Shipping an approved can to a non-FFL/SOT?

crotalus01 · Post by **crotalus01** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:51 am

I have an approved YHM Mite with my in-state dealer. He is right outside Nashville, I am in Memphis. Due to my work schedule, I am not in a position to drive up there to pick it up for a long time (months most likely). My local C3 has said it is legal for him to ship it to me even though I am not an FFL/SOT. Is this true?

MrPhotoGuyInc · Post by **MrPhotoGuyInc** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:33 am

I'm no dealer but, If he is you need to pick it up in person from him. You still need to do a .4473 at his place of business. Now if he was a NON-S.O.T in your State after he got the approved form 4 back then he could just drop it in mail to you.

aquajon · Post by **aquajon** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:10 pm

I'm not expert but the transfer of the suppressor to you would still need the 4473 as mentioned earlier and has to be done in person. This would be like him selling you a pistol and just dropping it in the mail to you. GCA restricts this, but again I'm no SOT, so I don't really know for sure. Could always ask BATF.

crotalus01 · Post by **crotalus01** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:15 pm

What exactly is a form 4473?

Conqueror · Post by **Conqueror** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 9:47 pm

The form you fill out when you buy ANY firearm from an FFL. Silencers are considered firearms, so you have to fill the 4473 when you pick it up from the dealer. That has to be done in person, to my knowledge.

MrPhotoGuyInc · Post by **MrPhotoGuyInc** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:12 pm

crotalus01 wrote:What exactly is a form 4473?

.4473 AKA Dealer Record of Sale.

Diomed · Post by **Diomed** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 11:53 pm

See if your dealer will send you a "F 4473 PT. II (5300.9) - Firearms Transaction Record Non-Over-The-Counter", sometimes called the Green Form. You'll have to visit your CLEO if he does.

(And if your dealer does send you a copy, could you send me one? A photocopy is fine. I've been trying to get my hands on one for a year now, and ATF won't send it to me.)

crotalus01 · Post by **crotalus01** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:18 pm

Diomed, how does the green form work, and why do I need to see my CLEO?
Never hurts to ask, worst he can say is no...and if he agrees you will get a copy.

MrPhotoGuyInc · Post by **MrPhotoGuyInc** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:29 pm

crotalus01 wrote:Diomed, how does the green form work, and why do I need to see my CLEO?
Never hurts to ask, worst he can say is no...and if he agrees you will get a copy.

I'm going to take a wild guess here, Since it's a non face to face CLEO is signing off on that form confirming you are who you say you are. Same thing as getting a N.F.A sign off from the CLEO. CLEO is notary with a badge and gun.

Did i guess right Diomed

3101 · Post by **3101** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:37 pm

Give Rico a cookie, he got it right!!

paco ramirez · Post by **paco ramirez** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 8:21 pm

3101 wrote:Give Rico a cookie, he got it right!!

I just ate all the chocolate chip cookies....

crotalus01 · Post by **crotalus01** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 9:13 pm

Well then he can have an Oatmeal cookie.
Okay 3101 can you explain the procedure for the green form? Do I have to submit the form before the can is shipped to me or after I receive it (assuming before)?
Thanks,
Dan

Diomed · Post by **Diomed** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:25 am

crotalus01 wrote:Well then he can have an Oatmeal cookie.
Okay 3101 can you explain the procedure for the green form? Do I have to submit the form before the can is shipped to me or after I receive it (assuming before)?
Thanks,
Dan

I'm not sure - I've been trying to get my hands on one of the forms for a year so I can see how they work. What I've heard, and this could be wrong, is that the dealer sends you the form, you get the CLEO to sign off, then you send it back to the dealer and the dealer mails you your gun.

It may also bypass the Brady check (like NFA does on regular 4473s), since the CLEO is certifying that you're not a prohibited person. At least I'm assuming it's an actual certification of your fitness, unlike NFA where it's just them attesting that there aren't any contrary laws.

Hey GaLEO, have you ever done a green form?

3101 · Post by **3101** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:29 am

I did one, and it was a pretty long time ago........
I haven't done one since the Brady stuff came along, which may be why no one can get their hands on one......
I think (this is what I remember) it was like a form 4, I signed off on it, the person sent it to the dealer and I suspect the firearms was delivered somehow, I never found out how it turned out........at least I don't remember if I did....

3101 · Post by **3101** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 2:36 am

crotalus01 wrote:I have an approved YHM Mite with my in-state dealer. He is right outside Nashville, I am in Memphis. Due to my work schedule, I am not in a position to drive up there to pick it up for a long time (months most likely). My local C3 has said it is legal for him to ship it to me even though I am not an FFL/SOT. Is this true?

of course, it begs the question....why didn't you get the can from your local dealer????

crotalus01 · Post by **crotalus01** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:02 pm

Because at the time I bought it from the guy at the gunshow I didn't know of any local C3 dealers...I have since found two.

Diomed · Post by **Diomed** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 1:48 am

I followed up on the green forms. Ordered it online again, and once again I got the regular 4473. So I called the distribution center, and the woman who answered said they hadn't stocked them in (and I quote) "eons". She directed me to call Washington, and so I did; the guy there made some calls and couldn't get ahold of anyone (Friday afternoon), and gave me the number for the local field office Industry Operations section. The fellow I talked to had never heard of the form but asked the older folks there about it, and they remembered it but hadn't seen any in years.

Anyway, the upshot is, he's supposed to look around some more next week and see if he can dig some up. We'll see how it goes.

MrPhotoGuyInc · Post by **MrPhotoGuyInc** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 7:20 am

Diomed wrote:I followed up on the green forms. Ordered it online again, and once again I got the regular 4473. So I called the distribution center, and the woman who answered said they hadn't stocked them in (and I quote) "eons". She directed me to call Washington, and so I did; the guy there made some calls and couldn't get ahold of anyone (Friday afternoon), and gave me the number for the local field office Industry Operations section. The fellow I talked to had never heard of the form but asked the older folks there about it, and they remembered it but hadn't seen any in years.

Anyway, the upshot is, he's supposed to look around some more next week and see if he can dig some up. We'll see how it goes.

I'm sure the A.T.F does not want anyone to use that form thats why they are M.I.A. I bet they have a few pallets sitting in a corner somewhere in a where house. That would be cool tho to be able to get your guns via mail without even leaving your computer being non-FFL/SOT

hoss · Post by **hoss** » Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:42 pm

Diomed wrote:I followed up on the green forms. Ordered it online again, and once again I got the regular 4473. So I called the distribution center, and the woman who answered said they hadn't stocked them in (and I quote) "eons". She directed me to call Washington, and so I did; the guy there made some calls and couldn't get ahold of anyone (Friday afternoon), and gave me the number for the local field office Industry Operations section. The fellow I talked to had never heard of the form but asked the older folks there about it, and they remembered it but hadn't seen any in years.

Anyway, the upshot is, he's supposed to look around some more next week and see if he can dig some up. We'll see how it goes.

I used green forms at one time - waaay back in the early '80s. I don't recall it being used for "non-Over the counter sales." It was was used for sales to Contiguous states. At the time, a transfer still had to be on the licensed premises so the buyer had to be standing there. They just lived across the state line.

Diomed · Post by **Diomed** » Sun Jun 29, 2008 3:38 am

hoss wrote:I don't recall it being used for "non-Over the counter sales." It was was used for sales to Contiguous states.

Could be it was changed, but it's called "Non-over-the-counter" in their literature now.

I find it amusing that they continue to list it as available even though it's obviously not. Government at work!

pistol fixer · Post by **pistol fixer** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 2:18 pm

hello everyone;
your dealer is correct. once the form 4 is approved , the NFA item is yours. no 4473 needed, no Brady check, no nothing. The Dealer just ships it to you. the NFA process takes place of 4473 and Brady.

I know this thread is a few days old, but i hope this is helpfull

MrPhotoGuyInc · Post by **MrPhotoGuyInc** » Thu Jul 10, 2008 3:00 pm

pistol fixer wrote:hello everyone;
your dealer is correct. once the form 4 is approved , the NFA item is yours. no 4473 needed, no Brady check, no nothing. The Dealer just ships it to you. the NFA process takes place of 4473 and Brady.

I know this thread is a few days old, but i hope this is helpfull

I think you are wrong, even with approved form 4 you still must do a .4473 on NFA items if you are getting it from SOT/FFL.

Diomed · Post by **Diomed** » Fri Jul 11, 2008 3:25 am

pistol fixer wrote:the NFA process takes place of 4473 and Brady.

The NFA process obviates Brady only, and only for individual registrants (i.e. not trusts or corps).

Look on the back of the 4473, there is a check box for NFA items.

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