Tactical Innovations TAC65 Question

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444
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Tactical Innovations TAC65 Question

Post by 444 »

I have read that you should apply never-seize to the threads of the end caps so you can get it apart for cleaing. So, I bought two of the wrenches they sell. The instructions advise to take the end cap off first. No problem.
Now the question: how do I get the other end off ?
Does it turn the same direction ?
Do you use a strap wrench (tied unsuccessfully so far) ?

I don't want to break anything, help me out here.
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Dark Tranquility
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Post by Dark Tranquility »

Go to a bike shop and pick up an old bike inner tube. Slit this down the middle and wrap it around the can to give you a positive grip.

When I picked up my Trinity form Gemtech the cap was on very tight. It said in the instructions to use a bike inner tube. I personally thought that sounded ridiculous so just used a pipe wrench on the little end cap with a rag (that rag thing never works like you think it’s going to). Well I marked up my end cap pretty good but it was easy and cheap to replace. After that I used the inner tube trick and it works great.

You could also use a strap wrench I suppose. But an inner tube would be easier to carry around in your range bag.

Dan
PAR
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Post by PAR »

It is a bear isn't! Both caps turn counter-clockwise, after I removed the first cap, I tapped the baffles forward to make sure they weren't binding on the remaining end cap and then place the driver in a vise and use a strap wrench.
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Post by Crosshair »

I used an impact wrench on my TAC-16. I couldn't get the end cap off with two people. Yet the cap came off on the first try with the impact wrench. You need a high amount of torque for only a very short period of time to get that cap loose. Once you have it loose, it comes right off. Start at low PSI and work your way up. Chances are you won't need much air pressure to do the job.
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Post by EyeDoc »

Its easy. Just lock your strap wrench in a vise. Then tighten the tube in the strap. Unscrew cap with wrench. To loosen the other end remove tube and wrap the strap in the opposite direction and loosen the other cap. Only one wrench is required. Ist das klar??
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PAR
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Post by PAR »

Crosshair wrote:I used an impact wrench on my TAC-16. I couldn't get the end cap off with two people. Yet the cap came off on the first try with the impact wrench. You need a high amount of torque for only a very short period of time to get that cap loose. Once you have it loose, it comes right off. Start at low PSI and work your way up. Chances are you won't need much air pressure to do the job.
After struggling with it, I sent a note to Craig, stating that this was a bitch and was there some trick, the response I got back was it should be easy and send it in with $10 (return shipping) and he would remove the caps.

It shouldn't be that hard. Soaking in oil won't do any good if it was
soaked at all before or hasn't been shot. If you get someone to hold
it with a strap wrench with the caps on each end for alignment and
then unscrew it, it should come right off. Other than that, no other
secrets that I can think of. Worse case, mail us the tube with a $10
taped to it for return shipping and we'll take it off and mail both
back to you.

Thanks
Craig
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Tin_Can_Terminator
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Post by Tin_Can_Terminator »

Have you soaked the can in WD 40 like they said to do in the instructions?
It makes all the difference in the world.

I had the same issue as you. Once you get the can apart and apply the anti seize compound if will come apart FAR more easily.

WD 40 !!

If you have already shot it a bunch you may be in trouble. Less than 100 rounds and you should be fine.

TCT
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Post by VA3shooter »

What kind of anti seize compound do you use once it's apart?? I'm waiting on my paperwork so sorry if it's in the instructions :?
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Post by Tin_Can_Terminator »

Any good automotive anti seieze (sp?) compound should work fine.

Try getting black colored. It can get messy doing this so if you get it on the outside the black will not show up or discolor the can.

Dont be shy putting it on the baffles or endcaps. When I get done re packing mine the extra compound acts like an ablative and makes the can even quieter.

TCT
444
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Post by 444 »

Ok, thanks for the replys.
My TAC65 is brand new and unfired.
I put one wrench in the vise and used a socket wrench on the other end. The first end came off easily.
I tried using a strap wrench on the tube with the wrench in a vise and I couldn't get the strap wrench to bite, it just turns freely.
So, I tried holding the tube while somone else used a socket wrench: I was pretty much able to keep the tube from spinning but the cap didn't move.
I didn't use WD40 on it but I did use KROIL on it. I have now let it soak over night in KROIL.
This is ridiculous and is starting to piss me off. I am not mechanically inclined in the least, but this should NOT be this hard. WHY would the manufacturer tighten this like this ? More importantly (and the constant question of my life) WHY DOES EVERYTHING HAVE TO BE SO DIFFICULT AND TEST THE LIMITS OF YOUR PATIENCE ? Just once I would love to have something that worked the way it was supposed to work the first time. Those caps come off because this thing is supposed to be user servicable.
I work out with pretty heavy weight routines, 3-4 times a week and have worked for 15 years as a firefighter. I can bench 260. I can curl 70 pounds. BUT, I don't have the physical strength to take these freakin caps off.

Off to another great start with a new piece of gear.

"It shouldn't be that hard. "
Yet, most of the people on this thread have had the same problem I am having. That's a damn shame to pay $10 and ship the tube back to the manufacturer because they screwed the caps on too tight for anyone to get them off.

This has nothing to do with Tactical Innovations, but I bought this can last June (maybe July) and I just not got it. I bought it from a store in Utah that had it in stock. They obviously had to ship it to my local dealer. They ended up having some kind of problem with their FFL and took months before the dealer-dealer transfer took place. Then the normal hoops and I got this thing 7-8 months later. Now, I can't shoot it because it won't come apart.
I am not real happy right now. :twisted:
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#93
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Post by #93 »

When a strap wrench just wont do:

Image

A 1 1/16th IIRC hole was bored in a 4x4 then the 4x4 was cut with a band saw. It has a lot of gripping power in the vise and also helps to get the baffles out of a dirty suppressor.

Another suggestion is to put the end cap that came off, back on tightly. Put one take down tool in the vise so that the prongs are pointed upwards and set the can on the tool with end cap that came loose on top of it. Use a strap wrench and the other take down tool with at wrench against each other. Basically use the strap wrench to try and tighten the end cap in the vise even tighter, you are trying to stop the tube from turning so you can apply as much force to the stuck end cap as possible. Now use the other take down tool and a wrench on the stuck end cap. The idea is that the other end cap and strap wrench will hold the tube tight enough to so that enough force can be applied to break the stuck end cap free. It has worked for me.

When you put it back together put the end cap that is threaded for the gun on first since this is what everything indexes on. Then fill the tube with the baffles and tighten the other end cap. Just snug no need to torque it down hard.

Good Luck!
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Post by Tin_Can_Terminator »

444 wrote:Ok, thanks for the replys.
My TAC65 is brand new and unfired.
I put one wrench in the vise and used a socket wrench on the other end. The first end came off easily.
I tried using a strap wrench on the tube with the wrench in a vise and I couldn't get the strap wrench to bite, it just turns freely.
So, I tried holding the tube while somone else used a socket wrench: I was pretty much able to keep the tube from spinning but the cap didn't move.
I didn't use WD40 on it but I did use KROIL on it. I have now let it soak over night in KROIL.
This is ridiculous and is starting to piss me off. I am not mechanically inclined in the least, but this should NOT be this hard. WHY would the manufacturer tighten this like this ? More importantly (and the constant question of my life) WHY DOES EVERYTHING HAVE TO BE SO DIFFICULT AND TEST THE LIMITS OF YOUR PATIENCE ? Just once I would love to have something that worked the way it was supposed to work the first time. Those caps come off because this thing is supposed to be user servicable.
I work out with pretty heavy weight routines, 3-4 times a week and have worked for 15 years as a firefighter. I can bench 260. I can curl 70 pounds. BUT, I don't have the physical strength to take these freakin caps off.

Off to another great start with a new piece of gear.

"It shouldn't be that hard. "
Yet, most of the people on this thread have had the same problem I am having. That's a damn shame to pay $10 and ship the tube back to the manufacturer because they screwed the caps on too tight for anyone to get them off.

This has nothing to do with Tactical Innovations, but I bought this can last June (maybe July) and I just not got it. I bought it from a store in Utah that had it in stock. They obviously had to ship it to my local dealer. They ended up having some kind of problem with their FFL and took months before the dealer-dealer transfer took place. Then the normal hoops and I got this thing 7-8 months later. Now, I can't shoot it because it won't come apart.
I am not real happy right now. :twisted:
Yea....... I bench 390 and I couldnt get it off either. I am telling you WD-40 works.

I agree with you. The initial take down should not be so hard. I am very mechanically inclined and I had a hard time with it. I busted my ass trying to open it up then I soaked it in WD-40 like the directions say and it came right apart.
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Post by PAR »

444 wrote:I tried using a strap wrench on the tube with the wrench in a vise and I couldn't get the strap wrench to bite, it just turns freely.
Feel your pain. :(

Were you able to knock the baffles and washer out with the one cap removed? The reason, I ask is that they can bind on the end caps which you'll notice when you put the caps back in place, there's a 1/32 cap until you hog down on the cap again.

As for the strap wrench, you need to find one that will work because you just can't get the leverage with out it, I have three different sizes and had to try all and even then it did take some doing to get it to bite on the tube.
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Post by PAR »

[quote="#93"]When a strap wrench just wont do:

Image

Great idea, as soon as I finish my rough-in on my house and get my tools out of storage, I ditching the strap wrench.
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Post by 1928A1 »

Strap wrenches work, but you might need two of them.
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Post by 1928A1 »

#93 wrote:When a strap wrench just wont do:

Image

A 1 1/16th IIRC hole was bored in a 4x4 then the 4x4 was cut with a band saw. It has a lot of gripping power in the vise and also helps to get the baffles out of a dirty suppressor. No, actually putting the silencer in a vice and squeezing it, even a few thousands of an inch makes it harder to get the baffles out and you are holding the baffles in with tension you don't need.

Another suggestion is to put the end cap that came off, back on tightly. Put one take down tool in the vise so that the prongs are pointed upwards and set the can on the tool with end cap that came loose on top of it. Use a strap wrench and the other take down tool with at wrench against each other. Basically use the strap wrench to try and tighten the end cap in the vise even tighter, you are trying to stop the tube from turning so you can apply as much force to the stuck end cap as possible. Now use the other take down tool and a wrench on the stuck end cap. The idea is that the other end cap and strap wrench will hold the tube tight enough to so that enough force can be applied to break the stuck end cap free. It has worked for me.

When you put it back together put the end cap that is threaded for the gun on first since this is what everything indexes on. Then fill the tube with the baffles and tighten the other end cap. Just snug no need to torque it down hard. Again, you need it to tighten it up pretty good because if the baffles have room in between them, that dirty filthy concrete will accumulate there and make disassembly difficult.

Good Luck!
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PAR
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Post by PAR »

1928A1 wrote:
#93 wrote:
When you put it back together put the end cap that is threaded for the gun on first since this is what everything indexes on. Then fill the tube with the baffles and tighten the other end cap. Just snug no need to torque it down hard. Again, you need it to tighten it up pretty good because if the baffles have room in between them, that dirty filthy concrete will accumulate there and make disassembly difficult.

Good Luck!
The directions state "DO NOT use the strap wrench or any other tools." They also go on to say "hand torque" with the driver placed in a vise. Have you had problems with it coming apart?
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#93
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Post by #93 »

1928A1 wrote: A 1 1/16th IIRC hole was bored in a 4x4 then the 4x4 was cut with a band saw. It has a lot of gripping power in the vise and also helps to get the baffles out of a dirty suppressor. No, actually putting the silencer in a vice and squeezing it, even a few thousands of an inch makes it harder to get the baffles out and you are holding the baffles in with tension you don't need.

Another suggestion is to put the end cap that came off, back on tightly. Put one take down tool in the vise so that the prongs are pointed upwards and set the can on the tool with end cap that came loose on top of it. Use a strap wrench and the other take down tool with at wrench against each other. Basically use the strap wrench to try and tighten the end cap in the vise even tighter, you are trying to stop the tube from turning so you can apply as much force to the stuck end cap as possible. Now use the other take down tool and a wrench on the stuck end cap. The idea is that the other end cap and strap wrench will hold the tube tight enough to so that enough force can be applied to break the stuck end cap free. It has worked for me.

When you put it back together put the end cap that is threaded for the gun on first since this is what everything indexes on. Then fill the tube with the baffles and tighten the other end cap. Just snug no need to torque it down hard. Again, you need it to tighten it up pretty good because if the baffles have room in between them, that dirty filthy concrete will accumulate there and make disassembly difficult.

Good Luck!


The block works that is all I have to say on the matter. So far as how tight to torque the end caps do what you think is best but by my measurements the extra quarter turn between snug and quite tight would amount to less than 2 thousandths of an inch between the baffles for crud to get into and that is not accounting for the fact that that extra little bit of torque does more to compress the metal than close the gap. You cant get any closer than touching.
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Post by 1928A1 »

PAR wrote:
1928A1 wrote:
#93 wrote:
When you put it back together put the end cap that is threaded for the gun on first since this is what everything indexes on. Then fill the tube with the baffles and tighten the other end cap. Just snug no need to torque it down hard. Again, you need it to tighten it up pretty good because if the baffles have room in between them, that dirty filthy concrete will accumulate there and make disassembly difficult.

Good Luck!
The directions state "DO NOT use the strap wrench or any other tools." They also go on to say "hand torque" with the driver placed in a vise. Have you had problems with it coming apart?
Craig told me to use a strap wrench and I do and it works.
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Post by PAR »

1928A1 wrote:
PAR wrote:
1928A1 wrote:
The directions state "DO NOT use the strap wrench or any other tools." They also go on to say "hand torque" with the driver placed in a vise. Have you had problems with it coming apart?
Craig told me to use a strap wrench and I do and it works.
I wouldn't doubt it but then he needs to update his instruction on page 2, section 8.
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Post by 444 »

After reading the first day of posts and I knew I wasn't doing anything wrong, yesterday I managed to get both ends off.
I ended up putting it in the vise using the rounded pieces intended for pipe that were covered with some old hose. I had my neighbor wrench on it as I gradually tightened the vise until it quit turning and came loose. The amount of force I had to put on the vise was WAY more than I would have liked. I don't think I distorted the tube, but of course now I will always worry that I did. I also managed to take a few gouges out of the factory paint. No big deal but another indication of just how tight it was to begin with.
I haven't tried the suppressor yet but at least I got this far.
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Post by PAR »

Glad to hear. I also have a few marks on my end caps but no biggie. Enjoy :)
Bucko

Post by Bucko »

One thing I do with my 65 is use that antisieze on the threads after disassembly. the other thing I do to make getting the baffles out easier is I use the Finish Line teflon bycycle grease to liberally coat all the baffles. The stuff is really thick and last quite a while. Not to mention it dampens the sound a little.
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#93
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Post by #93 »

Glad to hear you got it apart. Like everyone has said be sure to coat the threads and baffles in the area that touch the tube with anti seize compound available at auto parts stores.

The more often you take it apart and clean it the easier it will be to get the baffles out. every 500 or so rounds is a good time. If you shoot it till it clogs and needs cleaning it will be a bear to get apart if you can at all.
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