Sleeping bags.

[silencertalk]

Got some Marmot rated to 15 degrees and froze my balls off when it was 52 degrees. They lied.

Must add 40 to the rating to get the actual non BS rating.

[66427vette]

Were you laying directly on ground? 52 degrees still seems pretty warm but I am used to being outside doing alot due to work and other outdoor activities.

[Davo5o]

it's a qualitative rating not quantitative. Very subjective. I sleep very hot. My wife the exact opposite.

Ground pads have their own ratings.

A mylar space blanket will seal in all body heat, and keep you super warm.

[silencertalk]

There is a quantitative test... it uses a heated dummy. US marketing does not use it, probably because it makes the products look bad.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EN_13537

http://marmot.com/product/content/en-tested

"Marmot’s assigned temperatures are comparable to the EN lower limit rating."

From now on, I will go by 13537 and not buy any bag not rated by it. I can trust that if I use the 'upper limit.'

[sigman226]

Another option is you got so hot that you started to sweat and then got real cold. I have taken my 20 degree bag with a 10 degree insert down below 0 and only slightly shivered. I bought a Kelty 0 degree bag and all is right in my world now.

[GlocksInMySocks]

maybe dehydrated? I've always been so-so on marmot, but I went with 800 weight montbell bag last year. Freaking love that thing

I also hope you used a sleeping pad, that will make a world of difference. I'm sure you're probably aware of it, but there's a lot of variables that go in to staying warm at night besides just the sleeping bag.

[GlocksInMySocks]

There is a quantitative test... it uses a heated dummy. US marketing does not use it, probably because it makes the products look bad.

and it looks like marmot uses the European Norm (EN) 13537 testing...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTSDzVs_asE

[JohnnyC]

Just picked up a Mountain Hardwear bag rated for 32 I think. Add a liner, my thermarest neo-air, inside my Alpine Research Alpine Bivy while wearing some dry base layers and I have no doubt I'll be able to take it down to 20 or so. I wouldn't use it hammock camping without an underquilt though, even if I use my tarp.

My preference is using my MacCat tarp with my bivy, I'm interested to see how this bag performs.

[CrazyDoc]

you guys know of any system I can use in North FL where in the winter it gets down to around 20's and the summer at night it's hotter than hell? Or am I asking for a bit much?


Toole

[doubloon]

I've seen some multi-layer bags out there ... bags within bags. Never tried them.

[ick]

I purchased on of these and absolutely LOVE it... although I must admit I didn't challenge the insulation by using it in cold temperatures as you are talking here.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/ZWB158-1.html

Bought the more expensive of the two aluminum cots at the same time on CTD and it works great too.

[JohnnyC]

you guys know of any system I can use in North FL where in the winter it gets down to around 20's and the summer at night it's hotter than hell? Or am I asking for a bit much?


Toole

20 degrees is pretty easy. A 32 or 40 will be fine provided you have a ground pad with a decent r-value, and you're wearing good base layers. You can add a bag liner as well for more warmth. In the summer I wouldn't even be sleeping in a bag, I'd probably have a lightweight liner if anything at all. Bags are like clothes, it's all about proper layering.

The current issue military sleep systems like ick linked to are pretty good. It's two different rated bags and a bivy sack. It's not the smallest or lightest, but very capable with it's 3-layer system.

[misfit762]

The Army issued sleep system really works! I slept outside at -25 and was toasty. Yes, Negative 25! And toasty. Till I had to piss. Couldn't get warm again after that. Next time, I'll keep a Gatorade bottle in there with me!

[Walt Her]

Wiggys FTRSS (fortress) is da shiznizzy. Modular, durable, warm, machine washable, made in the USA, oh and 30% off. Check them out before you get a cold ass. PS avoid their sleeping pad for real cold temps tho...

[Walt Her]

http://wiggys.com/category.cfm?category=6 FYI

[CrazyDoc]

you guys know of any system I can use in North FL where in the winter it gets down to around 20's and the summer at night it's hotter than hell? Or am I asking for a bit much?


Toole

20 degrees is pretty easy. A 32 or 40 will be fine provided you have a ground pad with a decent r-value, and you're wearing good base layers. You can add a bag liner as well for more warmth. In the summer I wouldn't even be sleeping in a bag, I'd probably have a lightweight liner if anything at all. Bags are like clothes, it's all about proper layering.

The current issue military sleep systems like ick linked to are pretty good. It's two different rated bags and a bivy sack. It's not the smallest or lightest, but very capable with it's 3-layer system.

Sweet thanks. Now just to get a bug net. God I hate bugs! And living in a state that is a swamp sucks ASS!


Toole

[JohnnyC]

you guys know of any system I can use in North FL where in the winter it gets down to around 20's and the summer at night it's hotter than hell? Or am I asking for a bit much?


Toole

20 degrees is pretty easy. A 32 or 40 will be fine provided you have a ground pad with a decent r-value, and you're wearing good base layers. You can add a bag liner as well for more warmth. In the summer I wouldn't even be sleeping in a bag, I'd probably have a lightweight liner if anything at all. Bags are like clothes, it's all about proper layering.

The current issue military sleep systems like ick linked to are pretty good. It's two different rated bags and a bivy sack. It's not the smallest or lightest, but very capable with it's 3-layer system.

Sweet thanks. Now just to get a bug net. God I hate bugs! And living in a state that is a swamp sucks ASS!


Toole

Since you're in FL, you might consider hammock camping instead. The Hennessy Hammock has a built in bug net, bottom opening, ditch the Hennessy tarp and pick up a MacCat instead. With a good bag and an underquilt people are camping in the snow with these. Only thing that sucks is finding a couple good trees.

Edited to add some links.

This:
http://www.jacksrbetter.com/SpeedBags.htm

Plus this:
http://hennessyhammock.com/catalog/#hammock

Plus this:
http://www.outdoorequipmentsupplier.com ... _tarps.php

And whatever suspension and guy lines you need is actually a really sweet, compact, lightweight system that's damn near perfect for Florida camping.

Add an under quilt like this: http://www.jacksrbetter.com/Hennessy%20 ... Quilts.htm with your sleeping bag of choice and you're pretty well set even on the chilliest of nights.

It looks like the picture on the top of this page http://www.tothewoods.net/

[CrazyDoc]

Awsome bro! I hadn't even thought about that!


Toole

[snapshot]

I was a Wiggy's guy for years. I loved the system set up, but the fill really drops it's warmth ratio after continuous use in extreme environments, but then again what doesn't? Also had more than one zipper failure.

Feathered Friends (Seattle) makes some killer gear. The winter wren 35 is suitable for most temperate excursions and has a creatively efficient draw cord opening at the foot to allow for a hybrid like down "parka" adaptation. Great for boiling up the morning brew in the perc or taking an early morning piss.

http://featheredfriends.com/index.php/w ... ano-c.html

* I forgot the best part: you can sleep with your boots on!

[tsands974]

The Army issued sleep system really works! I slept outside at -25 and was toasty. Yes, Negative 25! And toasty. Till I had to piss. Couldn't get warm again after that. Next time, I'll keep a Gatorade bottle in there with me!

This ^. The army's 3 bag system really works, I have spent many sub-zero nights in complete warmth with one of these. You can also always wrap a woobie around you inside your bag for extra warmth if you can't handle the cold.

[snapshot]

The Army issued sleep system really works! I slept outside at -25 and was toasty. Yes, Negative 25! And toasty. Till I had to piss. Couldn't get warm again after that. Next time, I'll keep a Gatorade bottle in there with me!

This ^. The army's 3 bag system really works, I have spent many sub-zero nights in complete warmth with one of these. You can also always wrap a woobie around you inside your bag for extra warmth if you can't handle the cold.

Until they get wet. It's like lugging around a cinder block. Good for armored CAV though.

[tsands974]

They have a waterproof shell that keeps you dry during rain/snow, plus when you pack them in a waterproof stuffsack you should never have a problem in the field. But yes, when I pull them out of the washer they weigh a ton.

[finn]

It's a "one size fits all" system too, and it's a good deal shorter than most "long" size sleeping bags. Using it mummy style was difficult and uncomfortable at 6'6", but should be fine for 6'3" and under.

[misfit762]

Until they get wet. It's like lugging around a cinder block. Good for armored CAV though.

Being Airborne, we had to ensure that our stuff was waterproofed. Being a Combat Engineer, if it ain't raining, we ain't training!

[snapshot]

[/quote]Being Airborne, we had to ensure that our stuff was waterproofed. Being a Combat Engineer, if it ain't raining, we ain't training![/quote]

I'm biased to aftermarket gear and it's just personal preference. Anything standard issue is just that, standard. Lowest bidder, underperforming and not nearly as efficient in my eyes. You can take the same size ruck, go to REI and load it up with 20% more gear with nearly the same weight loss percentage than you can from division. I'd rather hump more ammo & water than bulky gear.