look at how illegal this for sale ad is

[carry-a-big-stick]

Check this out
http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=73834057
I can't belive this ad hasn't been pulled off gunbroker yet.

[chevrofreak]

I don't see anything illegal. The receiver is the gun, and since the receiver isn't a receiver anymore it is useless. To use those parts to make a full-auto gun one would need a receiver that has extra pin holes for the parts which would be externally obvious just by looking at it.

All of those parts except the buttstock and auto sear could be used to legally construct a semi-auto pistol. Many of them could be used to make a legal semi-auto rifle, as long as you did not use more than 10 total imported parts.

[carry-a-big-stick]

You can't just buy full auto parts kits for an M16. Unless you already have a registered M16. This guy says nothing about needing proof that you have a registered full auto AK reciver. If you have that kit and a reciver isn't that intent to construct?

[will36]

Thats just a kit gun. 1000's have been sold. Thats a romanian kit a good kit to build from. I built this gun from the very same kit. You just have to watch your US parts count.

[will36]

You can't just buy full auto parts kits for an M16. Unless you already have a registered M16. This guy says nothing about needing proof that you have a registered full auto AK reciver. If you have that kit and a reciver isn't that intent to construct?

Nope , but its a VERY good Idea to toss that sear in the trash.

[renegade]

You can't just buy full auto parts kits for an M16. Unless you already have a registered M16. This guy says nothing about needing proof that you have a registered full auto AK reciver. If you have that kit and a reciver isn't that intent to construct?

Yes, you can.

Those ROMAK kits are common and are available everywhere. Usually the price is closer to $125 or so.

There is nothing illegal going on there.

[silencertalk]

You can't just buy full auto parts kits for an M16. Unless you already have a registered M16.

False. You certainly can buy them legally.

[mpallett]

You can't just buy full auto parts kits for an M16. Unless you already have a registered M16.

100% not correct.

I think that your are trying to say that "Some people won't sell you full auto parts unless you prove you own the gun" (Like bushmaster, Model 1 Sales).

[tikkafan]

The ATF can make up s--t about constructive possession. But owning the parts isn't illegal.

BCM sells DPMS auto lpks http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/M16-Lowe ... 20auto.htm

[carry-a-big-stick]

Wow I feel like a dumb ass. I guess you learn somthing new every day.

as GI Joe said "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle"

[cyclone72]

Wow I feel like a dumb ass. I guess you learn somthing new every day.

as GI Joe said "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle"

you learn something new all the time,dont fell like a dumbass for this,feel like a dumbass for actually quoting G.I. Joe.

[Vid]

Wow I feel like a dumb ass. I guess you learn somthing new every day.

as GI Joe said "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle"

I would make sure that if you choose to buy full-auto conversion parts namely the "DIAS" based on the information supplied here that you ask the advisors to pay your legal fees when they toss your ass in jail.

It is illegal to have if you do not have a registered MG. And several guys just got nailed from an ad out of the shotgun news purchasing said part.

Constructive intent is not hard to prove when there is no other reason to have the parts, as what else are you going to do with them?.

[Mtdew]

Wow I feel like a dumb ass. I guess you learn somthing new every day.

as GI Joe said "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle"

I would make sure that if you choose to buy full-auto conversion parts namely the "DIAS" based on the information supplied here that you ask the advisors to pay your legal fees when they toss your ass in jail.

It is illegal to have if you do not have a registered MG. And several guys just got nailed from an ad out of the shotgun news purchasing said part.

Constructive intent is not hard to prove when there is no other reason to have the parts, as what else are you going to do with them?.

The DIAS is "the" MG, Just like a RR. No difference

The FCG is not the MG

[Vid]

Wow I feel like a dumb ass. I guess you learn somthing new every day.

as GI Joe said "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle"

I would make sure that if you choose to buy full-auto conversion parts namely the "DIAS" based on the information supplied here that you ask the advisors to pay your legal fees when they toss your ass in jail.

It is illegal to have if you do not have a registered MG. And several guys just got nailed from an ad out of the shotgun news purchasing said part.

Constructive intent is not hard to prove when there is no other reason to have the parts, as what else are you going to do with them?.

The DIAS is "the" MG, Just like a RR. No difference

The FCG is not the MG

This is not specified in the post, Is there anyone who is going to guarantee that ordering a conversion kit such as the link offers will not be delivered by or closely followed by ATF with a warrant for arrest?. The M-16 kit has the auto sear,sear pin, selector,disconnect, hammer, trigger and selector switch. What exactly is legal about that if you have to explain it to an ATF agent?.

You can buy an HK trigger pack for 500.00 at a show if you claim to have a form 4, what if you dont?.

I think it is reckless to state that it just fine and dandy to order these parts through the mail without clear guidelines, this is how people get bent over and farked.

[chevrofreak]

I would make sure that if you choose to buy full-auto conversion parts namely the "DIAS" based on the information supplied here that you ask the advisors to pay your legal fees when they toss your ass in jail.

It is illegal to have if you do not have a registered MG. And several guys just got nailed from an ad out of the shotgun news purchasing said part.

Constructive intent is not hard to prove when there is no other reason to have the parts, as what else are you going to do with them?.

The DIAS is "the" MG, Just like a RR. No difference

The FCG is not the MG

This is not specified in the post, Is there anyone who is going to guarantee that ordering a conversion kit such as the link offers will not be delivered by or closely followed by ATF with a warrant for arrest?. The M-16 kit has the auto sear,sear pin, selector,disconnect, hammer, trigger and selector switch. What exactly is legal about that if you have to explain it to an ATF agent?.

You can buy an HK trigger pack for 500.00 at a show if you claim to have a form 4, what if you dont?.

I think it is reckless to state that it just fine and dandy to order these parts through the mail without clear guidelines, this is how people get bent over and farked.

A DIAS doesn't require modification to the receiver of the firearm to work, that is why it by itelf is considered an MG. The receiver of both an AR or AK would need to have a hole drilled in it to install the M16 or full-auto AK sear kit. That's where the difference lies. That drilled hole alone, even without an installed auto-sear is considered turning the gun into an illegal MG.

[renegade]

Wow I feel like a dumb ass. I guess you learn somthing new every day.

as GI Joe said "Now you know, and knowing is half the battle"

I would make sure that if you choose to buy full-auto conversion parts namely the "DIAS" based on the information supplied here that you ask the advisors to pay your legal fees when they toss your ass in jail.

He is not talking about buying a DIAS, he is talking about a ROMAK parts kit.

It is illegal to have if you do not have a registered MG. And several guys just got nailed from an ad out of the shotgun news purchasing said part.

Constructive intent is not hard to prove when there is no other reason to have the parts, as what else are you going to do with them?.

This is not specified in the post, Is there anyone who is going to guarantee that ordering a conversion kit such as the link offers will not be delivered by or closely followed by ATF with a warrant for arrest?. The M-16 kit has the auto sear,sear pin, selector,disconnect, hammer, trigger and selector switch. What exactly is legal about that if you have to explain it to an ATF agent?.

Since the kit does not come with a functioning receiver, it will be pretty hard to get it to even fire single shot. Same with a "M16 parts kit".


You can buy an HK trigger pack for 500.00 at a show if you claim to have a form 4, what if you dont?.

You wasted $500 then, as the HK trigger pack will not fit anything but a RR.

I think it is reckless to state that it just fine and dandy to order these parts through the mail without clear guidelines, this is how people get bent over and farked.

You are confusing the issue by discussing the M16 parts kit, as it is regulated slightly differently based upon circumstances.

[Mtdew]

You can buy an HK trigger pack for 500.00 at a show if you claim to have a form 4, what if you dont?.

You dont need to claim you have a form 4.... you don't need one.

and you can get a HK pack for $80

If you buy a G3 kit.. it comes w/ a FA pack & carrier

If you fuy a FAL kit.. it comes w/ a FA FCG & bolt

If you buy a Suomi kit it comes w/ a Fixed firing pin bolt

If you buy one of the old USAF M16 kits that a bunch of vendors were selling you get a FA kit (M16 hammer, trigger, sear & carrier)

[will36]

A DIAS doesn't require modification to the receiver of the firearm to work, that is why it by itelf is considered an MG. The receiver of both an AR or AK would need to have a hole drilled in it to install the M16 or full-auto AK sear kit. That's where the difference lies. That drilled hole alone, even without an installed auto-sear is considered turning the gun into an illegal MG.[/quote]

You are correct the ATF are still looking for Maddi and Chinese Aks that slipped into the U.S. with a crushed rivet in the "3rd hole" . They find you with one it now belongs to them! I know a dealer that had to cut 3 of these up and give up the center section of the reciever to the ATF.

[JohnnyC]

A DIAS doesn't require modification to the receiver of the firearm to work, that is why it by itelf is considered an MG. The receiver of both an AR or AK would need to have a hole drilled in it to install the M16 or full-auto AK sear kit. That's where the difference lies. That drilled hole alone, even without an installed auto-sear is considered turning the gun into an illegal MG.

You are correct the ATF are still looking for Maddi and Chinese Aks that slipped into the U.S. with a crushed rivet in the "3rd hole" . They find you with one it now belongs to them! I know a dealer that had to cut 3 of these up and give up the center section of the reciever to the ATF.

Can't you just plug weld the hole instead of a rivet and make it legal?

[chevrofreak]

A DIAS doesn't require modification to the receiver of the firearm to work, that is why it by itelf is considered an MG. The receiver of both an AR or AK would need to have a hole drilled in it to install the M16 or full-auto AK sear kit. That's where the difference lies. That drilled hole alone, even without an installed auto-sear is considered turning the gun into an illegal MG.

You are correct the ATF are still looking for Maddi and Chinese Aks that slipped into the U.S. with a crushed rivet in the "3rd hole" . They find you with one it now belongs to them! I know a dealer that had to cut 3 of these up and give up the center section of the reciever to the ATF.

Can't you just plug weld the hole instead of a rivet and make it legal?

Since the hole alone makes it an illegal MG, and since the ATF says that once a receiver is an MG it is always an MG, no.

[Vid]

You can buy an HK trigger pack for 500.00 at a show if you claim to have a form 4, what if you dont?.

You dont need to claim you have a form 4.... you don't need one.

and you can get a HK pack for $80

If you buy a G3 kit.. it comes w/ a FA pack & carrier

If you fuy a FAL kit.. it comes w/ a FA FCG & bolt

If you buy a Suomi kit it comes w/ a Fixed firing pin bolt

If you buy one of the old USAF M16 kits that a bunch of vendors were selling you get a FA kit (M16 hammer, trigger, sear & carrier)

Im referring to a trigger pack, which contains a full auto sear and can be mounted in any # of calibers of HK weapons, this along with the carrier gives you full auto. They run 500.00 and I dont think we are talking about the same thing.

But now im confused

[tikkafan]

Im referring to a trigger pack, which contains a full auto sear and can be mounted in any # of calibers of HK weapons, this along with the carrier gives you full auto. They run 500.00 and I dont think we are talking about the same thing.

But now im confused

Are you asking if it is illegal to own FA parts? It isn't at all, just putting them together in a unregistered weapon is.

Though the ATF can try to claim constructive possession i.e. all the parts needed to make a unregistered MG with intent to build.

Though according to the ATF having a shoelace could be considered constructive possession. And if they ever make a ruling on bump firing, fingers may also be added.

[renegade]

Im referring to a trigger pack, which contains a full auto sear and can be mounted in any # of calibers of HK weapons, this along with the carrier gives you full auto. They run 500.00 and I dont think we are talking about the same thing.

But now im confused

Yes, and those DO NOT FIT a semi-auto host weapon. In order to make them fit, you need to modify them. Thus you do not have anything illegal until you perform the modification on the trigger group. Also, you can modify the plastic trigger housing to fit the semi-auto guns, and this is legal.

[Mtdew]

Im referring to a trigger pack, which contains a full auto sear and can be mounted in any # of calibers of HK weapons, this along with the carrier gives you full auto. They run 500.00 and I dont think we are talking about the same thing.

But now im confused

we are talking about the same thing... if you paid $500 you better have a burst pack.

They are included in the complete $300 (used to be $180) G3 kits. The complete F/A packs w/ grip frame are around 80-100

as Renegade said unless you modify the pack & frame it cant fit on a (S/A) receiver

[Vid]

Im referring to a trigger pack, which contains a full auto sear and can be mounted in any # of calibers of HK weapons, this along with the carrier gives you full auto. They run 500.00 and I dont think we are talking about the same thing.

But now im confused

Are you asking if it is illegal to own FA parts? It isn't at all, just putting them together in a unregistered weapon is.

Though the ATF can try to claim constructive possession i.e. all the parts needed to make a unregistered MG with intent to build.

Though according to the ATF having a shoelace could be considered constructive possession. And if they ever make a ruling on bump firing, fingers may also be added.

Well,

What I see is you guys are selecting what is legal and not legal based not so much on intent as on degree of difficulty.

I realize the AK parts kit was not an issue and that did not really bother me so much, but the M-16 can run people into problems. If some one were to come upon this site and see its legal to purchase conversion kits and not read the issue's. Then some poor guy can go to the Shotgun News ATF setup ad, or may get approached at a show and grab a drop in sear and he is royally screwed. And it happens.

As far as those trigger packs go, I am going to have to inquire as many semi-auto host weapons have the polymer trigger packs added. So when they sell them they are supposed to ask if you have a registered MP5 or whatever. I dont know what modifications are needed but it cant be too hard. I certainly would not want to have one with ownership of a semi-auto HK.

Thankfor the clarifications

K