Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

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paper9
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Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by paper9 » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:32 pm

Hello, I have NFA stuff as an individual.
I have gotten a trust completed and would like to transfer
the existing NFA stuff into the trust, I know it is another $200.00 per item
and that is about all I know.

What goes in the various Form 4 or Form 1 boxes?
Thanks!!!

SRM
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by SRM » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:41 pm

It will be a f4 and the trust info in all the boxes.

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bkoski
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by bkoski » Sun Feb 24, 2013 10:01 am

These will all be a Form 4 transfer.

You are basically filling the Form 4 out as if you are the dealer/owner and the trust is the buyer, since you already own the item, and are transferring it into your new trust. The process would be the same if you were selling your item(s) to an in-state buyer. Your personal (seller) information goes in the Transferor boxes, and the trust (buyer) information goes in the Transferee boxes.

Here's how I filled out my Form 4 to move an old silencer into my trust:

1. Check box for [$200]

2a. Name and address on your trust (If no address in the trust use the address where items are primarily stored)
2b. County from address in 2a

3a. Name of the individual on the current Form 1 or Form 4 (this is you)
3b. Telephone number of the individual on the current Form 1 or Form 4 (your phone number)
3d & 3c did not apply to my transfer, I left them blank

4. This should match the information on your current Form 1 or Form 4

5-8. Blank since you aren't using a dealer

9. I always circle "I DO"

10. Signature of individual on current Form 1 or Form 4 (your signature, since you are the original owner, now signing your property away to the trust)

11. Printed name of individual in block 10. (your printed name)

12. Date

13 & 14. Some people leave these blank. I check "NO" on all of them.

15. Name of Trust goes in first blank. "ANY LAWFUL PURPOSE" (or whatever your excuse is) goes in second blank. Your signature goes in third blank, since you are (I'm assuming) listed in the trust as a Trustee. Date in fourth blank.

16. Do not submit a photo. (Do not submit fingerprints either)

17. I mark every open blank as "N/A". Some people leave it all blank. (you do not need a local LE sign-off either, just send your forms to the address at the top of the Form 4)

I hope that helps. It can be somewhat confusing as to what you need to put where, since you are transferring it to "yourself" in a way. I just think of it as I'm selling my property to my trust, and it just so happens that this new owner (trust) lives at my address, and I am legally responsible, hence why you put your signature in the areas where it asks for the signature of the new owner.

-BK

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by dtom29 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 11:52 am

I'm curious as to why you are going to spend the money to put what you already own into the trust? I could see putting any future items in the trust, but why the current ones? This isn't any type of criticism, just a question.

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Bendersquint
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Bendersquint » Sun Feb 24, 2013 1:12 pm

dtom29 wrote:I'm curious as to why you are going to spend the money to put what you already own into the trust? I could see putting any future items in the trust, but why the current ones? This isn't any type of criticism, just a question.
One of 2 things........... A NFA trust lawyer got to him and fed him a line of paranoia or he wants to be able to have other people to have access to his toys.

The latter reason would be why i would transfer all my individual items into a trust.

No2sc2
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by No2sc2 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 4:57 pm

Maybe he wants the ability to leave his items with someone trusted. Thats why I started a Trust. I love it but if the new stupid ruling where photos and finger prints required, I will switch to individual. No time to get prints and photos from every responsible listed in the trust each time.

paper9
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by paper9 » Sun Feb 24, 2013 11:56 pm

Bkoski, thanks, very helpful....

Slaine777
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Slaine777 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 12:53 pm

I am also thinking about transferring items held as an individual to a trust to allow family members access without my presence. I've heard horror stories of the ATF invalidating trusts. What happens when a trust is invalidated? With a normal trust the ownership reverts back to the previous owner. Is that the case with NFA items?

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Bendersquint
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Bendersquint » Mon Feb 25, 2013 1:29 pm

Slaine777 wrote:I am also thinking about transferring items held as an individual to a trust to allow family members access without my presence. I've heard horror stories of the ATF invalidating trusts. What happens when a trust is invalidated? With a normal trust the ownership reverts back to the previous owner. Is that the case with NFA items?
I have yet to see an invalidated trust once approved.

If it were ever invalidated it would require a transfer out of it requiring another transfer stamp.

Again I have yet to see an invalidated trust, regardless it be a Quicken or an expensive Gun Trust Lawyer trust.

It is internet rumor.

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by rimshaker » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:29 pm

Bendersquint wrote:
Slaine777 wrote:I am also thinking about transferring items held as an individual to a trust to allow family members access without my presence. I've heard horror stories of the ATF invalidating trusts. What happens when a trust is invalidated? With a normal trust the ownership reverts back to the previous owner. Is that the case with NFA items?
I have yet to see an invalidated trust once approved.

If it were ever invalidated it would require a transfer out of it requiring another transfer stamp.

Again I have yet to see an invalidated trust, regardless it be a Quicken or an expensive Gun Trust Lawyer trust.

It is internet rumor.
Hypothetically though, if some kind of passed legislation were to eliminate/weaken the Trust route, wouldn't a generic Quicken template have more potential legal holes in it to render it invalid?

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Bendersquint
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Bendersquint » Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:53 pm

rimshaker wrote:
Bendersquint wrote:
Slaine777 wrote:I am also thinking about transferring items held as an individual to a trust to allow family members access without my presence. I've heard horror stories of the ATF invalidating trusts. What happens when a trust is invalidated? With a normal trust the ownership reverts back to the previous owner. Is that the case with NFA items?
I have yet to see an invalidated trust once approved.

If it were ever invalidated it would require a transfer out of it requiring another transfer stamp.

Again I have yet to see an invalidated trust, regardless it be a Quicken or an expensive Gun Trust Lawyer trust.

It is internet rumor.
Hypothetically though, if some kind of passed legislation were to eliminate/weaken the Trust route, wouldn't a generic Quicken template have more potential legal holes in it to render it invalid?
Without knowing the text of the hypothetical legislation that question can not be answered.

The Trust route will not be eliminated, I know that for sure.

paper9
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by paper9 » Sat Dec 28, 2013 2:15 pm

Stamp for trust item completed, 300 days in total.

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eric10mm
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by eric10mm » Sat Dec 28, 2013 3:10 pm

Slaine777 wrote:I am also thinking about transferring items held as an individual to a trust to allow family members access without my presence. I've heard horror stories of the ATF invalidating trusts. What happens when a trust is invalidated? With a normal trust the ownership reverts back to the previous owner. Is that the case with NFA items?
Nope. Gubmint comes and crushes the cans. Sorry.

:wink:

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m1garand30064
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by m1garand30064 » Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:12 pm

rimshaker wrote:
Bendersquint wrote:
Slaine777 wrote:I am also thinking about transferring items held as an individual to a trust to allow family members access without my presence. I've heard horror stories of the ATF invalidating trusts. What happens when a trust is invalidated? With a normal trust the ownership reverts back to the previous owner. Is that the case with NFA items?
I have yet to see an invalidated trust once approved.

If it were ever invalidated it would require a transfer out of it requiring another transfer stamp.

Again I have yet to see an invalidated trust, regardless it be a Quicken or an expensive Gun Trust Lawyer trust.

It is internet rumor.
Hypothetically though, if some kind of passed legislation were to eliminate/weaken the Trust route, wouldn't a generic Quicken template have more potential legal holes in it to render it invalid?
Not necessarily.
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by aggiez28 » Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:30 am

paper9 wrote:Stamp for trust item completed, 300 days in total.
so why did you do it?

paper9
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by paper9 » Mon Dec 30, 2013 10:37 am

Did not fully understand the Form 5. However, one item is now stamped twice.

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strom19
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by strom19 » Wed Jan 01, 2014 3:37 pm

I did this same transfer awhile ago with a suppressed pistol. In the event of my demise, my wife would be in legal possession and wouldn't be troubled with any illegal penalty's..

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Bendersquint » Wed Jan 01, 2014 4:58 pm

strom19 wrote:I did this same transfer awhile ago with a suppressed pistol. In the event of my demise, my wife would be in legal possession and wouldn't be troubled with any illegal penalty's..
She wouldnt have been troubled with an illegal activities anyways. It happens ALL the time and wifes and husbands arent arrested because of the owners death.

File the Form5 and you are fine.

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strom19
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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by strom19 » Wed Jan 01, 2014 5:56 pm

I figured another 200.00 would be worth it in order to alleviate the trouble of her having her fill out the 5 form plus fingerprints and photo's. Since my having a trust I also purchased other items and entered them into it.

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by danb35 » Thu Jan 02, 2014 12:05 am

When the trust distributes NFA items to a beneficiary, that's still a transfer, and NFA paperwork will still have to be done.

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Bendersquint » Thu Jan 02, 2014 1:56 am

danb35 wrote:When the trust distributes NFA items to a beneficiary, that's still a transfer, and NFA paperwork will still have to be done.
Yup but would be done via Form5 so its faster than a Form4 and FREE!

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by dtom29 » Sat Jan 11, 2014 5:52 am

danb35 wrote:When the trust distributes NFA items to a beneficiary, that's still a transfer, and NFA paperwork will still have to be done.
Unless she's a co-trustee then nothing needs to be done.

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Jjsmg » Fri Apr 01, 2016 9:37 am

Hey guys, bumping an old thread.. I stamped an item as an individual on a Form 1 (SBR) and want to transfer it to my trust. When it comes to transferring the Form 1 to the Form 4 who do I put in as the manufacturer in 4a on the Form 4? Will it be the original manufacturer (Doublestar Corp.) or will I put the information from the first block on my Form 1 (My name and address)?

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Bendersquint » Tue Apr 05, 2016 4:08 pm

Jjsmg wrote:Hey guys, bumping an old thread.. I stamped an item as an individual on a Form 1 (SBR) and want to transfer it to my trust. When it comes to transferring the Form 1 to the Form 4 who do I put in as the manufacturer in 4a on the Form 4? Will it be the original manufacturer (Doublestar Corp.) or will I put the information from the first block on my Form 1 (My name and address)?
You would put your information in there as you made it into the SBR.

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Re: Transfer from individual stamp to a Trust

Post by Jjsmg » Wed Apr 13, 2016 9:27 am

Thanks bud, that's what I was thinking too

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