Element Vs. Prodigy Vs. Kodiak

[GlocksInMySocks]

the kodiak looks a lot better black

[tylermtech]

I would agree that one thing that keeps me from buying the liberty is the exterior appearance. the engraving does not look as good as the say aac or silencerco. .

That is pathetic.[/quote


Why is that pathetic. because I like expensive purchases to look nice, I think the engraving looks like it was done in 1982 by a trophy shop. I also didn't say it was the only reason, just a main one. I'm sure you like to pay top dollar for crappy looking things.

Along those lines, am I pathetic because I like attractive women? I choose to purchase cars that are finished nicely? Because I have a house instead of a trailer? I don't think so. If it was the only suppressor that was quiet, or had some very unique features that I valued, I could live with the engraving. But they are not. If you like it, good for you. I don't, and I think there are better alternatives.

[sukhoi]

Along those lines, am I pathetic because I like attractive women? I choose to purchase cars that are finished nicely? Because I have a house instead of a trailer? I don't think so. If it was the only suppressor that was quiet, or had some very unique features that I valued, I could live with the engraving. But they are not. If you like it, good for you. I don't, and I think there are better alternatives.

I dont know...ive known some pretty cute ladies that did not function the best...just sayin

And a .22 can is apples and oranges.. the innards are far more important that/ how your tube looks I might as well give you a fancy tube and fill it with washers and steel wool then if you want more looks. your nice finished car could have a cracked engine block.... where are we going with this...

[tylermtech]

Along those lines, am I pathetic because I like attractive women? I choose to purchase cars that are finished nicely? Because I have a house instead of a trailer? I don't think so. If it was the only suppressor that was quiet, or had some very unique features that I valued, I could live with the engraving. But they are not. If you like it, good for you. I don't, and I think there are better alternatives.

I dont know...ive known some pretty cute ladies that did not function the best...just sayin

And a .22 can is apples and oranges.. the innards are far more important that/ how your tube looks I might as well give you a fancy tube and fill it with washers and steel wool then if you want more looks. your nice finished car could have a cracked engine block.... where are we going with this...

But if you had the option, a pretty woman or a not so pretty one, both perfectly good women, or a rusty car that ran well, or a beautiful car that ran just as well if not better? Just like .22 cans, these options are out there if you look.

There is no reason to choose function over form. In today's suppressor world, you can have both!! (Its a little harder with women!!)

[BigDave@SMDW,LLC]

What I am seeing is that Tylermtech will never buy one of our cans because he appears to feel they are second rate to AAC and Silencerco because the tube is not laser engraved. This is fine because we live in a country where we still (as of right now) have the freedom to choose. I personally like the way our suppressors look with the text like it is. A lot of other people do too, if they didnt we would not be in business for as long as we have been. I finally came to terms with the fact that our suppressors are not for everyone. There are people that are very loyal to AAC and Silencerco as well as Liberty, they all have their own likes and dislikes. GlocksInMySocks said he likes the Kodiak better in all black (you can have that by the way...), to each his own.

Este has a unique opinion of our company as well, he is entitled to it. It is not accurate, but he is entitled to it non-the-less. We have been open as Liberty for six years now and apparently that still isnt long enough to be considered stable...

I also dont understand why the lack of additional complexity makes our suppressors less desirable, but again, this is why America is great, he can have this opinion without the Government beating him with batons and crap like that. I dont fault people that view us this way, as you cant possible please everybody, if you could, there would be only one suppressor company or if there was more than one, all the cans would look exactly the same.

This has been an interesting read to say the least...

Dave

[NinerRider]

Wow the look of the font or quality of engraving never crossed my mind in my search for a suppressor. My main concerns are how the cans meter and how easy they are to maintain, after doing the research I think the kodiak is my choice. I use my guns pretty heavily, rolling around on the ground and banging the guns on barriers in fairly common. I fully expect that the Kodiak will take a beating on the exterior so what the engraving looks like isn't that high on my list of concerns. My main reason for posting was the hope that someone could give me a reason one baffle design was better than the other, so far no one has addressed this.

[GlocksInMySocks]

GlocksInMySocks said he likes the Kodiak better in all black (you can have that by the way...), to each his own.

I'm a simple guy and like black, that's why we have duracoat. Keep up the good work. It's only a matter of time before I own one of your cans.

[Schulze]

I would agree that one thing that keeps me from buying the liberty is the exterior appearance. the engraving does not look as good as the say aac or silencerco. .

That is pathetic.[/quote


Why is that pathetic. because I like expensive purchases to look nice, I think the engraving looks like it was done in 1982 by a trophy shop. I also didn't say it was the only reason, just a main one. I'm sure you like to pay top dollar for crappy looking things.

Along those lines, am I pathetic because I like attractive women? I choose to purchase cars that are finished nicely? Because I have a house instead of a trailer? I don't think so. If it was the only suppressor that was quiet, or had some very unique features that I valued, I could live with the engraving. But they are not. If you like it, good for you. I don't, and I think there are better alternatives.

Women and houses are not tools. You are as silly as a man who buys Husky over Craftsman wrenches because the logo is "prettier". By ignoring the functional aspects of the item and judging it on a minor aesthetic you put yourself in the group of homosexual airsoft gear queers more concerned with prancing and posing than using. I see you're okay with that, and that's cool. That's....cool.

[chromedome82]

Here's what sold me on Liberty, are you ready? It was the SUPPRESSION level. Low and behold I buy the suppressor because it functions correctly but I'm just weird like that. I ran into a gentleman named James Christian of Christian Armory Works at a local Eastman's gun show and after about 20 mins I was convinced to go try the Kodiak TL out. This would be my first can and I wanted the best no-bang for my buck. ( needless to say I had also bugged Stu for weeks prior to going to the show). Anyway after taking the chance to fire the TL on multiple hosts and also listen to the Torch and Essence I came to the conclusion that these things are stupid quite.

Not only are they quite but the ease of care is awesome. Simply use the provided disassembly tool, unscrew the end cap and drop the core out. From there you can soak it in soapy water or just scrape it with a knife. I was so impressed with the company and it's cans that even though I haven't received my TL I'm already saving for a Torch QA.

IMHO I would rather have a rusty fire extinguisher that was full other than a pretty red one that was dry in my house.

[tylermtech]

Once again, you imply that I have safe full of junk. I don't. At the time I got my element, it was the quietest can on a pistol (what I wanted). And it meets my other wants, one of which is exterior appearance to my liking.

What is pathetic, is that you can't even argue your opinion without calling me a pathetic homosexual airsoft queer. Are you a moderator on Arfcom?? If not, you would fit right in there.

Once again, prove to me that I got an inferior product to ANY company because I chose to get a product that checks all of my boxes, one of which was appearance. You can't, because I didn't






Why is that pathetic. because I like expensive purchases to look nice, I think the engraving looks like it was done in 1982 by a trophy shop. I also didn't say it was the only reason, just a main one. I'm sure you like to pay top dollar for crappy looking things.

Along those lines, am I pathetic because I like attractive women? I choose to purchase cars that are finished nicely? Because I have a house instead of a trailer? I don't think so. If it was the only suppressor that was quiet, or had some very unique features that I valued, I could live with the engraving. But they are not. If you like it, good for you. I don't, and I think there are better alternatives.[/quote]

Women and houses are not tools. You are as silly as a man who buys Husky over Craftsman wrenches because the logo is "prettier". By ignoring the functional aspects of the item and judging it on a minor aesthetic you put yourself in the group of homosexual airsoft gear queers more concerned with prancing and posing than using. I see you're okay with that, and that's cool. That's....cool.[/quote]

[tylermtech]

Dave,
I'm sorry that I said bad things about your product. I got caught up in an internet argument, and forgot that words can be hurtful to people that make things. I'm sure you don't care what I think, it was just a dick head thing of me to do and I wanted to apologize for it. You have a loyal following, and I'm sure that is not just because your are a good guy. You have proven you make a quality product, and I hope you have even more success.

What I am seeing is that Tylermtech will never buy one of our cans because he appears to feel they are second rate to AAC and Silencerco because the tube is not laser engraved. This is fine because we live in a country where we still (as of right now) have the freedom to choose. I personally like the way our suppressors look with the text like it is. A lot of other people do too, if they didnt we would not be in business for as long as we have been. I finally came to terms with the fact that our suppressors are not for everyone. There are people that are very loyal to AAC and Silencerco as well as Liberty, they all have their own likes and dislikes. GlocksInMySocks said he likes the Kodiak better in all black (you can have that by the way...), to each his own.

Este has a unique opinion of our company as well, he is entitled to it. It is not accurate, but he is entitled to it non-the-less. We have been open as Liberty for six years now and apparently that still isnt long enough to be considered stable...

I also dont understand why the lack of additional complexity makes our suppressors less desirable, but again, this is why America is great, he can have this opinion without the Government beating him with batons and crap like that. I dont fault people that view us this way, as you cant possible please everybody, if you could, there would be only one suppressor company or if there was more than one, all the cans would look exactly the same.

This has been an interesting read to say the least...

Dave

[Chondro]

Wow the look of the font or quality of engraving never crossed my mind in my search for a suppressor. My main concerns are how the cans meter and how easy they are to maintain, after doing the research I think the kodiak is my choice. I use my guns pretty heavily, rolling around on the ground and banging the guns on barriers in fairly common. I fully expect that the Kodiak will take a beating on the exterior so what the engraving looks like isn't that high on my list of concerns. My main reason for posting was the hope that someone could give me a reason one baffle design was better than the other, so far no one has addressed this.

The Kodiaks are all 6.5 inches long. The TL and the Essence meter better than the Steel version. The Essence though it meters the same as the TL has a better tone. Its all a tone game when your down under 120 db's.

Now this is the key..The length..That is what gives the better sound reduction. Then by having a blast baffle of .250 and going up to nearly .270 (I could be off a few thousandths here and there) you have a can that doesn't blow back all the crap in your gun. That is what sets it apart. Even if the TL wasn't the quietest it would be my choice for that very reason. There is no reason to ever shoot a rimfire without a can on again with this design. Its just doesn't gunk up your gun. No FRP..That you can hear..May show up on the meter..Though you can notice something if your shooting two side by side and comparing..REALLY have to be paying attention for it.

You can't take that design and squash it down and bore tighter and have that feature..So the lack of blowback is lost. But then it gets loud as well!

For the reason that a few morons think that blowback is subjective I am going to take some pictures for the main forum to show exactly what I mean. (Another argument on the same issue basically.) This isn't rocket science here but I guess if you have all the other cans and your used to it they still don't understand what I'm talking about. Honestly I think one of the guys doesn't own a silencer yet.

Simply.. the design has spoiled me. All my other cans are s--t compared to it. (Well just got a Torch so have to watch how I word that now..Its is an amazing can!!!!!!! Just unreal..Well in fairness the others do what they are suppose to for sound..) Dave put more thought into just the FRP of the Kodiak design than most do on the whole can. Then the lack of Blowback? Its decades ahead until someone just down right clones the damn core. Not long ago I would have said that wouldn't happen. Silencer community would never put up with it. Now I realize no one cares from an ethical standpoint. I mean look at the conversation we just had here? "Hell they are both the same so the lack of blowback should be the same..screw the ethics of copying a design". (Okay thats what I took away from it.)

When I say decades ahead its because it will probably be 10 years for most companies to understand the concept of a can and no blowback. Have to address it before you can even work to fix it. Then the time to fix it?

Again if its not gunking up your gun then no reason to run it without it. Last range trip out with my M&P 9mm the Multimount got two mags through it and taken off. Just fouled the gun wicked and blocks the sites and really slows you down. Compared to a rimfire can they are still on the loud side for me. Nothing is as practical as a rimfire can.

And again my passion..as this will be repeated again. If the Kodiak was just a super quiet can I would have three hosts..A Ruger, P-22 and a 10-22. Because of the lack of blowback and it being so practical that led to the model 41 getting threaded, a second Ruger threaded, Taurus PT-22 as well as getting an M-16 for rimfire only. Now just searching for the ultimate bolt gun..

On another side note. You will see a carbon layer around the ejection port and on top of your mags. But you can wipe that off with a dry facial tissue. I'm talking about sludge you remove with a dental pic and q-tips as the problem. Some hosts run cleaner with the can on than off. They probably all do I just don't shoot without them anymore. Buddy at an indoor range scared the s--t out of me with his P-22..I had muffs on but had no idea they were that loud. Thought they were just a staple gun..Never heard one without a can..

Oh and Tyler I think that was kind of you to apologize.

[BigDave@SMDW,LLC]

Tylermech, no apology needed. I try to word my replys to mimic my emotions, but it is so hard to do sometimes. I didn't want my post to come across as "bashing you". As I re-read it, it seems like that is what I am doing. I was trying to point out that we are all different and things that you like, I may not like at all and vice versa. It is all good, even if Este has to throw up a little every now and then

Dave

[Schulze]

Once again, prove to me that I got an inferior product to ANY company because I chose to get a product that checks all of my boxes, one of which was appearance. You can't, because I didn't

I do not care what you have. The mere fact you are making a tool purchase based on some insignificant engraving preference that no one else cares about says all anyone needs to know. btw, I wasn't judging you bro; I was laughing at you.

[este]

Once again, prove to me that I got an inferior product to ANY company because I chose to get a product that checks all of my boxes, one of which was appearance. You can't, because I didn't

I do not care what you have. The mere fact you are making a tool purchase based on some insignificant engraving preference that no one else cares about says all anyone needs to know. btw, I wasn't judging you bro; I was laughing at you.

I sympathize with Tyler, the Kodiak exterior does not look GOOD. It's acceptable, and plain, the engraving (depending on what style they used) does indeed look garage-y. It doesn't have half the exterior appearance of what I consider a first-tier can (AAC, SWR, Silencerco, etc).

Because they don't do as nice a job on the exterior, I assume they also cut corners on the rest of the product. Not saying they do in this case, but that's my general thought process.

[sukhoi]

all you guys are nuts a tube is a tube is a tube

[coyote223]

Once again, prove to me that I got an inferior product to ANY company because I chose to get a product that checks all of my boxes, one of which was appearance. You can't, because I didn't

I do not care what you have. The mere fact you are making a tool purchase based on some insignificant engraving preference that no one else cares about says all anyone needs to know. btw, I wasn't judging you bro; I was laughing at you.

I sympathize with Tyler, the Kodiak exterior does not look GOOD. It's acceptable, and plain, the engraving (depending on what style they used) does indeed look garage-y. It doesn't have half the exterior appearance of what I consider a first-tier can (AAC, SWR, Silencerco, etc).

Because they don't do as nice a job on the exterior, I assume they also cut corners on the rest of the product. Not saying they do in this case, but that's my general thought process.

Huh? Finally brought my kodiak home. The kodiaks exterior is just as nice as as my Spectre and warlocks. SWR's writing is small, which is nice. But they color it as well, which I don't like. But, I bought them anyway. The kodiak's writing is black as the tube, subdued is much nicer IMO. You actually have to look for it to see it,,,

This is america, buy what you like. My kodiak is only gonna see action on my .22 Hornet,,,

[Shamrock-MP]

I have been reading as much as possible on the Sparrow and Kodiak. I ended up going with the Sparrow but the next can I purchase WILL be from Liberty.

I had a few questions for Liberty, so I called. My call was returned in less than an hour by Stew, their regional sales director. He told me about some of their new product concepts and I am anxiously awaiting the unveiling. There are a few new multi caliber cans, more titanium/SS options(like the Constitution), and something to do with a pistol (he would not say any more). Stew even suggested that they could make a custom SS Constitution for me now or I could wait a few months till they start to regularly produce them and save some money. I think that Liberty is going in the right direction. They are taking suggestions, reading forums, and trying to make the cans WE want! Good job Liberty!

Like I said, Liberty is happy to do custom work. If you ask they will do custom fonts or engraving for those of you who want victorian curly-cue crap on your cans.

Stew, Liberty Cans 859-866-4734

[Shamrock-MP]

Coyote223, let me know how the Kodiak does on your 22 hornet.

[Buzduk]

I've got to give props to Dave for handling himself like a true professional and letting his products and customers validate his quality and attention to detail! I have a Spectre and am sooo happy with it! That being said, I want a Kodiak, TL, Essence, Element, Surefire 22s, SS sparrow, etc! I think people are lying if they said they didnt want one of each! As far as engraving on the tube, i wish there was no engraving on my tube at all! I'm not saying that SWR's engraving dosent look good( it does) I just don't need it for it to function the way it needs to. As far as the baffles and mono cores go, i'm no engineer but I have to say that when I look at liberty's design I see ART! I love the sparrow and know that it is a great product but for people to look at the design of a liberty mono core and not be amazed baffles (no pun intended) me!

[coyote223]

Coyote223, let me know how the Kodiak does on your 22 hornet.

It actually does fine on the Hornet,,,





But, from reading post's by SWR on here. The fact that it won't be warrantied for Hornet use, is a given. I'd have to search for the thread again. It was something about how the Spectre would eventually fail, because of the volume of pressure from the hornet. So I just got the Kodiak for piece of mind.

[SRM]

I've got to give props to Dave for handling himself like a true professional and letting his products and customers validate his quality and attention to detail! I have a Spectre and am sooo happy with it! That being said, I want a Kodiak, TL, Essence, Element, Surefire 22s, SS sparrow, etc! I think people are lying if they said they didnt want one of each! As far as engraving on the tube, i wish there was no engraving on my tube at all! I'm not saying that SWR's engraving dosent look good( it does) I just don't need it for it to function the way it needs to. As far as the baffles and mono cores go, i'm no engineer but I have to say that when I look at liberty's design I see ART! I love the sparrow and know that it is a great product but for people to look at the design of a liberty mono core and not be amazed baffles (no pun intended) me!

HELL YA, I hear that!!!

[Shamrock-MP]

I've got to give props to Dave for handling himself like a true professional and letting his products and customers validate his quality and attention to detail! I have a Spectre and am sooo happy with it! That being said, I want a Kodiak, TL, Essence, Element, Surefire 22s, SS sparrow, etc! I think people are lying if they said they didnt want one of each! As far as engraving on the tube, i wish there was no engraving on my tube at all! I'm not saying that SWR's engraving dosent look good( it does) I just don't need it for it to function the way it needs to. As far as the baffles and mono cores go, i'm no engineer but I have to say that when I look at liberty's design I see ART! I love the sparrow and know that it is a great product but for people to look at the design of a liberty mono core and not be amazed baffles (no pun intended) me!

Unlike Buzduk, I do not want a bunch of cans for a single caliber. I want each gun to have it's own can no matter the caliber- a SS Sparrow for my Ruger 22/45, an Element for my Savage 64(22lr), a Kodiak for the 22 Hornet bolt(Savage) I don't own yet, and the Surefire for another 22lr pistol(Walther) I don't own yet. I also want the SS/Titanium liberty Constitution for my AR, an SWR Omega 300 for the 300 Blackout I have not ordered yet, and a SC Osprey for my Kimber 1911. Then...

By the way, I have to mention Buzduk's latest reactions to ignorance. On my last two trips to the range with Buz--
1. He broke some guys heart by informing him that he did not have an accutrigger on his new $150 Savage bolt, in a "you idiot" kind of way. Only after the guy was a little arrogant about something. The sad look on the guys face as he realized his mistake, oops.
2. The next trip to the range, we walked in to have another shooter notice Buz's SWR can. The nice man asked if he liked it, then said "I bought a MITE". Buz winced, as if in pain. The man quickly said "it didn't suppress anything" and stated that he thought that suppressors were a hoax. Buz's SWR proved suppressors do work and work well. The guy looked so disgusted.
Hilarious!

[Buzduk]

In my defense I felt bad about letting the guy know that he didn't have an accu trigger. But the guy wouldn't stop. "na man it said accu trigger on the box and in the manual and the guy at Wal Mart ($179.00) said this is the one I want" LOL as for the guy with the mite I don't think I winced that bad! Did I ?

[Shamrock-MP]

WINCED, Yes, as if in tremendous physical agony!