General silencer discussion. If you want to talk about a specific silenced rifle or pistol, it is best to do that in the rifle or pistol section for that brand.
silencertalk wrote:I am happy. I could not have done 300 BLK without Remington.
No doubt, it's taken off quite well (it flat out killed 6.8 in no time at all) and that doesn't seem like it was an accident.
But you're not even a little disappointed in how things went down since/with Remington owning AAC? I mean, Henry was surely told he'd have a significant role at the Silencerco/SWR merger, then some new additions later and he's gone. Isn't that seemingly familiar to what happened at AAC?
If Remington gave you the ultimatum to move to Alabama, would you still feel the same way?
Joker31D wrote:Just when I start liking a company because of its products and the fact that they are a small company without drama, something like this happens.
Sad to see Henry go. I go way back with him and SWR. Best customer service ever. Seems like just yesterday the Spectre came out. What a revolution in .22 cans that started !
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Joker31D wrote:Just when I start liking a company because of its products and the fact that they are a small company without drama, something like this happens.
This sums it up pretty good for me.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDtd2jNIwAU MUSAFAR!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8CrOL-ydFMI This is Water DavidW
Complete Form 1s http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
This is a pet peeve of mine. Claiming you are innovating by laying off your star STEM talent. I hate it when business people do this without explaining how this will create more advancements. It's extremely difficult to assume he's doing anything but lying.
“Henry is a good man, and a good friend,” says SilencerCo CEO Joshua Waldron. “His departure was the best decision for SilencerCo as we continue to grow and innovate.
He was a senior selection board member in Special Operation Command’s Family of Muzzle Brakes, Flash Hiders and Suppressors program. That program resulted in the 2011 contract award and fielding of 5.56mm and 7.62mm silencers and muzzle devices across SOCOM.
After leaving the Army in 2012, Primiano spent a year working for OSS Suppressors,
“A year and a half of his enlisted time was spent as senior selection board member in charge of writing the current requirements for SOCOMs suppressor and muzzle device programs.”
He was a senior selection board member in Special Operation Command’s Family of Muzzle Brakes, Flash Hiders and Suppressors program. That program resulted in the 2011 contract award and fielding of 5.56mm and 7.62mm silencers and muzzle devices across SOCOM.
After leaving the Army in 2012, Primiano spent a year working for OSS Suppressors,
“A year and a half of his enlisted time was spent as senior selection board member in charge of writing the current requirements for SOCOMs suppressor and muzzle device programs.”
Emelio, at first I didn't understand your charged posts on this topic. But now I get it. Looks like you have a nose for this stuff.
Silencerco may reap massive profits from these moves but they got rid of the people that put them there. Makes me wonder how long before the next company comes along and usurps them in the performance realm. Is silencer tech mature? How much room is there to improve?
wacki wrote:Emelio, at first I didn't understand your charged posts on this topic. But now I get it. Looks like you have a nose for this stuff.
Silencerco may reap massive profits from these moves but they got rid of the people that put them there. Makes me wonder how long before the next company comes along and usurps them in the performance realm. Is silencer tech mature? How much room is there to improve?
Maybe this switch is to go at military contracts. Only thing I can think of for such a bone head move and sleazy practices.
Henry gave Stealerco a 50%+ line of top cans ,(probably out selling many of theirs ) and also helped with the Saker.
Member of the LSU, SWR, and RUGGED underground. Shame Silencerco!
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I wonder what the new head of SilencerCo marketing thinks about this thread. This isn't like the poster debate. NOBODY is supporting these moves. This is destroying what biz people call "good will".
Then again, if they have military contracts maybe they won't care?
Bender, looks like a silencer company niche is opening up. Good luck to you.
not that I've been around a long time but just watching trends over the past few years. AAC was considered the bomb for a long time. innovative designs, cool company, etc. They got bought out and had lots of internal changes. About the same time, SWR/SilencerCo seemed to ride the tide and became the "go to" company for innovative products, cool company, etc. Now it seems they are sliding out of favor (just a bit) by those "in the know"?
so who is the next big thing? hard to say, seems like I see a lot of info about Liberty these days. Could be just that they are a GA company and I live in GA? Definitely a smaller company, but doesn't have the massive backing/marketing of the other big players. Maybe Sig will step up with their recent changes? Or a new player may hire some old hands in the industry? Maybe AAC's move will kick start some innovation and delivery of some of their latest products?
Now that they are legal in more and more areas, hopefully the growth will spur more innovation and creative thinking, but IMHO the military contracts are a smaller and smaller portion of the companies sales (just a guess), so I'm sure they are looking harder at the civilian market which is more innovation and price driven. hence items like the Harvester?
SpeedyR wrote:not that I've been around a long time but just watching trends over the past few years. AAC was considered the bomb for a long time. innovative designs, cool company, etc. They got bought out and had lots of internal changes. About the same time, SWR/SilencerCo seemed to ride the tide and became the "go to" company for innovative products, cool company, etc. Now it seems they are sliding out of favor (just a bit) by those "in the know"?
so who is the next big thing? hard to say, seems like I see a lot of info about Liberty these days. Could be just that they are a GA company and I live in GA? Definitely a smaller company, but doesn't have the massive backing/marketing of the other big players. Maybe Sig will step up with their recent changes? Or a new player may hire some old hands in the industry? Maybe AAC's move will kick start some innovation and delivery of some of their latest products?
Now that they are legal in more and more areas, hopefully the growth will spur more innovation and creative thinking, but IMHO the military contracts are a smaller and smaller portion of the companies sales (just a guess), so I'm sure they are looking harder at the civilian market which is more innovation and price driven. hence items like the Harvester?
.Mil contracts have far far more potential for volume than commercial sales.
Why do you say that .mil is not innovation or price driven? Its quite the opposite.
Bendersquint wrote:.Mil contracts have far far more potential for volume than commercial sales.
Why do you say that .mil is not innovation or price driven? Its quite the opposite.
I guess what I was saying is that the differences from 5-8 years ago vs. today- looking at innovation and price points in the silencer industry? 8 years ago it was probably totally military driven, today (like literally today vs. 1 or even 2 years ago) it looks to be more "consumer" driven? but like I said I have no idea what they are developing or who they are developing it for...
Normally mil contracts could have much much greater volume than commercial, I was thinking more about current situation with mil spending cuts on some areas, it's not going to be the same as it was 4 or 5 years ago? I was also thinking that in the past 5 years there's been an explosion of sorts in civilian ownership in silencers. 10 years ago I only knew one or two people that had them and it was pretty unusual to see many sitting on the shelf at a shop let alone lots of choices and price points. And mostly based around mil calibers, vs. lots and lots of 22, 45, etc. calibers today?
Bendersquint wrote:.Mil contracts have far far more potential for volume than commercial sales.
Why do you say that .mil is not innovation or price driven? Its quite the opposite.
I guess what I was saying is that the differences from 5-8 years ago vs. today- looking at innovation and price points in the silencer industry? 8 years ago it was probably totally military driven, today (like literally today vs. 1 or even 2 years ago) it looks to be more "consumer" driven? but like I said I have no idea what they are developing or who they are developing it for...
Normally mil contracts could have much much greater volume than commercial, I was thinking more about current situation with mil spending cuts on some areas, it's not going to be the same as it was 4 or 5 years ago? I was also thinking that in the past 5 years there's been an explosion of sorts in civilian ownership in silencers. 10 years ago I only knew one or two people that had them and it was pretty unusual to see many sitting on the shelf at a shop let alone lots of choices and price points. And mostly based around mil calibers, vs. lots and lots of 22, 45, etc. calibers today?
Just gonna have to leave it that you are a bit off on your understandings on mil spending and what they are buying.
SpeedyR wrote:Works for me.. I have no clue about numbers.
it appears that way to you because you are on the civilian side and see that side of the business. most of the innovation and development has been driven by the military's programs, direction, and purchasing decisions.
the Harvester is not particularly innovative. it's a low cost thread on baffled can. Cans have had brakes and various attachments up front for years and years.
The main military drivers/purchsers are special operations which are not affected by budgets the same as the force at large. And they are buying cans and related products at larger numbers than ever before.
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JasonM wrote:
it appears that way to you because you are on the civilian side and see that side of the business. most of the innovation and development has been driven by the military's programs, direction, and purchasing decisions.
Can you name some of this innovation? I am unaware of anything they have driven that the commercial market did not want first. they just appear to drive it because they spec it out in a large contract, but careful analysis would show commercial wanted this years before and was ignored.
Commercial users are always asking for smaller, lighter, quieter.
Military is looking for accuracy, POI shift, weight, size, and durability generally with less focus on sound though in some cases, they push the limits of sound also.
I used to be all about the "quietest" but now I agree with the military goals.
