Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by bakerjw »

Confiscation is the absolute worst case scenario which prompted my comments.

My advice... Stock up while you still can. Lowers, magazines, etc...
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by Bendersquint »

bakerjw wrote:Confiscation is the absolute worst case scenario which prompted my comments.

My advice... Stock up while you still can. Lowers, magazines, etc...
CheaperThanDirt has Pmags right now, but they are selling for almost $60!!!
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by YugoRPK »

Bendersquint wrote:
bakerjw wrote:Confiscation is the absolute worst case scenario which prompted my comments.

My advice... Stock up while you still can. Lowers, magazines, etc...
CheaperThanDirt has Pmags right now, but they are selling for almost $60!!!
Remind me never to do business with CTD again after this whole thing blows over.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by bakerjw »

Lucky for me Wideners didn't jack up any prices on mags or lowers. My wife wasn't real thrilled at today's expenditure, but as I explained. In a few months I may never be able to buy these ever again.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by stengun »

Howdy renegade,
renegade wrote:Sign away, not worth the paper it is printed on and will be ignored.

:roll: :roll:

Too funny!

Ignored by who? The FBI? DEA? DHS? BATFE?

If Obama signs an EO banning ownership of an AR-15 do you really think all the ABC agencies will ignore the ban?

Some might but on a whole they will enforce the new law. If a agency Director, that was appointed by Obama decides not to enforce Obama's ban he will be replaced with a Director that WILL enforce the ban.

Paul

P.S. Instead of an EO all Obama has to do is have the BATFE changes its gun regulations.

Remember Big George's AWB of 1989? That's what he did.

To change the regs a law would have to be passed by Congress.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by generaldisarray »

The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin, Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd..... Jules Winnfield
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by doubloon »

ranb wrote:I have been discussing this issue on another forum. It was suggested that Obama could possibly use a national security statute to write an executive order to control firearms or ban them. That is an angle I had not thought of before as I thought any EO would reference the CGA of 1968 or the NFA of 1934.. I do not think it would stand up to the Supreme court, but it is possible that Obama could prevail.

Ranb
This has been my point all along, that there might be something to leverage.

I have no doubt in my mind it would be an unconstitutional move but that is a decision for SCOTUS and guess who gets to appoint SCOTUS seats.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by L1A1Rocker »

bakerjw wrote:Lucky for me Wideners didn't jack up any prices on mags or lowers. My wife wasn't real thrilled at today's expenditure, but as I explained. In a few months I may never be able to buy these ever again.
Yeah, lucky for you. . .
Yesterday I purchased 12 AK mags from SOG at $9.95 each. They even sent me this nice email confirming my order.
Your order confirmation is below. Thank you again for your business.

Today they send me this:
Dear L1A1Rocker,
Your order # XXXXXXXXX has been
Pending.

You can check the status of your order by logging into your account.

We are unable to process your order for the AK-EGMAG30 at the price advertised at time of purchase. Unfortunately, due to turn of events all of our prices on assault type items have been increased. The current price for this item is $18.95. Please let me kow if you wish to continue with this order. Thanks, SOG, Trish

If you have any questions, please feel free to contact us at [email protected] or by phone at 1-800-944-4867.

Thank you again,
Southern Ohio Gun Distributors, Inc.
I sent this in response:
Regarding you email stating that you will not honor our contract for 12 AK-EGMAG30 magazines at the total price of $119.40.

I have an XPS file proving that you agreed to the terms as set forth in order XXXXXXX. (file attached for you information)

This document has been, and is, considered a legally binding contract. Failure on your part to honor this contract may be grounds for legal action.

Please consider this email a Formal demand to honor the contract you agreed to.

Thank you,

L1A1Rocker
I know I've got virtually no legal ground to stand on, as I have not been "harmed" from a legal standpoint. But still, I wonder how they would feel about receiving a subpena to appear in small claims court.

Does anyone know the physical address of SOG? I'll need it for a BBB complaint, or subpena.

Thanks
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by Bendersquint »

L1A1Rocker wrote:
bakerjw wrote:Lucky for me Wideners didn't jack up any prices on mags or lowers. My wife wasn't real thrilled at today's expenditure, but as I explained. In a few months I may never be able to buy these ever again.
Yeah, lucky for you. . .
Yesterday I purchased 12 AK mags from SOG at $9.95 each. They even sent me this nice email confirming my order.
Your order confirmation is below. Thank you again for your business.

Today they send me this:
Dear L1A1Rocker,
Your order # XXXXXXXXX has been
Pending.

You can check the status of your order by logging into your account.

We are unable to process your order for the AK-EGMAG30 at the price advertised at time of purchase. Unfortunately, due to turn of events all of our prices on assault type items have been increased. The current price for this item is $18.95. Please let me kow if you wish to continue with this order. Thanks, SOG, Trish

If you have any questions, please feel free to contact us at [email protected] or by phone at 1-800-944-4867.

Thank you again,
Southern Ohio Gun Distributors, Inc.
I sent this in response:
Regarding you email stating that you will not honor our contract for 12 AK-EGMAG30 magazines at the total price of $119.40.

I have an XPS file proving that you agreed to the terms as set forth in order XXXXXXX. (file attached for you information)

This document has been, and is, considered a legally binding contract. Failure on your part to honor this contract may be grounds for legal action.

Please consider this email a Formal demand to honor the contract you agreed to.

Thank you,

L1A1Rocker
I know I've got virtually no legal ground to stand on, as I have not been "harmed" from a legal standpoint. But still, I wonder how they would feel about receiving a subpena to appear in small claims court.

Does anyone know the physical address of SOG? I'll need it for a BBB complaint, or subpena.

Thanks
I will see if i still have a copy of their FFL.

It will be easier for them to just refund you the $$$ than go to court, they did sign a contract but it is only legally binding in the sense that they can't change the price if they do their refunding would negate their end of the contract.

Contract or not the seller can always back out of a deal. Messed up as it is.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by bakerjw »

I got this from Wideners today

"We want to thank you for your business. Due to high demand, we are behind in shipping. If you have ordered on line or over the phone and the items were in stock, you will get your order. Our current delay is about 15-24 days depending on the item ordered. The items are in stock and reserved for you. If you wish to cancel your order, please email your cancellation to [email protected] and your order will be cancelled and your credit card will be refunded for the entire amount. We regret the delay."

I can accept a delay. Had they raised prices on me, then I'd be up in arms. As for SOG doing that, screw them. I've bought from them before bu they've added themselves to my "do not buy from" list.


I just checked. Wideners is out of AR lowers and all 30 round mags.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by ranb »

Obama signed 23 EO’s today.
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2013/01/16/ob ... ?hpt=hp_c1
1. "Issue a presidential memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system."
2. "Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system."
3. "Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system."
4. "Direct the attorney general to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks."
5. "Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun."
6. "Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers."
7. "Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign."
8. "Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission)."
9. "Issue a presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations."
10. "Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement."
11. "Nominate an ATF director."
12. "Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations."
13. "Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime."
14. "Issue a presidential memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence."
15. "Direct the attorney general to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies."
16. "Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes."
17. "Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities."
18. "Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers."
19. "Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education."
20. "Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover."
21. "Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges."
22. "Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations."
23. "Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health."

Some of them look like window dressing. No gun bans as far as I can tell.

Ranb
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by continuity »

Meh... tempest in a teapot... at this stage anyway.
What amount of a man is composed of his own collection of experiences... and the conclusions that those experiences have allowed him to "know" for certain as "Truth"? :Ick
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by Bendersquint »

Congress is the one to worry about, Obama did what he had to push the blame to someone else so he can't be blamed for it.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by Jack_Bauer »

The Executive Orders he signed was not near as bad as I had feared. Not crazy about a full time BATFE director but they already have a rotating interim so not sure how that will play out.

I don't fear any bills will make it through Congress so a bit of relief for now.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by 700PSS »

"For now" is the key. Obama can still issue more E.O.s later, whether or not Congress acts to his pleasing. Also, whether or not the E.O.s are legal/constitutional, it could take years to work through the courts, if ever.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by stengun »

Howdy,
ranb wrote:Obama signed 23 EO’s today.
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2013/01/16/ob ... ?hpt=hp_c1
1. "Issue a presidential memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system."
2. "Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system."
3. "Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system."
4. "Direct the attorney general to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks."
5. "Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun."
6. "Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers."
7. "Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign."
8. "Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission)."
9. "Issue a presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations."
10. "Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement."
11. "Nominate an ATF director."
12. "Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations."
13. "Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime."
14. "Issue a presidential memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence."
15. "Direct the attorney general to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies."
16. "Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes."
17. "Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities."
18. "Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers."
19. "Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education."
20. "Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover."
21. "Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges."
22. "Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations."
23. "Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health."

Some of them look like window dressing. No gun bans as far as I can tell.

Ranb
Most of them are about "Nut Control" not "Gun Control". Nothing wrong with nut control. If the "nut control" worked properly the Aurora Movie shooting or the VA Tech shooting would not have happened.

Paul
"The number of people that I've killed is not important. What is important is how I get along with the ones that are still alive."

"A veteran - whether active duty, retired, national guard, or reserve - is someone who, at one point in his or her life, wrote a blank check made payable to The 'United States of America', for an amount of 'up to and including my life.'" (Author unknown)
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by Bendersquint »

stengun wrote:Howdy,
ranb wrote:Obama signed 23 EO’s today.
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2013/01/16/ob ... ?hpt=hp_c1
1. "Issue a presidential memorandum to require federal agencies to make relevant data available to the federal background check system."
2. "Address unnecessary legal barriers, particularly relating to the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act, that may prevent states from making information available to the background check system."
3. "Improve incentives for states to share information with the background check system."
4. "Direct the attorney general to review categories of individuals prohibited from having a gun to make sure dangerous people are not slipping through the cracks."
5. "Propose rulemaking to give law enforcement the ability to run a full background check on an individual before returning a seized gun."
6. "Publish a letter from ATF to federally licensed gun dealers providing guidance on how to run background checks for private sellers."
7. "Launch a national safe and responsible gun ownership campaign."
8. "Review safety standards for gun locks and gun safes (Consumer Product Safety Commission)."
9. "Issue a presidential Memorandum to require federal law enforcement to trace guns recovered in criminal investigations."
10. "Release a DOJ report analyzing information on lost and stolen guns and make it widely available to law enforcement."
11. "Nominate an ATF director."
12. "Provide law enforcement, first responders, and school officials with proper training for active shooter situations."
13. "Maximize enforcement efforts to prevent gun violence and prosecute gun crime."
14. "Issue a presidential memorandum directing the Centers for Disease Control to research the causes and prevention of gun violence."
15. "Direct the attorney general to issue a report on the availability and most effective use of new gun safety technologies and challenge the private sector to develop innovative technologies."
16. "Clarify that the Affordable Care Act does not prohibit doctors asking their patients about guns in their homes."
17. "Release a letter to health care providers clarifying that no federal law prohibits them from reporting threats of violence to law enforcement authorities."
18. "Provide incentives for schools to hire school resource officers."
19. "Develop model emergency response plans for schools, houses of worship and institutions of higher education."
20. "Release a letter to state health officials clarifying the scope of mental health services that Medicaid plans must cover."
21. "Finalize regulations clarifying essential health benefits and parity requirements within ACA exchanges."
22. "Commit to finalizing mental health parity regulations."
23. "Launch a national dialogue led by Secretaries Sebelius and Duncan on mental health."

Some of them look like window dressing. No gun bans as far as I can tell.

Ranb
Most of them are about "Nut Control" not "Gun Control". Nothing wrong with nut control. If the "nut control" worked properly the Aurora Movie shooting or the VA Tech shooting would not have happened.

Paul
MAY not have happened. Criminals still get guns even if barred from purchasing legally. Everyone but Dems know this.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by stengun »

Bendersquint wrote:
MAY not have happened. Criminals still get guns even if barred from purchasing legally. Everyone but Dems know this.
The Aurora and VA Tech shooters were not "criminals" they were nuts. Neither had broken the law before the "shooting spree" and both had "legally" bought their firearms.

With the proper "Nut Control" system in place both shooting sprees "should" have been prevented.

I'm not a fan of any type of gun control but we do need nut control.

Paul
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by SRM »

seems the only problem is that everyone has a different definition of a nut.

I do agree though.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by doubloon »

Bendersquint wrote:
stengun wrote:Howdy,
ranb wrote:Obama signed 23 EO’s today.
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2013/01/16/ob ... ?hpt=hp_c1
...
Ranb
Most of them are about "Nut Control" not "Gun Control". Nothing wrong with nut control. If the "nut control" worked properly the Aurora Movie shooting or the VA Tech shooting would not have happened.

Paul
MAY not have happened. Criminals still get guns even if barred from purchasing legally. Everyone but Dems know this.
Precisely, nothing to do with nut control or gun control it's all about civilian disarmament.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by CaribouLou45 »

We didn't lose, but we didn't win either (well maybe if you are in NY you lost, but you will win in more ways than one if you move). Stay vigilant
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by Bendersquint »

CaribouLou45 wrote:We didn't lose, but we didn't win either (well maybe if you are in NY you lost, but you will win in more ways than one if you move). Stay vigilant
Its not even half time, don't declare a victory or lose yet, the battle hasn't even begun. We still have to deal with Congress.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by MV10 »

SRM wrote:seems the only problem is that everyone has a different definition of a nut.

I do agree though.
I'll truck out this real-life personal example again.

For most of my mother's early life she had some "stability" issues. They seemed to start going away around 45 or so, and these days she's as normal as anyone. But in her 20s and 30s she ranged from normal to batshit crazy. I would assume that under any sort of "nut control" legislation, she wouldn't be allowed anywhere near a firearm, yet we literally grew up with firearms.

When she was just 24, I was five and my brother was three. My dad was on deployment on the Ike. Our glue-huffing dirtbag neighbor's son poisoned our dog and broke into her bedroom one night. He was carrying a butcher knife and threatening to rape her and kill us. The situation was quickly and permanently resolved through the application of a .357 Magnum.

Of course, had "nut control" been in place, there would be nobody to tell this story from my point of view. It would have been just another nut that somehow slipped through the system. Maybe old dead Charlie the glue-huffer would have been the new poster child for "large knife control" advocates, who knows?

Be careful what you wish for, and the power you entrust to those who crave power over you, folks.
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by ranb »

I haven’t been able to find the EO’s signed by the president last week.
http://www.archives.gov/federal-registe ... ition.html
There is nothing new on the website that lists EO’s.
http://www.archives.gov/federal-registe ... obama.html

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2013/01/1 ... -violence/
The Journal lists these as executive actions.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... ntrol.html
This rag calls them executive actions also.

So were 23 executive orders signed or not? If there were, how long does it take to publish them on the WSJ website?

Ranb
SilencerTalk was a place I could disccuss making registered silencers without being told I was a criminal. That is no longer true. http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=132&t=99273
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Re: Executive Order, Worst Case Senario

Post by ranb »

I haven’t been able to find the EO’s signed by the president last week.
http://www.archives.gov/federal-registe ... ition.html
There is nothing new on the website that lists EO’s.
http://www.archives.gov/federal-registe ... obama.html

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2013/01/1 ... -violence/
The Journal lists these as executive actions.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... ntrol.html
This rag calls them executive actions also.

So were 23 executive orders signed or not? If there were, how long does it take to publish them on the WSJ website?

Ranb
SilencerTalk was a place I could disccuss making registered silencers without being told I was a criminal. That is no longer true. http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=132&t=99273
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