O.K. Here's the deal. I ordered and paid in full for a Ghost M way back in March (March 3rd to be exact). At the time, my dealer told me that his distributer had them in stock. It is now 6 months later and I have yet to fill out a form 4. My dealer apparently hasn't received it yet. I have emailed him and his general line is "I feel your pain man, things are taking forever right now..." He doesn't appear to be concerned.
I have ordered from this guy before and he has come through. He is a fellow vet and seems like a decent guy. That said, I don't know his distributor. 6 months seams like a long time for a form 3. My guess is that the distributer had them in stock but sold out before my order went through.
My guess is that he had to back order one form Dead Air which took god knows how long followed by a 5 to 7 week wait for a form 3 to the distributer and another 5 to 7 week wait for the form 3 to the dealer.
Does this sound about right?
Should I be concerned? Is there a follow up question that I should be asking my dealer or does all of this sound pretty typical?
I haven't even filled out the form 4 yet and I have been waiting 6 months for a suppressor that was supposedly "in stock" when I ordered it.
Ghost M
Moderators: mpallett, mr fixit, bakerjw, renegade
Re: Ghost M
I waited a year (almost to the day) for my first suppressor.
That said, your situation is a little bit different, because you technically haven't started waiting yet.
Are you concerned that your Class III is screwing up? Or are you concerned that it's the manufacturer?
Assuming I haven't misunderstood your scenario, if you haven't started the actual wait yet, then what obligation do you have to continue with this purchase from this manufacturer and this dealer?
All of that said, I have also waited a very long time for non-NFA gun-stuff that I thought should've been a business-week at most. I do not understand what's going on at some of these places... disorganization? Lack of urgency on current work-load? Excessive back-log of work? Perhaps a 'down' machine that they themselves are having to wait on? It just always felt like the person was doing just one step on the project per week... and then it would sit un-touched and unfinished on their work-bench until they got around to it later?
I don't have answers.
But... 6-months overall isn't a big deal. It just really depends on where you're actually waiting.
That said, your situation is a little bit different, because you technically haven't started waiting yet.
Are you concerned that your Class III is screwing up? Or are you concerned that it's the manufacturer?
Assuming I haven't misunderstood your scenario, if you haven't started the actual wait yet, then what obligation do you have to continue with this purchase from this manufacturer and this dealer?
All of that said, I have also waited a very long time for non-NFA gun-stuff that I thought should've been a business-week at most. I do not understand what's going on at some of these places... disorganization? Lack of urgency on current work-load? Excessive back-log of work? Perhaps a 'down' machine that they themselves are having to wait on? It just always felt like the person was doing just one step on the project per week... and then it would sit un-touched and unfinished on their work-bench until they got around to it later?
I don't have answers.
But... 6-months overall isn't a big deal. It just really depends on where you're actually waiting.
Re: Ghost M
I paid in full 6 months ago so changing my mind isn't really an option. The thing is, I don't where this thing is in the process. it would be different if my dealer just said here's the deal and laid it all out there. I think he the sort of guy that hates to deliver bad news though. 6 months in, I don't even know if my can has even been manufactured.
Re: Ghost M
Keep in mind, we are talking 6 months for a form 3 to dealer...
Re: Ghost M
The ATF has been -- possibly literally -- covered in an avalanche of Form 4s. I think there was one class III dealer in Texas, for example, that had a ton delivered at the beginning of the summer in an attempt to beat some deadline. And by "a ton", I mean 2,000 pounds of form 4s.
Now I realize that you're potentially waiting for a manufacturer's form 3 to clear, and while that's not a form 4, it still may have difficulties if it's relying on action from the ATF who are currently inundated, and wholly incompetent at seemingly every aspect of their irrelevant existence.
Side-note: if you're an ATF agent; alcohol, tobacco, and firearms are all legal, so why don't you go hang yourself? I'm told that paracord is particularly exciting, because if you jump from a high enough point, you might get a partial decapitation. And then you could bring meaning to a coroner's life even if you haven't brought anything to anyone else's.
Now I realize that you're potentially waiting for a manufacturer's form 3 to clear, and while that's not a form 4, it still may have difficulties if it's relying on action from the ATF who are currently inundated, and wholly incompetent at seemingly every aspect of their irrelevant existence.
Side-note: if you're an ATF agent; alcohol, tobacco, and firearms are all legal, so why don't you go hang yourself? I'm told that paracord is particularly exciting, because if you jump from a high enough point, you might get a partial decapitation. And then you could bring meaning to a coroner's life even if you haven't brought anything to anyone else's.
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5th_Amendment
- Member
- Posts: 41
- Joined: Wed Jul 13, 2016 7:25 pm
- Location: New Hampshire
Re: Ghost M
I have no experience with this scenario ... but I'd be asking for a full refund on the Ghost and would just buy from someone else. No fault on anyone, no hard feelings, it just is what it is. It'll sell immediately when it eventually artives so it's not going to sit. Awesome suppressor.
As for ATF, I had an odd situation recently and had to call ATF on a form 4 Omega 9k that I bought and mailed early July. A very nice lady told me my paperwork was not in the system yet. They have no record of it, though my money order was cashed. She then said that ATF was REALLY far behind and that the situation was not unusual and not to worry. ATF is just that far behind ... just to load my form 4 into the system. I would extrapolate on that data point and guess form 3s are moving slow too.
As for ATF, I had an odd situation recently and had to call ATF on a form 4 Omega 9k that I bought and mailed early July. A very nice lady told me my paperwork was not in the system yet. They have no record of it, though my money order was cashed. She then said that ATF was REALLY far behind and that the situation was not unusual and not to worry. ATF is just that far behind ... just to load my form 4 into the system. I would extrapolate on that data point and guess form 3s are moving slow too.
***************
Exercising my right to remain silent.
New Hampshire: "Live free, or die."
Exercising my right to remain silent.
New Hampshire: "Live free, or die."
Re: Ghost M
you got in before the big rush. no way form 3 shouldn't be done by now. i'd go ask for an update and for him to show you where he purchased the suppressor from. if he can't, then get your money back. always buy in stock.
the POWPOW now goes powpow
Re: Ghost M
A form 3 from March should have been back by now no problem. I had my dealer get me a few things prior to the July deadline and I had no issues. I would never buy from a dealer that charges me in full before I've had a chance to even see the item. I don't pay anything until the Form 4 gets submitted. Having said all that, the local dealer I go to has had multiple Ghosts in since March and even has one sitting on his shelf right now. I would find a dealer that has one in stock, get a refund, and take your money elsewhere. Getting refunds can sometimes be tricky, if he tries to stiff you then hopefully you paid with a credit card. Or, if he's a good guy like you say, then you shouldn't have a problem.
Re: Ghost M
Aaron,
You are getting screwed, or at the least lied to whether you want to admit it or not. You need to get tough with your dealer. Your dealer should at the least get you a serial number identifying your can. I bought a can directly from a manufacturer and was able to get a serial number before the can was shipped to the dealer I was using. Form 3s don't take nearly as long as Form 4s. Typically 4-6 weeks. Six months is way to long.
I was in a similar situation a few years back. The dealer I was using at the time was a partner with another guy. I didn't know anything about a partnership. I went by his shop one day and the store was cleaned out and locked up. I was able to track down the location of my can in another city. I ended up having to pay this silent partner another $100.00 in addition to what I initially paid the partner I was dealing with to finish the paperwork and take my can home.
When you pay up front as most suppliers require, you have to be very trusting and/or deal with a well established shop. The dealer has you by the short hairs, so to speak.
I'm not able to buy a full auto gun but would be very leery of shelling out the five figure purchase price for a full auto with the money being held by the seller.
You are getting screwed, or at the least lied to whether you want to admit it or not. You need to get tough with your dealer. Your dealer should at the least get you a serial number identifying your can. I bought a can directly from a manufacturer and was able to get a serial number before the can was shipped to the dealer I was using. Form 3s don't take nearly as long as Form 4s. Typically 4-6 weeks. Six months is way to long.
I was in a similar situation a few years back. The dealer I was using at the time was a partner with another guy. I didn't know anything about a partnership. I went by his shop one day and the store was cleaned out and locked up. I was able to track down the location of my can in another city. I ended up having to pay this silent partner another $100.00 in addition to what I initially paid the partner I was dealing with to finish the paperwork and take my can home.
When you pay up front as most suppliers require, you have to be very trusting and/or deal with a well established shop. The dealer has you by the short hairs, so to speak.
I'm not able to buy a full auto gun but would be very leery of shelling out the five figure purchase price for a full auto with the money being held by the seller.
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Deserteaglexxx
- Member
- Posts: 22
- Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2016 9:11 pm
Re: Ghost M
No form 3 takes that long. You need to demand the serial number and call the ATF line and check status, that will tell you if anything has even been submitted. I am a dealer and what is happening to you is wrong, only issues I have had as a dealer is with silencer shop.
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Killerapplesauce
- Senior Silent Operator
- Posts: 124
- Joined: Thu Oct 30, 2014 9:25 pm
Re: Ghost M
My first can to took around 5-6 months for the form 3 and another 6 months for the form 4 
so i wouldn't sweat it that much. You should though talk to your dealer get the serial number and see if he has talked to the ATF about said can and if not would he.
so i wouldn't sweat it that much. You should though talk to your dealer get the serial number and see if he has talked to the ATF about said can and if not would he.