308 subsonic loads for 5R

[ick]

Edited my post to list the can. I am disappointed that I failed to do so the first time.

[M40A1308M]

Ok, powder came in I have N310 and N320 and N340. I tested 9mm first and now to the .308 tests. Any body have the start grain for mentioned powder?

[strom19]

Wish I could tell ya...but I'm still stumbling in the dark myself. Will post my findings when Indiana Jones gets back from Sweden

[M40A1308M]

I think I will try starting at 8 and work up. I have a throw around .308 with a cheap suppressor. If things don't blow up I will test in the better rifle setup. I will be testing both at a down angle and elevated and level. I want to see the effects of the powder away from the primer. I have a shooting platform and I shoot at down angles allot. Well i should have some data by mon.

[strom19]

Best of luck with that!

[ncorry]

Typically with rifle subsonics, you start high and work down. Since the Lapua factory loads are 11.5, I'd start at 12.5 and work down. Prevents SEE and stuck bullets. From experience, a stuck bullet that you know about is a real pain in the ass. From hearing about it, a stuck bullet that you don't know about can be a real pain in the face. I wouldn't start this experiment with a suppressor. It should be the last thing that comes into play.

I highly suggest starting with a very clean and well lubed barrel and swabbing between each shot. I picked up a tip from someone on another board for shooting subsonic 308s. JB Bore Paste or USP bore cleaning paste (Midway #257358). In my 16 inch Savage 10FP, polishing hte barrel with the USP bore paste really well as part of the cleaning process before shooting subsonics reduced my subsonic 10 shot strings' SD by 40%. A moly spray on the bullets has been helpful for me.

The HSM subsonics have a moly coating on them.

I forgot to mention, I've got a box of 19 TTI 308 subs ( http://www.ttiarmory.com/subsonic.html ) that I'd part with for $10 + shipping if anyone wants to give them a try.

[M40A1308M]

While you mention very good guidelines I have never stuck a bullet and I have a AACSD .308 with over 400 rounds without cleaning and still never stuck a bullet. I do not use molly in any way shape or form. Its the worst thing for precision rifles.{moly ring of death }. But I do know some that think it works. But I think you are correct the suppressor comes last in the test phase. I will be loading on the high side and working down. More than likely if I think there is a risk in a explosion I will mount the rifle in a fixture and if it blows I have a duplicate rifle new in the box. I don't recommend anyone to try to blow up a rifle but if it happens, I will definitely know where the limit is. But I will have to test the rifle in a downward angle to be sure no pressure signs are evident and that's where it can all go wrong.

I wonder if the animal fat or Crisco trick would work for some instead of moly.

[JohnInNH]

Typically with rifle subsonics, you start high and work down. Since the Lapua factory loads are 11.5, I'd start at 12.5 and work down. Prevents SEE and stuck bullets. From experience, a stuck bullet that you know about is a real pain in the ass. From hearing about it, a stuck bullet that you don't know about can be a real pain in the face. I wouldn't start this experiment with a suppressor. It should be the last thing that comes into play.

I highly suggest starting with a very clean and well lubed barrel and swabbing between each shot. I picked up a tip from someone on another board for shooting subsonic 308s. JB Bore Paste or USP bore cleaning paste (Midway #257358). In my 16 inch Savage 10FP, polishing hte barrel with the USP bore paste really well as part of the cleaning process before shooting subsonics reduced my subsonic 10 shot strings' SD by 40%. A moly spray on the bullets has been helpful for me.

The HSM subsonics have a moly coating on them.

I forgot to mention, I've got a box of 19 TTI 308 subs ( http://www.ttiarmory.com/subsonic.html ) that I'd part with for $10 + shipping if anyone wants to give them a try.

If you use Trail Boss instead of 2FF Black Powder you don't have to mess around with Crisco and cleaning the bore with a wet patch after each shot


LOL sounded almost like a SASS forum post with animal base lube, and blow tubes to soften powder fouling. (I shot Black Powder at SASS matches)

[M40A1308M]

Well over seas subsonic rifle shooters use it on .308's to prevent a bullet to get stuck in the barrel. I think in my personal opinion that MOLY is bad stuff. If you call Rock Creek barrels they will confirm that they get barrels ruined from MOLY all the time and don't recommend using it . As all my tactical rifles have Rock Creek barrels I will go with there recommendation.

[M40A1308M]

And on a slightly different subject Vit powders just came out with there cowboy action powder and it is CLEAN and it fills the case like Trail boss. So I was wondering would this work for reduced loads in .308.

[M40A1308M]

Ok 15 grains of N340 did not work. And it shows a slight pressure increase shooting down. The factory Lapua did not. Back to the drawing board.

[M40A1308M]

Sorry I havn't stoped trying to reproduce the load but have been away for a while. The N320 had better results at 15 grains with a 220 round nose. But had not so much luck with the 220 Match round. I will try to use the Lapua bullet next.

[drail14me]

I've been quietly watching your thread for your results. I'm shooting a Remington 5R .308 24" Milspec rifle and have been trying to find some subsonic ammo that will shoot well though it.

I've tried the CorBon 185gr Subsonic but could only get a 4" group at 100yds. This was my first time shooting .308 subsonics but figured I'd get a better group than that. What should I expect?

Have you guys had better results and found a load that works well?

[biguns]

And on a slightly different subject Vit powders just came out with there cowboy action powder and it is CLEAN and it fills the case like Trail boss. So I was wondering would this work for reduced loads in .308.

Hi , I am new in this forum, but had to join since it seems to be an excellent place for information.

I just bought 0.5kg of VV's "TinStar" (N32C) and have loaded a few .308's with 12grn and 11grn to start with, under a 180grn Hornady bullet.
I will test fire these when I get hold of a chronograph, and I will keep you posted.

I can already now let you know that a full .308 case (ca 3.1 cc) will take 19.5grn of N32C and that my cases mentioned above are approx. 60-65% filled!

(N32C is supposed to behave like N320 but is a lot bulkier)

My rifle is the Ruger Scout (export version with 18" barrel)

cheers

[M40A1308M]

I would start trying diff rent ammo in your gun. 4" group is a little big but you have to remember all the out side factors. Wind,temp, your shooting set up. Is your rifle on a solid rest? But your rifle is more than likey telling you to use a different ammo. I was not impressed with the Corbon stuff at all in my rifles not to say its bad ammo it just wont shoot in my gun well. My groups with that ammo were opened up a bit. There are so many manufactures doing sub sonic .308 now I would try what you can find. I ordered all that I could find on the net. It can get pricey for some ammo but ordering only one box of each should not break the bank. Still Lapua is my top so far. No wind day groups are averaging sub MOA. I am using a AACSD with a M3 ultra scope and a Jewell trigger.

[biguns]

Ok, I have now tested my .308WIN SS loads with VV N32C - Tin Star!
Barrel : 18 inch.
Case: Norma, ignition holes drilled to 3.5mm diameter (mostly for fun, I have now 10 cases especially for SS loads, marked with paint).
Primer: CCI 200
Powder: N32C, 12 grains and 11 grains.
Bullet: 180 grains Hornady #3075
Three shots of each powder weight, measured at 3 meters from mussle:

12 grains of N32C: 1092*, 1151* and 1085 fps (avrg = 1109 fps)

11 grains of N32C: 1013*, 967 and 982 fps (avrg = 987 fps)

*= tilted gun upwards before firing to get the powder at the back of the case.

I think I will continue to work with the 11grn load, check for wobbling, accuracy etc.

Kids, don't try this at home!

[M40A1308M]

If you could try a round or two with out the flash hole drilled and a load of 11.5 to see if you get good results. I am sure that lapua does NOT drill there flash hole. i cannot get that powder as of yet and would like to see this result.

[biguns]

If you could try a round or two with out the flash hole drilled and a load of 11.5 to see if you get good results. I am sure that lapua does NOT drill there flash hole. i cannot get that powder as of yet and would like to see this result.

I loaded 2-3 of each 11.5grn and 10.7grn of N32C under the 180 grn bullet in cases w/ and w/o drilled flash holes:

11.5grn, normal cases: 1093, 1068 fps
11.5grn, drilled cases: 1028, 1031 fps

10.7grn, normal cases: 990, 1007, 971 fps
10.7grn, drilled cases: 1049, 1028, 999 fps

I also tried loading with a 150grn bullet (Hornady SST):
9.5grn, normal cases, 150grn bullet: 1032, 1039, 1032 fps
9.5grn, drilled cases, 150grn bullet: 1049, 1030, 1036 fps

I am a little pussled over the 11.5grn results as the drilled cases produced slower velocities! The drilled cases has been used several times now whereas the others has only been shot once (factory ammo).

I will stay with the 10.7grn load to be sure that it stays subsonic also when using a can.

/B

[M40A1308M]

Thank you for the data. I use 10.7 of trail boss and DO NOT drill the flash hole and I am plesaed with the result.

Thanks again, I will be ordering some of the N32C and try some things.

[BT8624]

Here is another Tin Star recipe if anyone is interested. I believe I was just over the line as far as getting under the sound barrier, as all had a fairly loud report. Although above the sound barrier, they were really fun to plink around with, hardly any recoil at all. This would be a great load for a child, new shooter or someone who is recoil and/or big bang sensitive.

Equipment Used:

• Rifle: Remington 700
  Barrel: 16.5", 1-10" twist rate with AAC Breakout (suppressor not attached)
  Chronograph: Oehler 35

Ammo info:

• Brass: Hornady Match trimmed to 2.005" (brass unaltered other than full-length sized and trimmed)
  Primer: CCI Large Rifle
  Bullet: 168 gr Hornady BTHP
  Powder: Vihtavuori N32C (Tin Star)
  COL: 2.800"

Results:
Charge range: 12.5 gr - 10.5 gr Viht N32C (Tin Star)
(fps data are 3-shot averages from chronograph)

• 12.5 gr - 1302 fps
  12.0 gr - 1268 fps ... 34 fps slower
  11.5 gr - 1217 fps ... 51 fps slower
  11.0 gr - 1127 fps ... 90 fps slower
  10.5 gr - 1117 fps ... 10 fps slower

It surprised me that there was such a big decrease between 11.5 gr and 11.0 gr (90 fps) but only a 10 fps drop between 11.0 and 10.5 gr. Can anyone explain that?

I plan on continuing my development (hopefully tomorrow), but start at 11.0 and work down a couple more grains. My goal is to have them flying at 1050-1080 fps.

Disclaimer: this is my data as shot through my rifle with the weather conditions as they were at the time I shot them (cloudy, mid-80's, and humid with a light breeze). Your results may vary.

Peace-Out,
Brad

[john_vinblad]

i am trying the N32C in a lapua case pushing a scenar 200gr. starting at 12.5gr results saturday afternoon hopefully

[strom19]

Lapua factory loading for their 200 gr. Subsonic is 10 gr. of unknown powder ( Not Tin Star) and they don't enlarge the primer pocket.

[john_vinblad]

Lapuas powder is proprietary info but some of my friends have had success with N32c so i am giving it a try. Too expensive with 55€ för 20 rounds here in Finland. I have some Lapua subsonic once suot brass that i will use

[strom19]

As soon as I can get to download pic's I will. Cost $47.00 us dollars here.

[john_vinblad]

I will be shooting from a remmy tactical .308 SPS 1:12 twist rate. What is the heaviest bullet that will stabilize at 343m/s? Can I shoot a 200 grain scenar without problems like baffel strikes? How does the supressor affect the speed? Does it increase it due to it making the barrel longer or is there no difference? Well I guess I will know this weekend after testing I will chrono the loads so we will see.