Deciding on a 7.62 Can

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Doctor Jenks
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Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Fri May 13, 2016 3:45 pm

Hey everyone. I've been lurking here for about a year. I've really appreciated the opinions and experience I've seen here.

So, I've decided I want to pick up a supressor to use with my rifles. This will be my second suppressor, the first was my SiCo Octane 45.

I looked at the hybrid for a bit, but after speaking to someone from Silencerco, decided the Omega would be a better choice since I have the octane for pistol already. I was all but decided when I started looking around, in the name of being thorough, and found the rugged suppressor line, specifically the surge with it's modular design. I like the idea of being able to switch length/weight without buying a new supressor. Not sure if it's just a gimmick. Seems like the Omega is shorter than both and falls somewhere in the middle in regards to performance.

I found the Sandman K and L interesting as well.

Mostly I'll be using this suppressor for 5.56, .308, and maybe 300BLK down the road. I'm kind of leaning towards the omega still, I like how light and short it is. Any other thoughts or suggestions on deciding between the 3? Or perhaps another suppressor suggestion?

Thanks!

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by AlabamaPaul » Fri May 13, 2016 6:00 pm

All of those are great cans. If you are using a trust or other entity to purchase, get whichever one happens to be in stock.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Hned » Fri May 13, 2016 7:21 pm

I have similar needs/goals, and after "test driving" a variety of suppressors from 8 different manufacturers at the Quiet Riot Firearms May Day suppressor event this past weekend, I decided to purchase the Rugged Surge 7.62 can for use on my existing 5.56 rifles (16" and 10.5" barrels) and to accommodate the forthcoming 300BLK and .308 rifles. The Surge is very effective; it is versatile for multiple calibers, various barrel lengths, and in either a short or long configuration; it is all stainless steel; it has a great double-sealed mounting system; and Rugged has a no-questions-asked 100% unconditional lifetime guarantee on all their suppressors, "even if you drop it from a mountain" so to speak. If you are interested, you are welcome to contact Chris or Jake at Quiet Riot Firearms. Enjoy your decision-making and the end result, whatever you decide to purchase!

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Fri May 13, 2016 10:05 pm

[quote="Hned"]I have similar needs/goals, and after "test driving" a variety of suppressors from 8 different manufacturers at the Quiet Riot Firearms May Day suppressor event this past weekend, I decided to purchase the Rugged Surge 7.62 can for use on my existing 5.56 rifles (16" and 10.5" barrels) and to accommodate the forthcoming 300BLK and .308 rifles. The Surge is very effective; it is versatile for multiple calibers, various barrel lengths, and in either a short or long configuration; it is all stainless steel; it has a great double-sealed mounting system; and Rugged has a no-questions-asked 100% unconditional lifetime guarantee on all their suppressors, "even if you drop it from a mountain" so to speak. If you are interested, you are welcome to contact Chris or Jake at Quiet Riot Firearms. Enjoy your decision-making and the end result, whatever you decide to purchase![/quoteCongrats. Hopefully the rugged surge works out for you. What ended up drawing you to the Surge? Did your also try the Omega?

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by quiettime » Sat May 14, 2016 7:02 am

If you don't plan to buy other cans I'd lean towards the Surge.

It's like choosing Ferrari, Lamborghini or Bugatti between your choices. All great cans

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by CanOfWhooppass » Sat May 14, 2016 3:10 pm

I don't think the Omega is a good choice if you intend to do much high volume high rate from a SBR. +1 Surge!
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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Darkamek » Sun May 15, 2016 7:49 am

I would also go with the surge. I recently purchased the Sandman S but that was only because the price was hard to pass up, otherwise I would of rather had the surge.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Hned » Sun May 15, 2016 11:25 am

Doctor Jenks wrote:What ended up drawing you to the Surge? Did your also try the Omega?
Yes. Both the Omega and the Surge are very effective and well-built cans. Your selection of either one should simply be a matter of what best meets your needs, especially since this isn't an inexpensive purchase. What drove me to select the Surge? Since I have multiple barrel lengths -- 7", 10.5", and 16" -- and various calibers, I like having the Surge's flexibility to change its length and adapt to different calibers. Although the Surge is slightly heavier than the Omega, I like the high strength and durability of the Surge's Stellite baffles, in addition to the stainless steel tube and mount. I also like the Surge's double-sealed mounting system better than the Omega's. And finally, I like the comfort of having Rugged's "no-questions-asked" unconditional lifetime guarantee. 'Hope that this information is helpful to you, and that you enjoy using whatever your suppressor selection is!

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by quiettime » Sun May 15, 2016 12:42 pm

Hned wrote:
Doctor Jenks wrote:lthough the Surge is slightly heavier than the Omega, I like the high strength and durability of the Surge's Stellite baffles, in addition to the stainless steel tube and mount.
And it's not really that much heavier, the Omega weight is listed with the direct thread mount so you add another few ounces with the ASR

They are both great cans though, each very quiet with its own set of advantages

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Sun May 15, 2016 1:40 pm

quiettime wrote:
Hned wrote:
Doctor Jenks wrote:lthough the Surge is slightly heavier than the Omega, I like the high strength and durability of the Surge's Stellite baffles, in addition to the stainless steel tube and mount.
And it's not really that much heavier, the Omega weight is listed with the direct thread mount so you add another few ounces with the ASR

They are both great cans though, each very quiet with its own set of advantages
That's good to know. One reason that has me leaning towards the Omega is weight and length. For the moment, I don't have any SBRS. I have a LW Daniel Defense v11 that seems a shame to weigh down. :) I'm curious how the shortened version of the rugged performs next to the Omega.

It's funny, I all but decided on the Omega yesterday when I got a return call from silencershop, and a few more responses from you folks. The Silencershop guy says that the rugged surge is their new favorite. And apparently a favorite here as well.
Last edited by Doctor Jenks on Sun May 15, 2016 2:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Hned » Sun May 15, 2016 2:13 pm

My understanding is that the Omega's published 14 oz. weight is listed with the direct thread mount only. So you have to add another few ounces if you choose to use the Active Spring Retention (ASR™) mount (for quick-attach/detach use with the included Specwar™ ASR muzzle brake). Contrarily, the Surge's published 17.5 oz. weight (in short 7.5" configuration) includes the weight of its monolithic 17-4 PH stainless steel mount with the Quick-Detach Dual-Taper Locking System™. Although I wasn't able to actually weigh each suppressor and shoot with them "side-by-side," I would comfortably speculate that any difference in weight during actual use with the quick-attach/detach mounting systems is negligible and undetectable.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Sun May 15, 2016 2:21 pm

Just re-read my last post, I had several autocorrect errors. I should have proofread better. Fixed.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Sun May 15, 2016 2:23 pm

Hned wrote:My understanding is that the Omega's published 14 oz. weight is listed with the direct thread mount only. So you have to add another few ounces if you choose to use the Active Spring Retention (ASR™) mount (for quick-attach/detach use with the included Specwar™ ASR muzzle brake). Contrarily, the Surge's published 17.5 oz. weight (in short 7.5" configuration) includes the weight of its monolithic 17-4 PH stainless steel mount with the Quick-Detach Dual-Taper Locking System™. Although I wasn't able to actually weigh each suppressor and shoot with them "side-by-side," I would comfortably speculate that any difference in weight during actual use with the quick-attach/detach mounting systems is negligible and undetectable.
Thanks. How did you like the shortened configuration of the Surge? Would you ever use it this way?

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by CanOfWhooppass » Sun May 15, 2016 2:51 pm

Silencershop says that the rugged surge is everyone's new favorite.

Did they also mention that Silencerco stopped doing bussiness with them and they can't sell you an Omega?


I've purchased several cans from them, so I'm not against them at all. But unbiased they are not. When they got the boot from Silencerco they went and added into the descriptions on many of the cans about how better thing have come out. Even though there is some truth to what they, they have not done that with any other brand they sell.

Personaly, I think the reason they haven't taken all the Silencerco suppressors off their site is to bait and switch customers into what they Do have to sell.

Just saying, take that advice knowing the whole story.

That BS aside, both are great cans, but two me, two different intended uses. I consider the Surge in short form = Saker but can also go long for Specwar performance. To go lighter than Saker 7.62 / Surge short you either give up suppression ie. Razor or durability ie. Omega.

I have 3 rifle cans: Saker 7.62 (mounts nicely under AR handguard), Surge and Razor.

Unless I was going to dedicate it to a low capacity target rifle, I'd get another Surge before the Omega, but I'm a soldier at hart that mostly plays fast paced range games.
Last edited by CanOfWhooppass on Sun May 15, 2016 3:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by CanOfWhooppass » Sun May 15, 2016 3:05 pm

Doctor Jenks wrote:Thanks. How did you like the shortened configuration of the Surge? Would you ever use it this way?
Yes for sure. Max suppression is great but the shortest lightest hearing safe can is the opposite side of that greatness coin. Surge short is the middle option.
If you ever take a carbine course you will be so glad it gets shorter than 9".
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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Sun May 15, 2016 3:22 pm

CanOfWhooppass wrote:Silencershop says that the rugged surge is everyone's new favorite.

Did they also mention that Silencerco stopped doing bussiness with them and they can't sell you an Omega?


I've purchased several cans from them, so I'm not against them at all. But unbiased they are not. When they got the boot from Silencerco they went and added into the descriptions on many of the cans about how better thing have come out. Even though there is some truth to what they, they have not done that with any other brand they sell.

Personaly, I think the reason they haven't taken all the Silencerco suppressors off their site is to bait and switch customers into what they Do have to sell.

Just saying, take that advice knowing the whole story.

That BS aside, both are great cans, but two me, two different intended uses. I consider the Surge in short form = Saker but can also go long for Specwar performance. To go lighter than Saker 7.62 / Surge short you either give up suppression ie. Razor or durability ie. Omega.

I have 3 rifle cans: Saker 7.62 (mounts nicely under AR handguard), Surge and Razor.

Unless I was going to dedicate it to a low capacity target rifle, I'd get another Surge before the Omega, but I'm a soldier at hart that mostly plays fast paced range games.
Yes, that was the first thing he said. They are no longer a distributor for Silencerco. The fact that he was upfront about it gives him some credibility in that regard, but we should still take that advice with a grain of salt since there may be some residual hard feelings/bias there.

Also, it's probably important to note that he wasn't making a comparison to the Omega; he was simply expressing how much they've enjoyed the Surge.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by CanOfWhooppass » Sun May 15, 2016 3:33 pm

Doctor Jenks wrote:
CanOfWhooppass wrote:Silencershop says that the rugged surge is everyone's new favorite.

Did they also mention that Silencerco stopped doing bussiness with them and they can't sell you an Omega?


I've purchased several cans from them, so I'm not against them at all. But unbiased they are not. When they got the boot from Silencerco they went and added into the descriptions on many of the cans about how better thing have come out. Even though there is some truth to what they, they have not done that with any other brand they sell.

Personaly, I think the reason they haven't taken all the Silencerco suppressors off their site is to bait and switch customers into what they Do have to sell.

Just saying, take that advice knowing the whole story.

That BS aside, both are great cans, but two me, two different intended uses. I consider the Surge in short form = Saker but can also go long for Specwar performance. To go lighter than Saker 7.62 / Surge short you either give up suppression ie. Razor or durability ie. Omega.

I have 3 rifle cans: Saker 7.62 (mounts nicely under AR handguard), Surge and Razor.

Unless I was going to dedicate it to a low capacity target rifle, I'd get another Surge before the Omega, but I'm a soldier at hart that mostly plays fast paced range games.
Yes, that was the first thing he said. They are no longer a distributor for Silencerco. The fact that he was upfront about it gives him some credibility in that regard, but we should still take that advice with a grain of salt since there may be some residual hard feelings/bias there.
I'm glad it was mentioned up front, I was informed after paying for an Octane that they could switch it to a different can or refund my money, left more of a bad taste than I had admitted to myself even though I really like the Revolution 45.

EDIT - to be clear I placed an on line order without speaking to a person, later I was told no inventory and offered options.
Last edited by CanOfWhooppass on Sun May 15, 2016 4:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Sun May 15, 2016 4:07 pm

CanOfWhooppass wrote: I'm glad it was mentioned up front, I was informed after paying for an Octane that they could switch it to a different can or refund my money, left more of a bad taste than I had admitted to myself even though I really like the Revolution 45.
Ah, that sucks. I've had pretty good luck with them, i think i bought my Octane 45 from them just before or just after their falling out with Silencerco. Currently, the Omega just shows as out of stock on their website. It definitely seems like they could make it more clear that they no longer carry Silencerco. They still have an option to join the waitlist. Could be a long wait. LOL.

Thanks for the advice on the Surge. I'm very intrigued by the modular design. I like the warranty, although I'm a bit apprehensive about the fact that it's such a young company. A warranty doesn't mean much if the company doesn't make it.

In any case, I've got a lot to think about. :)

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by roodyrocker » Sun May 15, 2016 8:25 pm

Doctor Jenks wrote:
CanOfWhooppass wrote:Silencershop says that the rugged surge is everyone's new favorite.

Did they also mention that Silencerco stopped doing bussiness with them and they can't sell you an Omega?


I've purchased several cans from them, so I'm not against them at all. But unbiased they are not. When they got the boot from Silencerco they went and added into the descriptions on many of the cans about how better thing have come out. Even though there is some truth to what they, they have not done that with any other brand they sell.

Personaly, I think the reason they haven't taken all the Silencerco suppressors off their site is to bait and switch customers into what they Do have to sell.

Just saying, take that advice knowing the whole story.

That BS aside, both are great cans, but two me, two different intended uses. I consider the Surge in short form = Saker but can also go long for Specwar performance. To go lighter than Saker 7.62 / Surge short you either give up suppression ie. Razor or durability ie. Omega.

I have 3 rifle cans: Saker 7.62 (mounts nicely under AR handguard), Surge and Razor.

Unless I was going to dedicate it to a low capacity target rifle, I'd get another Surge before the Omega, but I'm a soldier at hart that mostly plays fast paced range games.
Yes, that was the first thing he said. They are no longer a distributor for Silencerco. The fact that he was upfront about it gives him some credibility in that regard, but we should still take that advice with a grain of salt since there may be some residual hard feelings/bias there.

Also, it's probably important to note that he wasn't making a comparison to the Omega; he was simply expressing how much they've enjoyed the Surge.
In fairness to The Silencershop, I bought a Surge 7.62 from them last year before this businees with Silencerco happened. They were impressed by it back then and stated it wasn't just the suppression but the mounting system on it is top notch. To clarify, I called to buy a Surge but asked about others just in case. So they did not steer me to it. I have no affiliation with them other than buying a few items and the Surge from them.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by db0 » Wed May 18, 2016 10:28 pm

Seems to me the Omega doesn't get the credit it deserves considering the video that Capitol Armory put out showing it standing up to multiple full auto mag dumps. No one even has the ammo budget to do that on any kind of regular basis, and I'm sure you could do what they did a few times a year and you'd have no issues with it. Homestly i think a lot of people think they need the same requirements that a Navy Seal has for their gear... If you're not punching a door open with the end of your suppressor or dig a trench with it, you will probably never see any difference in a Saker/Surge vs the Omega. Not to mention SilencerCo has the same lifetime warranty that the Surge does. It's shorter and lighter than the Surge, so I think it's not fair to the community to not mention the Omega as one of the top centenders for 5.56 & 7.62 rifle suppression for a solid balance of suppression, length and weight. My understanding is that it's marginally shorter, lighter and has been measured in some cases to be better at suppression compared to the Surge.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Hned » Wed May 18, 2016 11:16 pm

db0 wrote:...Not to mention SilencerCo has the same lifetime warranty that the Surge does.
I think you may be incorrect on that point, since the SilencerCo Omega's owners manual specifically states in writing (on page 15): "LIMITED LIFETIME WARRANTY -- LIMITATIONS TO WARRANTY: THIS WARRANTY DOES NOT COVER DAMAGE TO THE SUPPRESSOR OR THE HOST FIREARM RESULTING FROM CARELESS OR IRRESPONSIBLE HANDLING, ADJUSTMENTS OR MODIFICATIONS TO ITS DESIGN, NEGLIGENCE OR OTHER ABUSE. ...SILENCERCO DOES NOT COVER DAMAGE TO THE SUPPRESSOR OR THE HOST FIREARM RESULTING FROM IMPROPER HAND-LOADED OR RELOADED AMMUNITION OR DEFECTIVE AMMUNITION."

Contrarily, the Surge 762 "Operator's Manual" states in writing (on page 1): "UNCONDITIONAL LIFETIME WARRANTY. If for any reason you have an issue with a Rugged Design product, we will repair or replace it free of charge." Rugged Suppressors also states elsewhere in writing, "With Rugged Suppressors’s strict quality control measures and use of premium materials, we can offer an Unconditional Lifetime Warranty. If for any reason you have an issue with a Rugged Suppressors product, we will repair or replace it free of charge. Even if you drop it from a mountain. That’s why it’s called an Unconditional Lifetime Warranty and that’s why there’s no small legal type needed."

Regardless of the above significant difference in warranties, both the Omega and the Surge are high-quality, very effective suppressors.

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by rimshaker » Thu May 19, 2016 1:20 am

Doctor Jenks wrote:Thanks for the advice on the Surge. I'm very intrigued by the modular design. I like the warranty, although I'm a bit apprehensive about the fact that it's such a young company. A warranty doesn't mean much if the company doesn't make it.
Young company by name only. Henry Graham was one of the top guys at Silencerco, and before that he owned SWR.

Lot of spinoffs from Silencerco recently. Mike Pappas also left to start up Dead Air Armament.

Everyone knows everybody still so i wouldn't worry about warranties :mrgreen:

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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by [email protected] » Fri May 20, 2016 9:40 am

Dead Air, Rugged, SilencerCo--- don't worry about warranty. They will all take care of you.

Keep in mind there's a business aspect of this, so some lawyer talk--- if SilencerCo states they will fix anything no matter what, someone eventually is going to purposely destroy cans over and over and over again to be a pain. Think of it like a restaurant, if they say "If your meal isn't perfect, it's free." You're going to eventually get people that just go in every day and say it's not perfect, and they want it free.

From being in the industry, I have absolute faith that all of those companies are going to take care of our clients--- regardless of what is printed out on a manual or site somewhere.
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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by CanOfWhooppass » Fri May 20, 2016 10:05 am

db0 wrote:Seems to me the Omega doesn't get the credit it deserves considering the video that Capitol Armory put out showing it standing up to multiple full auto mag dumps. No one even has the ammo budget to do that on any kind of regular basis, and I'm sure you could do what they did a few times a year and you'd have no issues with it. Homestly i think a lot of people think they need the same requirements that a Navy Seal has for their gear... If you're not punching a door open with the end of your suppressor or dig a trench with it, you will probably never see any difference in a Saker/Surge vs the Omega. Not to mention SilencerCo has the same lifetime warranty that the Surge does. It's shorter and lighter than the Surge, so I think it's not fair to the community to not mention the Omega as one of the top centenders for 5.56 & 7.62 rifle suppression for a solid balance of suppression, length and weight. My understanding is that it's marginally shorter, lighter and has been measured in some cases to be better at suppression compared to the Surge.
I think the Omega deserves much credit, but since it's barrel restrictions are more conservitive than other options with full Stelite stacks it is suboptimal for a high rate SBR's. If not a concern for the OP then it's better in some ways, if he has a slidefire stock and teenage boys, maybe worse.
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Re: Deciding on a 7.62 Can

Post by Doctor Jenks » Fri May 20, 2016 10:22 am

[email protected] wrote:Dead Air, Rugged, SilencerCo--- don't worry about warranty. They will all take care of you.

Keep in mind there's a business aspect of this, so some lawyer talk--- if SilencerCo states they will fix anything no matter what, someone eventually is going to purposely destroy cans over and over and over again to be a pain. Think of it like a restaurant, if they say "If your meal isn't perfect, it's free." You're going to eventually get people that just go in every day and say it's not perfect, and they want it free.

From being in the industry, I have absolute faith that all of those companies are going to take care of our clients--- regardless of what is printed out on a manual or site somewhere.
I thought about this when I saw the Rugged warranty. How long until some idiot starts blowing suppressors up (or dropping them off mountains) on purpose, just to see how often Rugged will replace it.

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