is it possible to get a home based 07/02? if so do you have to pay ITAR even if you dont ever manufacture anything?

[python76]

does anyone have experience with either of those topics? ive heard that it may be possible to get an 07/02 from home and then you can buy a post sample full-auto without a LE demo letter. its just ITAR is the main issue and if one can get an 07/02 from home.

[doubloon]

Sounds almost too good to be true doesn't it?

[jlwilliams]

How is one a "manufacturer" if one doesn't manufacture anything?

As I understand it, you can't get a FFL solely to enhance your collection. You can buy all the personal guns you want, but it's a license to engage in business, so if no business is done they will eventually void the license. I don't have an FFL, but that is how it's been explained to me.

If you have enough cash to dump into it I suppose you could get the license, make enough SBRs to fill a gun show table and engage in just enough businesses to keep the license and feed the machine gun but that's silly. Put that much resource and effort into whatever you already do and buy your toys from real income.

I do know FFLs who are retired from other jobs who appear to be in the gun business because they like all the guns. If you are retired and have some income, I suppose you could do it. If you are young enough to be working and thinking of getting a license to get a "cheap" machine gun you are barking up the wrong tree.

[doubloon]

How is one a "manufacturer" if one doesn't manufacture anything?
...

I believe someone with the appropriate licenses can engage in R&D design type work without ever actually manufacturing anything to sell.

But python is just looking for a way to evade taxes on cool toys.

[python76]

Sounds almost too good to be true doesn't it?

it does but ive seen people say that one can get a 07/02 from home and the somewhat recent ITAR exemptions letter says if you dont manufacture or work on guns you dont have to pay. i personally think domestic gun companies paying ITAR if they never export makes no sense because ITAR is about international exports. so in that sense im sure anyone would want to not pay ITAR. the other person mentioned selling enough guns to keep the license valid. ofc i would try to do that and from what ive read you dont even have to profit. i think you could lose money on every gun and keep the license valid but obviously id try to make profit selling guns. i dont think because you have an 07/02 means that you must manufacture. i could be wrong though.
ideally im looking for a response from someone that has an 07/02 and that has dealt with ITAR.

[TomServo]

One way to look at it is this: If this scenario weren't too good to be true, do you think you would have been the only person to think of it? No person in their right mind would do anything but this if the Government sanctioned it. As we aren't all 07/02's, nor are all of your neighbors, I think occam's razor applies.

As for opinions, ultimately none matter but the ATF's. If you write them asking if you can get licensed just to expand your collection cheaply, without doing business, they will be able to provide the official answer.

[jreinke]

One of the requirements of getting a FFL is that you comply with all zoning requirements. That means your property will have to be rezoned for multiple use as opposed to residential. Depending on you jurisdiction, this my impose an increase in property taxes. Just something to think about.

[python76]

One way to look at it is this: If this scenario weren't too good to be true, do you think you would have been the only person to think of it? No person in their right mind would do anything but this if the Government sanctioned it. As we aren't all 07/02's, nor are all of your neighbors, I think occam's razor applies.

As for opinions, ultimately none matter but the ATF's. If you write them asking if you can get licensed just to expand your collection cheaply, without doing business, they will be able to provide the official answer.

ofc you wouldnt tell the ATF "im wanting to do this to own MG's for cheap as a loophole around Hughes." you would ofc have to actually have a business plan and sell guns. as for everyone doing it if it is possible that just doesnt happen because its a complicated process and probably many average gun owners have no clue what 07/02 even means.

im just asking "is it possible" not "is it possible and easy"

[doubloon]

...
ofc you wouldnt tell the ATF "im wanting to do this to own MG's for cheap as a loophole around Hughes." you would ofc have to actually have a business plan and sell guns. as for everyone doing it if it is possible that just doesnt happen because its a complicated process and probably many average gun owners have no clue what 07/02 even means.

im just asking "is it possible to lie to the ATF either directly or by omission and collect machine guns for personal use" not "is it possible and easy"

FIFY

Yes, it's possible.

Want to or not ATF members are rumored to read this site so maybe you already told them.

[python76]

...
ofc you wouldnt tell the ATF "im wanting to do this to own MG's for cheap as a loophole around Hughes." you would ofc have to actually have a business plan and sell guns. as for everyone doing it if it is possible that just doesnt happen because its a complicated process and probably many average gun owners have no clue what 07/02 even means.

im just asking "is it possible to lie to the ATF either directly or by omission and collect machine guns for personal use" not "is it possible and easy"

FIFY

Yes, it's possible.

Want to or not ATF members are rumored to read this site so maybe you already told them.

i wouldnt be lying to anyone. i would want to get an FFL and sell normal guns and machine guns to only SOT's. there is nothing illegal about that. even if the ATF does read this and think that oh well.