Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

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tf2addict
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Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by tf2addict » Sun Jan 31, 2016 12:38 pm

I understand that they are not required but I'm curious how many have them. Some people seem to think that they are required.

esh21167
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by esh21167 » Sun Jan 31, 2016 2:05 pm

I have one. The attorney that drafted mine said I should submit it with each NFA application. I have been doing that and have had 4 approved in the last year. My 'fear' is that if I don't, maybe I'll get rejected and have to wait even longer. Probably paranoia.

Elkins45
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Elkins45 » Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:12 pm

Yes, because that's how my lawyer set it up and I am glad. Have the Schedule A referred to by reference in the trust document means you can document the items the trust owns without having to mess with the actual trust documents themselves.

Every time I submit a new form the current version of Schedule A goes with it. So far I have six stamps and none have been denied.

rimshaker
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by rimshaker » Mon Feb 01, 2016 2:09 am

Actually one should prefer NOT to have a schedule A as part of a Trust because it's a convenient list of what's owned.

Anyone can easily see the full contents of the Trust. Not just the ATF, but any legal authority requesting to review it.
And you have to give it up. No choice. Since the schedule A is part of the complete Trust.

I prefer to have a Trust that incorporates Assignment pages, instead of a schedule A. So each ATF submission only lists the single item being applied for.
Makes compiling a list of what's in the Trust much harder to do and keep track of. Except for your own bookkeeping.

jimbo45
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by jimbo45 » Mon Feb 01, 2016 8:08 am

I have one on my thats how it was drafted. I'm not really concerned about it either.

projo198
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by projo198 » Mon Feb 01, 2016 11:44 am

Same here/ I always submit one. Don't know if I need to be doing it, but I have yet to have a form denied (except once due to my own stupidity) so I prefer to stick with what works. Nothing worse than getting that email saying your status has changed to "denied".

ericdraven
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by ericdraven » Tue Feb 02, 2016 12:25 am

never have and never been denied 9 for 9 .

Joker31D
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Joker31D » Mon Feb 15, 2016 5:09 am

I put my first form 1 in and am waiting, I have a Schedule A but it shows how much I paid for the Notary. Mine says that a Inventory will be maintained but doesn't include it by name other than to say it will exist. My lawyer said he doesn't put them in because they become public record when you file them with the court.
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Toetagger
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Toetagger » Mon Feb 15, 2016 11:49 am

For those of you with a Schedule A--what did you have on it for your first application?
1. nothing
2. a non-NFA firearm
3. a dollar bill with the serial number
4. didn't include a Schedule A on your first submission

I'm getting ready to efile a form 1 sbr and I'd really appreciate your feedback. Thanks.

Loki_stormbringer
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Loki_stormbringer » Mon Feb 15, 2016 11:56 am

If your trust has a schedule A. Put all your s--t that was purchased through that trust on the schedule A. Send it with your trust. You don't add the new item to your current trust as the transfer hasn't been approved yet. That is my understanding and how I have been doing my form 4s.

Toetagger
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Toetagger » Mon Feb 15, 2016 12:04 pm

Loki_stormbringer wrote:If your trust has a schedule A. Put all your s--t that was purchased through that trust on the schedule A. Send it with your trust. You don't add the new item to your current trust as the transfer hasn't been approved yet. That is my understanding and how I have been doing my form 4s.
I understand that, I'm asking what I should do with my FIRST application. In other words I currently own zero nfa items and zero property purchased with my trust.

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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by rimshaker » Mon Feb 15, 2016 12:26 pm

By strict definition, the sole purpose of any Trust is to hold property. If it doesn't hold anything, then it can be legally argued that it's very existence isn't kosher.

So when you get a new Trust notarized into existence, it doesn't stop there. You should also be assigning some tangible property into the trust the very same day.
This is where folks talk about putting all sorts of things in the trust just to say there's something in it. I used a crispy $2 bill for mine.

Ridiculous technicality? Sure. But your Trust is on solid legal foundation, no matter the possible technicalities thrown at it in the future.

Put something into the trust. And include the schedule A that shows that first item. If the Trust mentions a schedule A it must be included anyway.

Toetagger
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Toetagger » Mon Feb 15, 2016 12:31 pm

rimshaker wrote:By strict definition, the sole purpose of any Trust is to hold property. If it doesn't hold anything, then it can be legally argued that it's very existence isn't kosher.

So when you get a new Trust notarized into existence, it doesn't stop there. You should also be assigning some tangible property into the trust the very same day.
This is where folks talk about putting all sorts of things in the trust just to say there's something in it. I used a crispy $2 bill for mine.

Ridiculous technicality? Sure. But your Trust is on solid legal foundation, no matter the possible technicalities thrown at it in the future.

Put something into the trust. And include the schedule A that shows that first item. If the Trust mentions a schedule A it must be included anyway.

Thank you so much for this explanation. It totally makes sense when you put it that way. I appreciate your help....

jrmy_1
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by jrmy_1 » Tue Feb 16, 2016 11:17 pm

I have scheduled A but used $10 in trust paperwork, not in scheduled A. Then, sched. A isn't required to prove validity of trust, all future assets in trust name go on schedule A.....could be multiple pages of schedule A as well if don't want to show everything.

LawBob
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by LawBob » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:27 pm

ericdraven wrote:never have and never been denied 9 for 9 .
If your trust references an A then it's part of the trust.

Best not to have one.

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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by LawBob » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:28 pm

Toetagger wrote:
rimshaker wrote:By strict definition, the sole purpose of any Trust is to hold property. If it doesn't hold anything, then it can be legally argued that it's very existence isn't kosher.

So when you get a new Trust notarized into existence, it doesn't stop there. You should also be assigning some tangible property into the trust the very same day.
This is where folks talk about putting all sorts of things in the trust just to say there's something in it. I used a crispy $2 bill for mine.

Ridiculous technicality? Sure. But your Trust is on solid legal foundation, no matter the possible technicalities thrown at it in the future.

Put something into the trust. And include the schedule A that shows that first item. If the Trust mentions a schedule A it must be included anyway.

Thank you so much for this explanation. It totally makes sense when you put it that way. I appreciate your help....
Or incorporate the res in the text to the trust without reference to a sch a

Dan214
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Dan214 » Fri Feb 19, 2016 7:19 am

LawBob wrote:
Toetagger wrote:
rimshaker wrote:By strict definition, the sole purpose of any Trust is to hold property. If it doesn't hold anything, then it can be legally argued that it's very existence isn't kosher.

So when you get a new Trust notarized into existence, it doesn't stop there. You should also be assigning some tangible property into the trust the very same day.
This is where folks talk about putting all sorts of things in the trust just to say there's something in it. I used a crispy $2 bill for mine.

Ridiculous technicality? Sure. But your Trust is on solid legal foundation, no matter the possible technicalities thrown at it in the future.

Put something into the trust. And include the schedule A that shows that first item. If the Trust mentions a schedule A it must be included anyway.

Thank you so much for this explanation. It totally makes sense when you put it that way. I appreciate your help....
Or incorporate the res in the text to the trust without reference to a sch a
+1 A well-written trust uses individual assignment sheets and does not mention a schedule A, which is only required if mentioned. As a result, there is no master list of your firearms that gets passed around.

Toetagger
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Toetagger » Fri Feb 19, 2016 10:17 am

After carefully re-reading my trust it makes no mention of a Shedule A, only an assignment to the trust in which I entrusted a $2 bill. Should be good to go and not have to give out a list of all my nfa items in the future.

jrmy_1
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by jrmy_1 » Fri Feb 19, 2016 1:37 pm

So if you have an appendix A, couldn't you simply reference assignment sheets on the schedule A?

So does your trust reference "assignment sheets" in the trust verbiage? If so, it's just another name for "appendix A" or if you'd like, call it "tomatoes sheet". I don't understand how what you call your list that designates trust property makes a difference with anything.

My trust specifically says it is valid via the $10 I provided to the trustee so whether I have anything in the appendix A or not, the trust is valid, e
G. I don't need to declare the appendix A to prove property/validity.

I could use a 100 page appendix A as well, or assignment sheet, whatever you want to call it, and still only show 1 item.

I don't understand how changing the name has anything to do with whether it's considered part of the trust or not. Sounds like law sales pitch to me.....

Philrozzi
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by Philrozzi » Tue Feb 23, 2016 7:53 pm

I did my own trust and Schedule A was included. When I first purchased my suppressor I put that suppressor in the schedule.

Question, since you're only supposed to send copies of the trust what to do guys do when the notary seal isn't visible in photocopies or does it even matter? Mine didn't get denied for it so I was curious.

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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by YugoRPK » Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:50 am

I have one. Helps me keep track of things more than anything else.
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tf2addict
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Re: Does your NFA Trust have a Schedule A?

Post by tf2addict » Mon Mar 07, 2016 8:16 pm

Just to clear up some apparent confusion here, if you don't use a Schedule A you can assign the initial property ($1 or whatever) in the trust document itself. As you add property you use an Assignment page.

Here's a good explanation of why not to use a Schedule A. It's not a huge deal either way IMO but there is no advantage to going the Schedule A route.

http://www.myguntrust.com/schedule-a-question.html

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