencer will have the most effect.
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
I have run an AAC 762SDN-6 on an 8" HK53 with no smoke at all. S&B ammo. Maybe the larger volume is what it takes. Don't have a dedicated 556 can. I've got a video around here somewhere.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rr_07f0ylp4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rr_07f0ylp4
-
- New Member
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 8:08 pm
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Also, get a PRI Gasbuster....it will help!
- plumber576
- Silent Operator
- Posts: 60
- Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2009 6:34 pm
- Location: Ohio
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Try the RTV sealant on the charging handle?
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Thanks. I will be definitely calling you to discuss this. Do you have any Silencertalk discounts?
So you change your plate recommendations based upon barrel length? The gas port should stay the same.
I am definitely going up in barrel size, its just what I can find in the 11/12/14 range
So you change your plate recommendations based upon barrel length? The gas port should stay the same.
I am definitely going up in barrel size, its just what I can find in the 11/12/14 range
MicroMOA wrote:Thanks for considering my block.wetboyz wrote: I have also been looking at adding this gas block.
http://micromoa.com/
BTW, I do have a few customers using it for 7.5" 556 uppers.
We used the following port sizes:
.0625 for the unsuppressed position
.052 intermediate (for weaker ammo suppressed like PMC or reloads)
.043 for optimal suppressed using milspec ammo - LC M193 or LC M855
Note these were tested to work with a standard power (white Sprinco spring) and H2 buffer.
Some ammo is more gassy than others. PMC seems to be pretty gassy and much weaker than LC. Although the LC is much hotter than the PMC it is not as gassy.
Customers have been been very happy with these port sizes on their 7.5" uppers.
Below is a picture of one setup with our patented gasblock w/ a Silencerco Saker mounted.
Let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks!
http://micromoa.com
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
[/quote] Actuallly smoke is mostly lubricant burning. Use a lube with higher smoke point. [/quote]
Would you mind discussing the lube issue, with a name please.
Would you mind discussing the lube issue, with a name please.
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
Yes I did. I even went to the Gas Buster Charging handle.plumber576 wrote:Try the RTV sealant on the charging handle?
Re: Terrible issue on supressed AR
wetboyz wrote: So you change your plate recommendations based upon barrel length? The gas port should stay the same.
Yes, the port in your barrel will stay the same. The Govnah basically gives you movable, replaceable gas ports at any port size you can drill. Unlike other tool less adjustable gas regulation methods out there currently on the market, the Govnah is the only one that uses a standard unmodified gas tube.
New article that just came out this past week explains the background and technical details extremely well here:
Part 1: http://www.recoilweb.com/micromoas-govn ... 38489.html
Part 2: http://www.recoilweb.com/micromoas-govn ... 38639.html
http://micromoa.com