HTG Eureka or Aris?

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Munk
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HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:51 am

I am building a 10.5" SBR in 5.56, and am looking for a suppressor that is short, light-weight, inexpensive, take apart, and well built (who isn't?) So far I have narrowed it down to two HTG suppressors, the Aris and Eureka.

Aris
Length: 6.1"
Length Added: 5.5"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 21 oz
Materials: Inconel & SS
NSR: 34 dB
MSRP: $597

Eureka
Length: 4.8"
Length Added: 4.2"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 17 oz
Materials: Inconel & SS
NSR: 28 dB
MSRP: $548

The question is, is the extra .7" and 4oz worth the 6dB drop? I am trying to keep this as short and light as possible, and am going through some pretty significant lengths to do so...but I would also like to have a pleasant experience when shooting 5.56 without hearing protection. From what I understand, every additional 10 dB, the "perceived loudness" doubles...and so 6 dB would be pretty significant. If we assume a 10.5" is putting out 168 dB unsuppressed, we are looking at 140dB vs 134dB. Is 140dB alright on the ears? Honestly, I have a hunch the extra ~half inch and 4oz would probably be worth that additional 6dB reduction, would you agree?

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Bendersquint » Sun Apr 01, 2012 10:24 am

Munk wrote:I am building a 10.5" SBR in 5.56, and am looking for a suppressor that is short, light-weight, inexpensive, take apart, and well built (who isn't?) So far I have narrowed it down to two HTG suppressors, the Aris and Eureka.

Aris
Length: 6.1"
Length Added: 5.5"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 21 oz
Materials: Inconel & SS
NSR: 34 dB
MSRP: $597

Eureka
Length: 4.8"
Length Added: 4.2"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 17 oz
Materials: Inconel & SS
NSR: 28 dB
MSRP: $548

The question is, is the extra .7" and 4oz worth the 6dB drop? I am trying to keep this as short and light as possible, and am going through some pretty significant lengths to do so...but I would also like to have a pleasant experience when shooting 5.56 without hearing protection. From what I understand, every additional 10 dB, the "perceived loudness" doubles...and so 6 dB would be pretty significant. If we assume a 10.5" is putting out 168 dB unsuppressed, we are looking at 140dB vs 134dB. Is 140dB alright on the ears? Honestly, I have a hunch the extra ~half inch and 4oz would probably be worth that additional 6dB reduction, would you agree?
Why the hangup on take apart, its not neccesary in a centerfire rifle can.

Of the 2 i would go with the ARIS, I have a Eureka and its ok.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by JasonM » Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:39 am

Munk wrote:I am building a 10.5" SBR in 5.56, and am looking for a suppressor that is short, light-weight, inexpensive, take apart, and well built (who isn't?)

...but I would also like to have a pleasant experience when shooting 5.56 without hearing protection...
I agree with Bender, take apart as a requirement is not needed, and is too limiting. The best rifle cans are sealed.

That said, I think you'll be disappointed if you are hoping for a hearing safe 10.5 AR. Definitely to be "hearing safER", go with the larger quieter can.
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by srt-4_uk » Sun Apr 01, 2012 11:44 am

Bendersquint wrote: Why the hangup on take apart, its not neccesary in a centerfire rifle can.
about 3 years ago, companies were saying that about rimfire suppressors and about 1 year ago, companies were saying that about centerfire pistol suppressors. Its crazy how things change.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Buzduk » Sun Apr 01, 2012 12:28 pm

srt-4_uk wrote:
Bendersquint wrote: Why the hangup on take apart, its not neccesary in a centerfire rifle can.
about 3 years ago, companies were saying that about rimfire suppressors and about 1 year ago, companies were saying that about centerfire pistol suppressors. Its crazy how things change.
+1

Also 4oz and .7 inches for 6 db? Hell yes it's worth it! Sealed or user serviceable 6 db is huge!
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Sun Apr 01, 2012 2:57 pm

I am looking for a take apart can because I plan on shooting both 5.56 and .22 lr through it (with a drop in conversion kit and whatnot) which also narrows down which silencers I can use without voiding a warranty. I expect i'll be doing most of my suppressed shooting with the .22 because its cheap, really quite, and i'll mainly be shooting at targets for fun. But, I don't really want to buy two cans for my rifle, as the .22 alone (with a tax stamp and whatnot) will run me about $500-$600 on top of whatever I pay for the .223...which I'd still want to be light, small, quite, and inexpensive. With tax stamps, that's about twice the price (or more) i'd have to spend. There would have to be some serious advantages with going that route, more than saving 4-5 oz.

With that in mind, I also have a YHM Cobra for my Glock 19 in process, and I hear that does well on .22lr (plus it too is take apart). See the below video for an example or 9mm can shooting .22LR. Would it be a better route to just get a dedicated .223 can and do my .22lr shooting with the Cobra?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDy8XsbQlVM

It seems the Aris's 34 dB rating is about at the top end for .223 cans, so I'd only really be gaining a weight (and possibly OAL) advantage with a different can. From what I understand, the Aris is built pretty tough (and especially so with the Eureka). The only problem is, for the cans I have seen thus far, only titanium ones offer a significant weight reduction for a 6" can of equal suppression, but those cost $1000 or more. Then again, the Gemtech Trek-T for example, is 5.7" long and only 10.3 ounces! I am not sure on its dB rating, but maybe something like this is worth the extra money in the long run?

And by "hearing safe" I mean something I could shoot occasionally without hearing protection and not damage my ears. And if I had to shoot this inside for HD, I wouldn't want to loose my hearing. If I can get it to be on par with a unsuppressed 16" .22LR, I think that would suffice. From what I understand, an unsuppressed .22LR is around the 145 mark. If a 10.5" .223 produced 168 dB, and I have a 34 dB reduction, we are looking at 134 dB...which is below OSHA's limit for impulse noises and quieter than the .22. Plus I have a Innovative Arms WAR receiver, which is said to reduce the dB at the ear 2 dB on semi-auto ARs, similar to the Noveske switch block. Granted this can't stop the sonic boom, which is about the 140 dB mark, even still wouldn't this be relatively ok on the ears if in limited amounts, especially considering that a firecracker at close range is about on par with a unsuppressed .22LR (at 140-145 dB)?

Am I missing something? For example, is any suppression below 140 dB negligible since it'll be washed out by the sonic crack (which is 140 dB)? Would this mean the Eureka and Aris will be about the same to the ear when shooting super sonic ammo?

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Bendersquint » Sun Apr 01, 2012 6:41 pm

Munk wrote:I am looking for a take apart can because I plan on shooting both 5.56 and .22 lr through it (with a drop in conversion kit and whatnot) which also narrows down which silencers I can use without voiding a warranty. I expect i'll be doing most of my suppressed shooting with the .22 because its cheap, really quite, and i'll mainly be shooting at targets for fun. But, I don't really want to buy two cans for my rifle, as the .22 alone (with a tax stamp and whatnot) will run me about $500-$600 on top of whatever I pay for the .223...which I'd still want to be light, small, quite, and inexpensive. With tax stamps, that's about twice the price (or more) i'd have to spend. There would have to be some serious advantages with going that route, more than saving 4-5 oz.

With that in mind, I also have a YHM Cobra for my Glock 19 in process, and I hear that does well on .22lr (plus it too is take apart). See the below video for an example or 9mm can shooting .22LR. Would it be a better route to just get a dedicated .223 can and do my .22lr shooting with the Cobra?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDy8XsbQlVM

It seems the Aris's 34 dB rating is about at the top end for .223 cans, so I'd only really be gaining a weight (and possibly OAL) advantage with a different can. From what I understand, the Aris is built pretty tough (and especially so with the Eureka). The only problem is, for the cans I have seen thus far, only titanium ones offer a significant weight reduction for a 6" can of equal suppression, but those cost $1000 or more. Then again, the Gemtech Trek-T for example, is 5.7" long and only 10.3 ounces! I am not sure on its dB rating, but maybe something like this is worth the extra money in the long run?

And by "hearing safe" I mean something I could shoot occasionally without hearing protection and not damage my ears. And if I had to shoot this inside for HD, I wouldn't want to loose my hearing. If I can get it to be on par with a unsuppressed 16" .22LR, I think that would suffice. From what I understand, an unsuppressed .22LR is around the 145 mark. If a 10.5" .223 produced 168 dB, and I have a 34 dB reduction, we are looking at 134 dB...which is below OSHA's limit for impulse noises and quieter than the .22. Plus I have a Innovative Arms WAR receiver, which is said to reduce the dB at the ear 2 dB on semi-auto ARs, similar to the Noveske switch block. Granted this can't stop the sonic boom, which is about the 140 dB mark, even still wouldn't this be relatively ok on the ears if in limited amounts, especially considering that a firecracker at close range is about on par with a unsuppressed .22LR (at 140-145 dB)?

Am I missing something? For example, is any suppression below 140 dB negligible since it'll be washed out by the sonic crack (which is 140 dB)? Would this mean the Eureka and Aris will be about the same to the ear when shooting super sonic ammo?
Actually missing quite a bit, the difference is noticeable.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Sun Apr 01, 2012 7:02 pm

How loud is an unsuppressed 10.5" SBR shooting supersonic ammo? 170dB, 175dB?? I've heard they are loud but aren't really sure on the actual numbers. Lets assume the worst at 175 dB (which I am fairly certain is more than what it would actually be). With a 34 dB reduction, plus an extra 2 dB with the WAR, that brings it down to 139 dB. I am also relatively sure this will be louder than a firecracker. I came across multiple sources that said firecrackers are 150 dB, and yet a .22LR is only 140-145...which seems backwards to me. It must have to do with the distance difference between shooting a .22 rifle and lighting off firecrackers on the 4th of July (i.e. 24" vs. 6'). But still, 139 dB on the conservative side ain't bad from what I understand, right? I have heard plenty of great reports from buyers about the Aris being on par or better than more expensive brands, along with good metering tests as well. About how much of a difference would you say there is between a .22LR unsuppressed and a .223 suppressed with a 34 dB rating? How about with a WAR receiver / Switch Block installed? I'm asking you guys because I am not sure myself...what am I missing, and what is causing the discrepancy between the numbers and the actual experience?

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by BretJ » Mon Apr 09, 2012 8:42 pm

If cost and compatibility is a concern, have you considered going with a .30 cal can? Gives you a lot more flexibility if you are not a decibel hound. Not much louder than a dedicated .223 can when installed on a .223. A good take apart can would allow you to shoot everything from .308 on down to .223. Just a thought. I payed just over 5 bills for mine.
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Tue Apr 10, 2012 12:22 am

Yeah, I have but its hard to get over the added weight and length (unless you fork over a pretty penny to get a titanium one). To make things even more difficult, I plan to shoot .22LR through it...and so it would have to be serviceable / take apart. I have only found a few suppressors that can do this.

Coastal LRT suppressor:
9.75" :(
28 oz :(
$500 :)

Fisher Suppressor:
???"
??? oz
$1050 :|

Shark suppressor:
8.5" :)
15-19 oz :)
$1500 :(

After a certain point, I think it actually costs more (money and/or length and weight) to try to get an "all in one" suppressor than a few that'll cover the same caliber range. But, at the moment, I can only afford one. I know I want .22LR for super cheap and super quiet shooting, and I am currently making a 5.56 SBR so I need one that can handle that as well. Maybe in time I'll get into 308, but I don't think I should start on a whole new caliber before completing what I already have on my plate. To make a 308 suppressor worth it, I would also need to invest more money into the rifle (or even a whole other rifle)...and that could mean another SBR, and another stamp, etc etc. Makes my wallet hurt just thinking about it.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by BretJ » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:25 am

I purchased a Thompson Machine "30" monocore user servicable can for multi-caliber use. From what I have seen/read, it rates pretty well as far as dbs are concerned. Can't judge for myself until my stamp clears sometime in August.

Length: 8.4"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 27oz
Cost: Just over 5 bills

It's all a tradeoff. It's a bit heavy but I based my decision on the fact they are a Florida company so no transfer costs/time issues and cost of the can.
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by pinedog31 » Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:32 am

I know HTG has a new line of titanium cans out for both the 5.56 and .308, i dont think that they are on the web site yet but it might be worth calling and getting more info on them.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:01 pm

pinedog31 wrote:I know HTG has a new line of titanium cans out for both the 5.56 and .308, i dont think that they are on the web site yet but it might be worth calling and getting more info on them.
Oh really? I did not know that. If its still well priced and serviceable, then I think that might be the one for me!

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by gunguy » Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:56 pm

JasonM wrote:
Munk wrote:I am building a 10.5" SBR in 5.56, and am looking for a suppressor that is short, light-weight, inexpensive, take apart, and well built (who isn't?)

...but I would also like to have a pleasant experience when shooting 5.56 without hearing protection...
I agree with Bender, take apart as a requirement is not needed, and is too limiting. The best rifle cans are sealed.

That said, I think you'll be disappointed if you are hoping for a hearing safe 10.5 AR. Definitely to be "hearing safER", go with the larger quieter can.
I read alot of people saying you don,t need a take apart .556 can, but I have one and I love it, mainly because you can replace the baffles. I shoot mine on 10.5 sbr with a can and use a slidefire stock on it, I know it not a must have, but I like being able to take my can apart and inspect the baffles. A quick side not; get a Q.D. can because the thread mounts seam to loosen up.
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Munk
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Tue Apr 10, 2012 10:21 pm

Yeah, I hear the same but I am also going to be shooting .22LR through it. Definitely want a take apart can.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by JasonM » Tue Apr 10, 2012 10:52 pm

Munk wrote:Yeah, I hear the same but I am also going to be shooting .22LR through it. Definitely want a take apart can.
In this case, definitely.
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Sun Apr 15, 2012 4:07 pm

Aris 5.56 Suppressor in Titanium, confirmed by Nutnfancy and HTG at Shotshow

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXJiTHalIIE

Original Aris:
Length: 6.1"
Length Added: 5.5"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 21 oz
Materials: Inconel & SS
NSR: 34 dB
MSRP: $597

Titanium Aris (should be same size dimensions)
Length: 6.1"
Length Added: 5.5"
Diameter: 1.5"
Weight: 12 oz
Materials: Titanium & ??? (Inconel?)
NSR: 34 dB
MSRP: $???

Save $50 by entering the discount code of "Nutnfancy" when ordering!

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by Munk » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:02 am

Price on the New Ti Aris:
$795

Absolutely amazing. This has got to be one of the best 5.56 suppressors in the market. Class leading dB reduction levels, small size, light weight, user-serviceable, and well priced.

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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by JC Weaponry » Tue May 08, 2012 12:00 am

If you can't find the HTG Aris or CoyoTi in stock locally, I do have two of each in stock now. 8)

I've enjoyed my Aris personally, and using it on 22lr Is a bonus.
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Re: HTG Eureka or Aris?

Post by bani » Thu May 10, 2012 2:01 pm

JC Weaponry wrote:If you can't find the HTG Aris or CoyoTi in stock locally, I do have two of each in stock now. 8)

I've enjoyed my Aris personally, and using it on 22lr Is a bonus.
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