Suppressors as SHTF gear?

[RWBlue]

I once shot my friend's .177 RWS in his backyard and thought, s--t, that was as loud as a regular .22 pistol! I just knew the cops would come. My suppressed Ruger .22 in my backyard sounds more like a single cock Daisy BB gun. THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE.

Which RWS?
Springer?
Supersonic projectile?

I am looking for a springer to complement my other pellet guns. I think .22 is the way to go, but have yet to find someone who will tell me they love their quiet .22 springer and have used it to kill small furry things.

[FNCFAN]

I once shot my friend's .177 RWS in his backyard and thought, s--t, that was as loud as a regular .22 pistol! I just knew the cops would come. My suppressed Ruger .22 in my backyard sounds more like a single cock Daisy BB gun. THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE.

Which RWS?
Springer?
Supersonic projectile?

I am looking for a springer to complement my other pellet guns. I think .22 is the way to go, but have yet to find someone who will tell me they love their quiet .22 springer and have used it to kill small furry things.

Geez, that was about 18 years ago. Don't have a clue what model or pellet. I was just shocked the thing could make that much noise. It could have been a "Diana" model, or close to it.

[Brian HHI 7265]

Dittos re: the .177 being louder than a suppressed rifle. My surefire with subsonic 33gr load (.223 16" contender) is silent except for working the action. My FW600 .177 is louder, I can only imagine an air rifle that is designed for power with it's associated noise.

If I had to carry one rifle it'd be a suppressed AR in .223 with a mess of subsonic loads for silent dispatching of whatever. If silent didn't count, then I'd use it supersonic and still have my position hidden.

Oh yes, a suppressor is definite SHTF gear w/o a doubt. Combine it with NV and you have something completely passive. Add an IR flashlight (not alot of mwattage is required) and it does more but is no longer passive- makes no difference if others have no NV though.

Who the heck wants to hurt their hearing if they've got to use their rifle anyway? I don't plan on using hearing protection. I want to hear what's going on around me.

[mtelkman]

I tired to make this my signature, but it was too long:
----
Never suppress a .22lr, they have little use for anything other than training young children to knock over soft drink cans. Going through the NFA hassle and expense for something with virtually no tactical value is - in my opinion - absurd. A .177 caliber pellet rifle is very quiet, and is just as well suited for small game, yet does not require a 4473, much less a form 4.

I dispute this statement. I have dispatched about 10 red foxes, several feral cats and dogs and innumerable rabbits, prairie dogs and squirrels with my suppressed .22. I can tell you without question that a .177 pellet rifle would not have been quieter OR as deadly.

[Sigproshooter]

I think it simply boils down to this.

A can will give you benefits that NO can will not.

It is an advantage for many reasons. End of story.

I suppress separate weapons, instead of using 1 can on several weapons.

[RWBlue]

I suppress separate weapons, instead of using 1 can on several weapons.

If I had the money, I might go that way.

As is, I just want to be able to suppress all my guns.
.22
45
308

Then comes the 9mm, then....?
Maybe I will come back to getting an new and improved .22, 45, and 308.

[Sigproshooter]

I suppress separate weapons, instead of using 1 can on several weapons.

If I had the money, I might go that way.

As is, I just want to be able to suppress all my guns.
.22
45
308

Then comes the 9mm, then....?
Maybe I will come back to getting an new and improved .22, 45, and 308.

I started out with 1- 5.56 can,then I added a .308 for my PSS. in time I added a 5.7x28 then a .45. Then an AK can, another 5.56 and another .45 and then a can for my M25.

My next is a PBR can for my Krink since I have exactly a 0% chance of AAC building one.

I still need to send my Slabside to SRT so Doug can do an Intergal on it.

After that,,I really don't have any projects in mind.

[gaw]

I am slowly building a precision AR 15.I got a POF genIII lower and magpul PRS stock. This and my p22 are the only weapons that I fell I need to suppress. My M1A and my glock 26 are oh s--t weapons. Suppressors have there place and anyone who would argue different needs to put a lot more thought into the subject at hand. My p22 with weak loads is the quietest thing i have ever shot. air rifles are loud and useless. I worry about aluminum suppressors. I need to get the titanium AWC 22 can. Having a vital piece of your gear be as strong as possable is a must.What little weight it adds does not matter.

[cwilliams]

2. with a .22 I can get all the .20, .243, and .45acp weapons I want. IF the SHTF.

Try that on my watch.

you might be watching but ya wont hear him!

[tangodown911]

I like to use it, but who are we kidding ...someones new administration will be sending their new civilian security force to come collect all of those leagal, tax paid for, items.

[Sigproshooter]

I like to use it, but who are we kidding ...someones new administration will be sending their new civilian security force to come collect all of those leagal, tax paid for, items.

Won't happen, don't get me wrong he ain't my guy. And I have no confidence in him whatsoever.

But I doubt we will see his brown shirt army OR door to door confiscations.

He is so far over his head,he won't even step on THAT slippery slope imho.

[Dave3220]

I like to use it, but who are we kidding ...someones new administration will be sending their new civilian security force to come collect all of those leagal, tax paid for, items.

Won't happen, don't get me wrong he ain't my guy. And I have no confidence in him whatsoever.

But I doubt we will see his brown shirt army OR door to door confiscations.

He is so far over his head,he won't even step on THAT slippery slope imho.

Sure hope you are right...(Mebbe I am just being hopeful, but yours DOES sound like "the voice of reason"....)

And speaking of "reason", isn't it nice that G&R's hormonal brayings have ceased and this thread is actually about things & ideers we can use?

I now have my SRT "Comanche" can for rimfires and will hopefully soon have it threaded onto 10-22 and .22WMR bolt rifles.
I see it as a discrete way to deal with varmints, be able to practice in an increasingly hostile environement, and mebbe pick up some protein while checking my Connibears & snares, which are the PRIME food producers....A firearm is merely incidental to what traps can do.

As to G&R's disparagement of .22LR, read some coroners' reports or talk to some people who have actually done "wet work" about whether or not it can inflict lethal wounds to a human being.
Also check out the Isreli's use of suppressed 10-22,. Started for riot "control" but was toned-down because it was TOO LETHAL.

I have been practicing triple-taps for awhile, and I am getting better to the point where they sound like a low rpm "burst" and I don't have to think about getting those three or so shots away.
Once my suppressor is fitted to my 10-22 and there is minimal weapon noise, I believe that I will be able to make rapid successive hits on a live target.
There is not much on the N.Amer. continent, incl. moose that will survive several .22LRs to the heart/lungs.
(A feral dog or a coyote should have alot to teach me about just what a suppressed weapon is capable of besides subsistance hunting.)

Keep your minds open, check factual sources, and be thankful G&R is back in his fantasy world and no longer on this thread that might conceiveably be of help to some of us.

Dave3220(practicing curmudgeon....Too old to suffer fools gladly any more....)

[Diomed]

I like to use it, but who are we kidding ...someones new administration will be sending their new civilian security force to come collect all of those leagal, tax paid for, items.

I dunno if Obama will be going that route just yet, but I can certainly foresee a situation where they'll start to confiscate NFA as part of a response to some kind of SHTF circumstance.

As said elsewhere, we're the canaries in the coal mine.

[bushpig1998]

Hi everyone, new to the site...So far read some great topics.
I immigrated from Africa about 8 years ago, so I have experienced some form of SHTF (in a sense - not as bad as it can be, but it got rough for a while).
First off, the load-out in a US based SHTF scenario:
16" Barrelled AR15 in 5.56x45 with a matching can of some sort
.22lr conversion kit for said AR
Super and sub sonic 5.56 amm
500 rounds Aquila SSS 22lr rounds (the heavier weight works better with the twist rates of 5.56 AR's).

Now some personal history:
In a SHTF situation, what you got is what you got. The law matters not if you have to put food on the table. If I had to choose between handing in my cheapo Norinco .22lr pistol or keep feeding the family when they started grabbing guns, well, I wouldn't have handed in my pistol. If SHTF and a total collapse of society and govt occurs, who's going to know if you build a cheap and dirty suppressor?
I've personally used the same cheapo Norinco .22lr (knock-off of a Browning buckmark) with a very cheap .22lr suppressor (paid about $20 for it) and 30gr subsonic ammo to harvest Impala at close range. One shot behind the ear is all it takes. It is quiet and I for sure don't want to tangle hand to hand with a knife if I have the option of using a firearm.

Here are some thoughts on hunting at night vs day hunting:
At night, even with a suppressor, you have to use a light. Lights tend to show you what you are shooting at, but it also shows enemies where to shoot at to get to you.

Some thoughts on using a knife:
God made all men, Samuel Colt made them equal. Not all folks are capable (emotionally and physically) of taking a knife and slitting a sentry or enemy's neck. Most folks are capable of aiming and pulling the trigger on a firearm.

If .22lr seems to small, get a 300 Whisper AR. Gives you the best of both world. Near 7.62x39 ballistics or a suppressed .30 cal round with almost .45ACP power. Quite frankly, loading a 300 whisper round sounds a bit easier than trying to keep a .308 subsonic round from going boom with all the free space inside it.

In short, if the chips are down, I'll make sure I have a battle rifle and a game harvester in addition to my handgun - and a can that can go on almost anything I have.
Another twist on this would be a .22lr conversion unit for your side arm. It just adds so much more versatility to what you carry on your person.

I don't have a can yet, but I'm looking at setting up a trust and getting a few...


Thanks for reading and keep the good info coming. I love the posts so far!

Cheers!

[CDAT]

"Here are some thoughts on hunting at night vs day hunting:
At night, even with a suppressor, you have to use a light. Lights tend to show you what you are shooting at, but it also shows enemies where to shoot at to get to you. "
This is why you need NVG's.

[J Krammes]

I view a suppressor as a big plus in a SHTF situation. That is why I have my first on it's way. I should have it in April...

Jeremy

[Artful]

Hi everyone, new to the site...So far read some great topics.
I immigrated from Africa about 8 years ago, so I have experienced some form of SHTF (in a sense - not as bad as it can be, but it got rough for a while).
First off, the load-out in a US based SHTF scenario:
16" Barrelled AR15 in 5.56x45 with a matching can of some sort
.22lr conversion kit for said AR
Super and sub sonic 5.56 amm
500 rounds Aquila SSS 22lr rounds (the heavier weight works better with the twist rates of 5.56 AR's).

Now some personal history:
In a SHTF situation, what you got is what you got. The law matters not if you have to put food on the table. If I had to choose between handing in my cheapo Norinco .22lr pistol or keep feeding the family when they started grabbing guns, well, I wouldn't have handed in my pistol. If SHTF and a total collapse of society and govt occurs, who's going to know if you build a cheap and dirty suppressor?
I've personally used the same cheapo Norinco .22lr (knock-off of a Browning buckmark) with a very cheap .22lr suppressor (paid about $20 for it) and 30gr subsonic ammo to harvest Impala at close range. One shot behind the ear is all it takes. It is quiet and I for sure don't want to tangle hand to hand with a knife if I have the option of using a firearm.

Here are some thoughts on hunting at night vs day hunting:
At night, even with a suppressor, you have to use a light. Lights tend to show you what you are shooting at, but it also shows enemies where to shoot at to get to you.

Some thoughts on using a knife:
God made all men, Samuel Colt made them equal. Not all folks are capable (emotionally and physically) of taking a knife and slitting a sentry or enemy's neck. Most folks are capable of aiming and pulling the trigger on a firearm.

If .22lr seems to small, get a 300 Whisper AR. Gives you the best of both world. Near 7.62x39 ballistics or a suppressed .30 cal round with almost .45ACP power. Quite frankly, loading a 300 whisper round sounds a bit easier than trying to keep a .308 subsonic round from going boom with all the free space inside it.

In short, if the chips are down, I'll make sure I have a battle rifle and a game harvester in addition to my handgun - and a can that can go on almost anything I have.
Another twist on this would be a .22lr conversion unit for your side arm. It just adds so much more versatility to what you carry on your person.

I don't have a can yet, but I'm looking at setting up a trust and getting a few...


Thanks for reading and keep the good info coming. I love the posts so far!

Cheers!

Welcome to the Nue Amerika, We'll try and keep it from going the way your homeland did. Just for your infiormation the AR's come with barrels as slow as 1:14 and as fast as 1:7 - so check that twist and stability before using the 60 grain SSS ammo. And if it works with the cheaper 22LR ammo I wouldn't invest much in 223 subsonic.

300 whisper is good idea but why not just use 7.62x39 AR upper and you don't need extra reloading equipment - works same as 300 whisper with sub and super sonic ammo...

Good thoughts to share with us, Thanks for that.

[Brian HHI 7265]

For hunting at night, dittos the NV. Too, one doesn't need to use white light. With NV an IR flashlight can be used. The Surefire Millenium is one such, and it's small, light and good out to 100 yards. But, anyone else with NV can plainly see it, of course the beam isn't seen with the unaided eye. The red light made by the flashlight can be seen if it's pointed directly at you, but since the red glow is so dim, I have no idea how far away it can be seen.

[Muab]

At the risk of flogging the argument a little...

I have used some of the finest and most powerful air rifles around in .177, .20 and .22 and the .22 lr is still my very most important tool in the gun cabinet.

I used to shoot a VERY impressive British air rifle that was ridiculously accurate and powerful. After being amazed at its ass-kicking airgun power I was shocked to realize that it had less down range energy than a .22 CB cap, let alone any of the LR offerings.

I have reliably killed animals at significant ranges where if you were armed with a .177 or a knife you would starve unless you were handy at building deadfall traps.

I think the suppressed .22 is perhaps the most useful SHTF weapon. In a true SHTF situation 10 or 20 years from now you could still find pockets of 22 lr all over the place.

[Omega_556]

In a true SHTF situation 10 or 20 years from now you could still find pockets of 22 lr all over the place.

And you could stock pile 25k rounds easily...

[Muab]

In a true SHTF situation 10 or 20 years from now you could still find pockets of 22 lr all over the place.

And you could stock pile 25k rounds easily...

Absolutely. If you think of a scenario where you would have to hoof it cross country any distance and then re-establish you could conceivably carry 5,000 rounds of .22 ammo or maybe more. No other round can give you the ammo availability, portability and compactness/lethality ratio of .22 lr.

Actually, my only issue with .22 is my issue with rimfire---namely the misfire ratio of rimfire.

[Dave3220]

Ihave a couple 10-22's.
One is a factory HB that has been shortened, a 2nd barrel hold-down screw added out on the forend, and muzzle threaded that is MUCH more accurate now than w/factory length barrel.
Other has a 16" fluted Lotahr Waltehr HB and was got from Clark, and shoots as well as my old M-52 Win. used to.
I have a Butler Creek folder on it, as well as bedding and the 2nd hold-down screw.
I am gettign it threaded now, but in anticipation of folders, semi-autos, and over 10 rd. detatchable mags. being decreed illegal by our robot overlords, I am also having an Anshutz sporter threaded to take my SRT Commanche like the others. (This is another .22LR that shot noticeably better after having the barrel shortened to 16".)(??)

Ammo: Rem. Sub-Sonic varies in vel. over my chronograph from aprox 800fps to over 1,200 fps, (complete w/ sonic "Crack!"
CCI Std. Vel. is quiet and CONSISTENT. I flat-nose these in a Beljan or SGB die for better terminal performance.
I will buy another case of CCI 40 gr. Sub-Sonic h.p. when they are available since these are just as reliable, and are a better choice for controlling digger squirrels in hay fields.
In CCI the only priming irregularities I have come across are very occassional ones in the el cheapo "Blazers"...These shoot pretty accurate, but won't always function a short barreled 10-22 with the first few rds. from the mag. (?) while I have not had problems with the Std. Vel. CCI functioning at all (more ????)

I spent less $ for my SRT than for a THeoben gas-ram .25 cal. pellet rifle that I was extremely glad to find a buyer for, than for suppressor, registration, and barrel threading.
A firearm is much simpler than any airgun, especially pneumatics and their fill apperatus.
The ony jsutification for airguns is when there is NO ammunition, and THEN, there might not be any pellets either, so I think the "answer" is to have more .22LR than you can conceiveably use in your life-time, properly stored around your AO.
My Blazers are practice/last resort/barter ammo, and my Std. Vel. and SUb-SOnic h.p. CCI are my "premium" fodder.

If I can, I will get another high quality, user-serviceable ''can' for .22 rimfire, and one for 190 gr. 1,000 fps .357 rifle laods, or possibly 7.62x39mm, but financial realites may have made that an impossibility.
Better to have several good rifles, precision/snugly threaded, an excellent user-serviceable suppressor, and alot of .22 ammo than NO suppressor and pallets of noisy ammo that will attract unwanted attention and racks of AKs that may be declared "illegal" tomorrow. (I know...The totalitarians want ALL firearms, but I figure manually operated .22's will among the last on their list, and what isn't heard does not get reported on by neighborhood squealers.)

Dave3220/Paradox Pete

[Muab]

+1 Dave

[YugoRPK]

People Ive known who have been killed with .22's....2
People I have known who have been killed with pellet guns...0

[Dave3220]

People Ive known who have been killed with .22's....2
People I have known who have been killed with pellet guns...0

An older friend of mine working as a Border Patrol Inspector (as they were called 30+ years ago....) was called to a crime scene in west Texas to assist local deputies.

A newly married couple had stopped at a roadside rest and the young husband was asleep in a bedroll on the ground while his wife slept on the pickup truck seat.
3 predators approached them and while two of them were beating the young man with rocks, the 3rd stuck a (stolen) Colt Woodsman thru the partially opened window and demanded that the young woman unlock the truck door & allow herself to be raped.
She took the Woodsman from him and shot him between the eyes, then opened the door and shot #2 predator while the 3rd rock wielder ran....She brought him down dieing with a kidney or spine shot.

Then there was the recent shooting in S.Amer by an Olympic rapid-fire champ who took out three armed, would-be kidknappers with three shots.
(In either of these cases the situation could not have been handled any better with a more powerful weapon...Obviously....)

Then, there are the boxcarloads of venison killed w/.22LR......

A man would PREFER to have a little "more gun" than a .22, but as shown, it'll do if that's all you've got & you "hold hard".

I've heard of one pelletgun fatality and know of one other where a pellet had to be removed from the shooting victim's liver. (Ouch!

That knife-on-stick/pelletgun fellow made some pretty rash claims....

Dave3220(aka Paradox Pete)