Destruction to close stamp

General silencer discussion. If you want to talk about a specific silenced rifle or pistol, it is best to do that in the rifle or pistol section for that brand.

All NFA laws apply.

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colorado1
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Destruction to close stamp

Post by colorado1 »

I expect the round count on my few cans to render them pretty close to worthless by the time I pass (knock on wood). The executor of my will does not want to deal with NFA items. Can form 4 cans be sent to the manufacturer for destruction to end the stamp? How about form 1 where the individual who held the stamp and was also the manufacturer has passed? Is there a way an individual who is the form 1 stamp holder/manufacturer can destroy the can and end the stamp while he is still alive that satisfies all laws?
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mars
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by mars »

a big hole in the ground will take care of things.
the POWPOW now goes powpow
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doubloon
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by doubloon »

You could slip on an empty produce bag and crack your head open next to the zucchini at Wally World and someone will still have to take care of things in your temporal absence.

You're dead, it's not your problem anymore.

Find a new executor or dig the hole today.
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colorado1
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by colorado1 »

doubloon wrote:You could slip on an empty produce bag and crack your head open next to the zucchini at Wally World and someone will still have to take care of things in your temporal absence.

You're dead, it's not your problem anymore.

Find a new executor or dig the hole today.
Well it would be nice if the entombment closed the stamp then there would be a nice hole dug for me and they could just be tossed in.

They are just glorified mufflers. I will have got my use out of them. I dont want to cause problems for others upon my death. Since the responsibility to comply for nfa items falls on the executor they have the burden of complying with NFA. Generally you want somone you like and who likes you for a executor. I cant see leaving a big cluster F@#$ for someone who likes you and you like. I am trying to make it simple for the executor . Sending back to manufacturer for destruction would be simplest if it is lawful and the stamp is closed. Anyone know about this?
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fishman
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by fishman »

In all seriousness, are you THAT worried about your death inconveniencing people?

Cross your fingers on HPA
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Historian
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by Historian »

You might have them buried with you like
ancient warriors were buried with their weapons.

Then you could humorously have a letter sent
to ATF saying something like " ... now can you
DIG this!" :) :)

A dear family friend just passed at 101 and his
family buried with him his electronic tool kit he had
as a young man in WW2.
mbogo
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by mbogo »

For a reasonable authoritative statement (subject to capricious and arbitrary changes), ask the BATFE how to dispose of an NFA item.

If the can is owned by a trust, it would go to your fellow trustee(s). If it is not in a trust, you could create a trust, name another can owner as a trustee, and transfer the can to the trust (Form 4 and $200 required)..

Otherwise, smash the silencer with a sledgehammer and toss it in a deep lake. Done. Even the BATFE won't dig you up to shoot you.

mbogo
7 stamps and 1 in jail :mrgreen:
colorado1
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by colorado1 »

fishman wrote:In all seriousness, are you THAT worried about your death inconveniencing people?

Cross your fingers on HPA
Well I believe in personal responsibility. If i created a mess its my job to fix it. I thought most people were the same. The point of a will is to make things easier for others upon your death. If death ends all concern about all earthly matter no need to have a will.

As far as HPA. They wouldnt even repeal Obamacare. I wont hold my breath or hold off buying a can if I want another for that matter.
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fishman
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by fishman »

colorado1 wrote:
fishman wrote:In all seriousness, are you THAT worried about your death inconveniencing people?

Cross your fingers on HPA
Well I believe in personal responsibility. If i created a mess its my job to fix it. I thought most people were the same. The point of a will is to make things easier for others upon your death. If death ends all concern about all earthly matter no need to have a will.
Leaving a silencer to someone isnt leaving a mess behind for someone to deal with. It's one form to fill out and they get a valuable item they could sell.

I wish someone died and left me "a mess" or two for me to deal with.
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savage54
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by savage54 »

mbogo wrote:Otherwise, smash the silencer with a sledgehammer and toss it in a deep lake. Done. Even the BATFE won't dig you up to shoot you.
No, they wouldn't dig you up. Granted, IANAL, but they might harass the executor to prove that the NFA items were properly disposed of. So, if ATF has proof, via Form 1 or Form 4, that you had NFA items prior to your death, they could reasonably expect the executor to dispose of those in a lawful manner, and ask for some form of proof that such was done. Proof such as a sufficiently-mangled suppressor, such as one that has been squished flat by a 5000 ton hydraulic press. Just make certain that the serial number is not defaced in the process. In the case of an SBR, a torch-cut receiver with serial number intact, similar to current de-mil requirements.

But the executor may not want to hold on to those items in perpetuity, which brings us to ...

mbogo wrote:For a reasonable authoritative statement (subject to capricious and arbitrary changes), ask the BATFE how to dispose of an NFA item.
THIS ^^^^

Seriously, the executor can contact the local ATF field office and state that they have these NFA items that were included as part of an estate, and that none of the heirs desires those items. ATF would be happy to come out and pick them up, and give the executor a receipt showing that these items were surrendered.
quiettime
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by quiettime »

You can turn NFA items in to ATF for disposal.
colorado1
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by colorado1 »

Thanks for a reply with some INFO!

"So, if ATF has proof, via Form 1 or Form 4, that you had NFA items prior to your death, they could reasonably expect the executor to dispose of those in a lawful manner,"

This.

My executor will be delivering my non NFA items to a FFL for consignment sale upon my death. The NFA items have to be accounted for.

"You can turn NFA items in to ATF for disposal."
This is looking like the easiest solution. Even if my form 4s could be sent to the manufacturers for destruction I have a form 1 SBR. Its ridiculous because the receiver is the same as any other but it is what it is. Call the BATF and request they pick up some NFA items from an estate and get a receipt for said items. Pick up would be the only way because there is no way I would instruct her to enter a Federal building with cans and a lower. I suppose you could arrange with a agent to meet on the street outside a federal building, have him bring the items in, do a tally get a receipt and call it good.
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doubloon
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by doubloon »

colorado1 wrote:...
"You can turn NFA items in to ATF for disposal."
This is looking like the easiest solution. Even if my form 4s could be sent to the manufacturers for destruction I have a form 1 SBR. Its ridiculous because the receiver is the same as any other but it is what it is. Call the BATF and request they pick up some NFA items from an estate and get a receipt for said items. Pick up would be the only way because there is no way I would instruct her to enter a Federal building with cans and a lower. I suppose you could arrange with a agent to meet on the street outside a federal building, have him bring the items in, do a tally get a receipt and call it good.
All assuming you don't die before you get a chance to ship them to the ATF yourself.

In the event of your untimely death someone would have to take possession during probate before shipping and that person is your executor.
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colorado1
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by colorado1 »

doubloon wrote:
colorado1 wrote:...
"You can turn NFA items in to ATF for disposal."
This is looking like the easiest solution. Even if my form 4s could be sent to the manufacturers for destruction I have a form 1 SBR. Its ridiculous because the receiver is the same as any other but it is what it is. Call the BATF and request they pick up some NFA items from an estate and get a receipt for said items. Pick up would be the only way because there is no way I would instruct her to enter a Federal building with cans and a lower. I suppose you could arrange with a agent to meet on the street outside a federal building, have him bring the items in, do a tally get a receipt and call it good.
All assuming you don't die before you get a chance to ship them to the ATF yourself.

.
Yup. If I know it is coming or just get too old to shoot I will ship them to the ATF.
savage54
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by savage54 »

One thing I neglected to mention earlier - let your executor know that the NFA stamps themselves have some value after the silencer/SBS/SBS/whatever is disposed of. If the clip the corner of the Form1/Form4, they can sell those to stamp collectors (numismatists, as opposed to all of us on this forum). I've seen them listed at $60 - $80 each.
mbogo
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by mbogo »

savage54 wrote:One thing I neglected to mention earlier - let your executor know that the NFA stamps themselves have some value after the silencer/SBS/SBS/whatever is disposed of. If the clip the corner of the Form1/Form4, they can sell those to stamp collectors (numismatists, as opposed to all of us on this forum). I've seen them listed at $60 - $80 each.
Stamp collectors are philatelists, not numismatists (coin collectors).

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savage54
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by savage54 »

colorado1 wrote:This is looking like the easiest solution. Even if my form 4s could be sent to the manufacturers for destruction I have a form 1 SBR. Its ridiculous because the receiver is the same as any other but it is what it is.
What kind of SBR? If it is an AR15-based SBR, the executor can sell the short upper to someone who has an AR pistol or SBR, buy a 16" upper to put on the receiver. The gun is now a Title I firearm, and can be sold as such. ATF would like it if the executor would send them a letter telling them that it is no longer an SBR so that they can remove it from the registry.
savage54
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by savage54 »

mbogo wrote:Stamp collectors are philatelists, not numismatists (coin collectors).
mbogo
Ouch! You are correct.
hammerdown12
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Re: Destruction to close stamp

Post by hammerdown12 »

Somewhat depressing thread. Anyway, being in law enforcement myself, I can tell you your local PD will take in any and all surendered firearms including NFA ones for destruction. Our property room officer simply files the correct forms with the BATFE and they tell him what to do with the item. Even non registered NFA type items can be surrendered, no harm or foul. FYI, All firearms checked into a police property room for any reason (ie: evidence, surrender, found property, etc) once any and all court cases are deposed, must go through the BATFE for destruction, NFA firearms or not.

A few years back we had a woman surrender a partially complete STG - 44. It was full auto, a WW2 relec, non functional but could have been made functional if one was to find a few parts. Every thing for full auto was there. Not registered. Her late grandfather had it in a crate in his attic and she found it clearing the estate. Called in and made arrangements to surrender it. It's still in the property room. BATFE was notified via paperwork. They have yet to instruct on disposal. Our property room officer being a gun guy, he is in no hurry to see it destroyed, so beyond the initial filing, he has not contacted them further about it. I told him he should check with them on having it demilled. Gutted of it's working parts, filled with concrete and put in our lobby display case as a curio / relec. A shame such a historical gun will one day get crushed... :(

A simple call to your local PD should tell you the procedure.
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