Incompetent Dealer

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jdasilva
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Incompetent Dealer

Post by jdasilva » Tue Jul 21, 2015 3:25 pm

This is the conversation that I had with my friend about him not being able to pick up his silencer because the wrong serial number was approved.



Friend:
Could not pick up suppessor today because ATF put wrong serial number on form 4

Me:
WTF?!!! What happens now?

Friend:
I knew it was too good to be true. The dealer said he will contact the ATF on Monday and see what's the fastest option to get it sent back out with correct serial number.


Me:
was it your dealer that put the wrong serial # on the form 4?


Friend:
When I got there to pick up the dealer said that the ATF put wrong serial number on form 4.


Me:
that's weird. The only place that the ATF writes the serial # is on the actual stamp. The form itself is filled out by the dealer & the NFA examiner signs & dates it


Friend:
I will be calling the NFA this week to find out what exactly happened and when I should expect the stamped. I am pissed been waiting over 4 months now to only have to wait longer.

Me:
i dont blame ya brother! id be furious!!! the head guy at the nfa is ted clutter. [email protected]


Friend:
Thanks for giving me his contact info I will get in touch with him. My second form 4 should be getting approved any day now I will make sure that the serial number is correct when I call them. I doubt I will ever apply for anymore tax stamps after this.


Me:
dont let that sway you. ive never heard of this happening & i'm leaning towards your dealer messing up.


Friend:
I am also leaning that way. If that turns out to be the case what do you think will happen.


Me:
scenario 1) ATF messed up: they expedite your stamp asap scenario 2) dealer put the wrong serial: umm i dont want to answer that

Ted can still expedite stuff. One examiner messed up on my form 1 & disapproved it. I emailed Ted & had my stamp the next day



Friend:
Okay thanks I will see what he says.


Friend:
The email you gave me did not work maybe that was his old one. I was able to find it though [email protected] just sent him an email explaining the situation just waiting to hear back.


Me:
good to know. what happened?


Friend:
I called in first thing Monday morning and they transferred me to the examiner Jesse Huff got voicemail and left him a message. I got no response yesterday so called back this morning and asked for Ted Clutter and got him on the phone. I explained what happened and he said that he would get me in touch with examiner. He transferred me to Jesse Huff and got his voicemail again left another message.


Friend:
I just got this email message from my dealer. When I last spoke to him he said that ATF put wrong serial number and he would be calling them this week to get fixed. His email read the following Turns out, the wholesaler, (former), even though I got billed, never received it. Which means his books and records are not correct. Could trigger and audit once ATF receives my letter. Best way to fix is to change the form 4 for the one Specwar I have in my inventory which is going out today.


Me:
break a leg sir


Friend:
Hers is rest of emails. ME:I don’t understand what you were trying to say in relation to wholesaler. Could you elaborate on this? Also you said that the ATF put wrong serial number on tax stamp. You showed me the Specwar 762 in person the very one you said I was purchasing when we filled out the form also so not sure what this has to do with wholesaler. And if you are suggesting starting over and sending out a fresh form 4 this is not an option. I am not willing to wait another 4 to 5 months when this should not have happened. I need clarification on what exactly happened in error. DEALER :No, I showed you a Specwar, not necessarily the one I purchased from the wholesaler. It's not going to take another 4 or 5 months. I only print page 1 of the Form 4s, they will expedite. As I explained, the wholesaler never sent me the suppressor. ME: You never mentioned anything about wholesaler when I was there last week to pick up suppressor. What you said was that the ATF got the serial number wrong and you would contact them on Monday to get fixed. So I was expecting and update with the status on that situation. Also the suppressor was purchased 2/20 so if there was problem with dealer that should have already been addressed with the dealer since it has been 5 months. And when you say expedite I need an exact time frame and want to know what will be done during that process. DEALER: I did further investigation, and realized the wholesaler was at fault. I reviewed my bound book and never received the suppressor. Evidently, ATF shows the original one to be in my inventory, when it is not. I can't give you an exact time date, as I cannot tell the ATF what to do. Normally, about two weeks. Had I not had another in stock, then yes, it would have been another 6 months. What you need to realize is that now that I have notified the wholesaler, and he does not respond, I am out 625.00 for a suppressor I am only making $40 on. I don't appreciate the attitude, I am doing everything to get it straightened out.


Me:
& if that was the case, all that would need to be done is for the wholesaler to send your dealer the can. not verifying a can's serial before sending out paperwork is really bad


Friend:
Dealer is [Retracted]. He also sent me an invoice showing where that he purchased the suppressor from them. (If you want to know the dealers name, PM me)


Me:
If you ever want another can, go with Capitol armory or silencer shop (Austin). they have the best prices & wont pull this type of BS. Locally, GT distributors & SAWinc but you'll pay msrp. This dealer should not be selling any firearms. When you sell a nfa weapon, you check & recheck the serial visually.


Friend:
You will not believe this I just called the wholesaler off the invoice the dealer emailed me. So the wholesaler stated that he shipped the suppressor to this guy back in April FedEx and they tried to deliver 3 times and he never picked up package. They also left it down there at hub for him to pick up for 5 days so after that they returned it to wholesaler. The wholesaler also says he emailed the dealer and has got no response. The wholesaler is emailing the FedEx tracking information that proves this. The wholesaler says he has suppressor siting right there and does not know what to do with it because the dealer will not get in touch with him.


Friend:
The wholesaler has sent me proof of him shipping the suppressor which I checked with the tracking number. He also sent me email correspondence that he sent the dealer.

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MJF1911
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by MJF1911 » Tue Jul 21, 2015 4:14 pm

I appears your friend should be able to get the can once the wholesaler ships it to the dealer. What a mess though. I'm lucky to have two very good and responsible dealers to work with.
SWR 556 Specwar, 762 Specwar, Octane 45HD, Spectre II; SilencerCo Osprey 45, Omega; AAC Pilot, 300TM; Ruger AC556
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jdasilva
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by jdasilva » Tue Jul 21, 2015 5:03 pm

MJF1911 wrote:I appears your friend should be able to get the can once the wholesaler ships it to the dealer. What a mess though. I'm lucky to have two very good and responsible dealers to work with.

I really hope so

rimshaker
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by rimshaker » Tue Jul 21, 2015 7:38 pm

Never send the F4 without seeing your silencer in person first. Physically fondling it.

Take pics of the serial# also. Ask for a copy of the approved F3 if it was tranferred to your dealer.
The F3 info helps in correctly filling out F4.

Can't stress enough how important the physical aspect of the process is.

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MJF1911
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by MJF1911 » Thu Jul 23, 2015 9:59 am

I've called my dealer and told them what I wanted and paperwork shows up in my mailbox a few days later. It isn't a big deal for me, I guess there are a lot of crappy dealers out there but mine are good.
SWR 556 Specwar, 762 Specwar, Octane 45HD, Spectre II; SilencerCo Osprey 45, Omega; AAC Pilot, 300TM; Ruger AC556
Rugged Oculus; Dead Air Sandman K

Kramer
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by Kramer » Thu Jul 23, 2015 12:45 pm

There are so many gun dealers that are total idiots and due to the complexities of the process they should not be dealing in NFA.

Ask around for a better dealer for your next NFA purchase and hopefully that one will go smoother.

sillycon
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by sillycon » Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:12 pm

There is one particular dealer who comes to my mind when it comes to serial number "mix ups". Is this in south Florida?

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YugoRPK
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by YugoRPK » Thu Jul 23, 2015 10:27 pm

rimshaker wrote:Never send the F4 without seeing your silencer in person first. Physically fondling it.

Take pics of the serial# also. Ask for a copy of the approved F3 if it was tranferred to your dealer.
The F3 info helps in correctly filling out F4.

Can't stress enough how important the physical aspect of the process is.
BS. As soon as the dealer places the order get that form 4 in. 3's run faster than 4's. Sure the scenario played out happes RARELY but its not worth waiting the extra 2-3 months. My dealer has the paperwork in muy hands 2 days after I pay for it from wherever it is I pay for it. If someone screws the pooch during the trip I don't care.
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rimshaker
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by rimshaker » Fri Jul 24, 2015 1:06 am

YugoRPK wrote:
rimshaker wrote:Never send the F4 without seeing your silencer in person first. Physically fondling it.

Take pics of the serial# also. Ask for a copy of the approved F3 if it was tranferred to your dealer.
The F3 info helps in correctly filling out F4.

Can't stress enough how important the physical aspect of the process is.
BS. As soon as the dealer places the order get that form 4 in. 3's run faster than 4's. Sure the scenario played out happes RARELY but its not worth waiting the extra 2-3 months. My dealer has the paperwork in muy hands 2 days after I pay for it from wherever it is I pay for it. If someone screws the pooch during the trip I don't care.
Overlapping F3/F4 submissions happens all the time, but it's still not good practice. After all, nothing is truly guaranteed.
Waiting an extra 2-3 months is better than getting your hand caught in the ATF cookie jar.

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YugoRPK
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by YugoRPK » Fri Jul 24, 2015 1:51 am

rimshaker wrote:
YugoRPK wrote:
rimshaker wrote:Never send the F4 without seeing your silencer in person first. Physically fondling it.

Take pics of the serial# also. Ask for a copy of the approved F3 if it was tranferred to your dealer.
The F3 info helps in correctly filling out F4.

Can't stress enough how important the physical aspect of the process is.
BS. As soon as the dealer places the order get that form 4 in. 3's run faster than 4's. Sure the scenario played out happes RARELY but its not worth waiting the extra 2-3 months. My dealer has the paperwork in muy hands 2 days after I pay for it from wherever it is I pay for it. If someone screws the pooch during the trip I don't care.
Overlapping F3/F4 submissions happens all the time, but it's still not good practice. After all, nothing is truly guaranteed.
Waiting an extra 2-3 months is better than getting your hand caught in the ATF cookie jar.
They dont care. They are going through the motions like all of us do. 4 before 3 , 3 before 4 whatever. You get the stamp at the end of the day and the vast majority of the time filing a 4 at the same time as the 3 will get the device in your hands months faster with no hassle. Sometimes its a hassle but its not really a hassle. Its just them slapping you on the wrist with no consequences other than a 2-3 month longer wait you would have had to endure anyway had you gone completely by the book. No laws are being broken just recommended procedures. Happened to me once in a dozen times and I didnt care and to be honest they didnt either. Still got the stamp.
Putting the laughter in manslaughter

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jdasilva
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by jdasilva » Fri Jul 24, 2015 1:59 am

sillycon wrote:There is one particular dealer who comes to my mind when it comes to serial number "mix ups". Is this in south Florida?

no, north texas

Joker31D
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Re: Incompetent Dealer

Post by Joker31D » Fri Jul 24, 2015 5:47 am

I thought mine was messed up, they took 14 months to get my Saker 762 in and tried convincing me that it took 13 months for my Osprey 45, then when we got it back they didnt notice that some info was missing from the form they approved. They also approved mine without cashing my check.
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