Age limit at this years Silencer Shoot?

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Fro1911nut
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Age limit at this years Silencer Shoot?

Post by Fro1911nut » Thu Aug 13, 2009 9:25 pm

There was talk of having something set up for the younger ones this year? Or it still 18 and older?
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Re: Age limit at this years Silencer Shoot?

Post by 1_ar_newbie » Fri Aug 14, 2009 9:18 am

Fro1911nut wrote:There was talk of having something set up for the younger ones this year? Or it still 18 and older?
How old are you talking about?
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Re: Age limit at this years Silencer Shoot?

Post by Fro1911nut » Sun Aug 16, 2009 10:59 pm

1_ar_newbie wrote:
Fro1911nut wrote:There was talk of having something set up for the younger ones this year? Or it still 18 and older?
How old are you talking about?

10

I can provide references for his shooting ability and safety if need be :D
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Post by Fro1911nut » Tue Aug 18, 2009 10:29 pm

:?: :shock:

Come on how can u all say "No" to this :D

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Post by DEVIL DOC » Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:34 am

No eight year olds being coached by sixteen year old uzi instructors please. I'd say the child should have at least minimal a good understanding of firearm safety and the parent apply common sense to the equation.

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Post by tuckerrnr1 » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:18 am

DEVIL DOC wrote:I'd say the child should have at least minimal a good understanding of firearm safety
Proverbs 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.

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Post by DEVIL DOC » Wed Aug 19, 2009 11:58 am

Indeed

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Post by Dingle1911 » Wed Aug 19, 2009 3:11 pm

very true.

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Post by Fro1911nut » Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:47 pm

Couldnt agree more....mine is lucky as he gets to shoot with the like of Mark & Allen of PSI...Some of the guys from AAC...Alot of current & former Military...and they all offer to help him :D

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Post by kalikraven » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:20 pm

IIRC they are required to keep shooters under 18 off the firing line due to insurance requirements.
Going a little more discrete here due to some of my opinions...

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Post by Fro1911nut » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:40 pm

kalikraven wrote:IIRC they are required to keep shooters under 18 off the firing line due to insurance requirements.
That was last year..and there wsa talk of changing it this year.....
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Post by JohnInNH » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:38 pm

Please don't hand him a full auto M14. He might show me up.


All joking aside. I know I was very fortunate to have had a lifetime of firearm safety and exposure.

From as far back as I can remember I knew the safety rules and they were a little different than today as they included things like you can't even point a stick, squirt-gun, toy gun, or even you FINGER at a person and "pretend" it is a gun.

Harsh... Maybe, but it instilled a very real respect for firearms. Muzzle control and a natural instinct for me knowing where a safe direction is .. it has become natural for me.

Also every gun is loaded till I personally inspect the chamber, and even then it must revert to rule 1. But now I could work the action cock it and dry fire it (with permission of the owner of the firearm.)

My Dad's friends were always impressed in how all my Dad's kids handled firearms. You know how you can tell when a person has handled firearms a lot, and it is second nature, well we were all like that, but at a young age.

I do however believe there are some limits and guidelines. I don't think a 7 year old should be shooting a 1911. I also feel handguns should follow a few YEARS of rifle training first.

I am not saying you can't or should not let your kid shoot a pistol at all ... but not in competition or as a regular thing. They should go through the NRA small bore rifle training and have all their sharpshooter bars, at a minimum, before moving on to handguns.

ALL the fundamentals and building blocks are the same. If you have not mastered them with a rifle why are you moving on to handguns?

I also feel kids easily can perceive firearms as "toys" and they are something to "play" with. Call me a fuddie duddy but firearms are serious business and deserve the respect of what they are, and that is that of a tool which is a lethal weapon.

Was I ready at 10 to take on pistol shooting? Probably, but am glad I was made to finish my distinguished expert with a rifle before starting to shoot bulls eye with a pistol.

I was 14 and had the strength and had a LOT more responsibility than I did at 10. Not that at 10 I could have been proficient and could be trusted. The only key for guns and ammo that works is trust and training.

I did shoot various pistols .22s, a 9mm, and 38 wadcutter at 12 and 13 but not as a rule.

The vid clip of the little kid is an example of an extreme. He was way to young to be playing that game in my opinion. He is not my son so it's not really my business. I would be tempted as an RO to send him home. If it was my range... my rules.

Everyone is different... but it is never to early to teach safety. I would think 7-8 is a good age for some to start the class room training of the NRA basic rifle marksmanship course.

Strict supervision. Lots of dry fire then go to live ammo. Focus on training fundamentals and work on proficiency. The rifle is a target rifle and is a tool for the sport. It is not a machine gun and only one round at a time should be loaded. Remove the magazines and put the single shot magazines in. My M52 could only shoot one round anyway.

I used a M69 with target sights first as the 52 was to big.

A couple of years developing your shooting "personality" and making shooting friends .. become part of a team.... and focus on your skills punching paper. If parents feel they should be introducing their kids to hunting than that is up to them. I am not going to broach THAT subject. But 7 may be to young to talk about killing with your rifle.

Handguns... I am not comfortable around children with pistols. Not all children are brought up like I was or like others here may have been. At that young age the natural behavior for their age is NOT SAFE.

From a distance watch them it's just not right, and they for some reason, loose sight of where the pistol is pointing. EVEN if they shoot a rifle. Some just can't grasp the concept of where the pistol barrel is pointing.

13 years is a good early starting point for handguns, and 16 is where I feel less supervision is needed.

Now remember your 10 year old may be fine. I am trying to pick a general age.

I am very tempted to say .22 rifle only at 7 years old with parent with in arms length or so only....

At 10 .22 rifle is OK to be on the line and have supervision typical of any range with a RO for every 5-10 kids, AND the 10 year old needs to have his/her NRA basic marksmanship course diploma to be permitted to move around the range w/o their parent or coach, when the line is safe.

Pistol .22 only at 13

center fire rifle at 13 (not to include over 308/30-06)

Centerfire pistol at 16 (not to include over 45 ACP)

All heavy center fire should be 21 unless you are in the military.

338, .50 BMG, 308 handguns, all that big stuff you need to be emancipated and is why I feel 21 or begin in the military.

There is also the legal BS to contend with.

So hand gun might have to be 18/21

As with any guidelines there are people that are ready earlier and people that will NEVER be ready.

As much as I really love seeing 10 year olds shoot and have a blast and become enthusiasts.. BUT there is the right time and place for it. Reserve that for the special Father son times or smaller groups.

As much as I have a LOT of empathy for the 10 year old who might be asked to stay away from a hot line at a big shoot, and am sure many are trustworthy and very capable. It is up to the people putting the shoot on to set the limits.

Maybe the way to handle it is on an exception basis and have the youngsters have a special time and place to shoot with some limitations of caliber and rifle vs pistol. With LOTS of close supervision.

I have also almost been killed by students at 50-60 years old too. Most instructors have a few stories. ;-)
Last edited by JohnInNH on Fri Aug 21, 2009 11:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by JohnInNH » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:58 pm

And yes, this is to young. (no ammo)

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But he was loving every minute of being able to "hold it"

He did get to watch... and shoot a 22 rifle, and a 308 with reduced loads,

This was because he wanted to shoot my hunting rifle and the 308 was to much for him. This way he could say he shot his Dad's 308 and not become afraid of it.
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Post by BookHound » Fri Aug 21, 2009 9:57 am

Some people confuse age with maturity.

I have seen poorer weapon handling and safety concerns from more adults than I have from many youths.

Daniel is one of the safest shooters with whom I've ever had the privileged of sharing a range. He is welcome to shoot with me any day of the week. This kids actually TRAINS with his dad. I'd say Daniel could teach a lot of "grown ups" a thing or three about safety.

I think it is a shame to keep kids off the firing line. They are the future of our sport.

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Post by JohnInNH » Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:18 pm

BookHound wrote:Some people confuse age with maturity.

I have seen poorer weapon handling and safety concerns from more adults than I have from many youths.

Daniel is one of the safest shooters with whom I've ever had the privileged of sharing a range. He is welcome to shoot with me any day of the week. This kids actually TRAINS with his dad. I'd say Daniel could teach a lot of "grown ups" a thing or three about safety.

I think it is a shame to keep kids off the firing line. They are the future of our sport.

Mark
Mark I agree... Most of the pucker moments over the many years of my teaching have come from people over 21

I am sure Daniel is an exceptional mature kid. This is the problem with having to set rules in regard to age.

I assure you I mean nothing against Daniel. If anything I can empathize with him when and if he is excluded due to his age, because I was very much like him.
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Post by Fro1911nut » Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:31 pm

BookHound wrote:Some people confuse age with maturity.

I have seen poorer weapon handling and safety concerns from more adults than I have from many youths.

Daniel is one of the safest shooters with whom I've ever had the privileged of sharing a range. He is welcome to shoot with me any day of the week. This kids actually TRAINS with his dad. I'd say Daniel could teach a lot of "grown ups" a thing or three about safety.

I think it is a shame to keep kids off the firing line. They are the future of our sport.

Mark
Mark thank u for the kind words...it always means alot to me and Johnnie.
And he wouldnt be this far along if it wasnt for all your guys help

John also thank for the comment...

Didnt mean to stir anything up, but will we have a kids area this year :D

If not he will still be out...Mark there is your mag loader and sherpa for the day! :lol:
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Post by Suppressor Professor » Fri Aug 21, 2009 2:23 pm

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but we will not have a kids only area on the line this year, nor will anyone under 18 be allowed to shoot.

There were several factors that came into play when making this decision, but the main factor being SPACE.

We have grown our annual Silencer Shoot to almost "full capacity" as far as the shooting line is concerned at Red Hill Range (WITHOUT sectioning off a kids only area). If we section off a kids only area (the only way that the AAC Silencer Shoot will allow anyone under 18 to shoot) we would be taking away from real estate on the line, and with an expected 800-1000 people attending this year we are concerned with having enough space for everyone to be safe and still have an enjoyable time shooting.

Next year, we will be moving to a bigger range and will be able to better serve those young shooters by having a secondary range, specifically for them, with dedicated Range Officers per child. This year, we cannot make that happen, the range is just not big enough for the amount of people who will be on the line to accomodate a safe secluded area for our young shooters.

HOWEVER...we know that there are going to be some young girls and boys coming to the shoot this year and we've lined up some KID ONLY raffles and have invited Airsoft Atlanta to set up a booth for some Airsoft suppressed weapons. We may even have an area for them to demo their items and let the little guys try their gear out. I know this doesn't take the place of being able to shoot real guns with dad on the line, but for now, this is what we can offer for the young ones the day of the shoot.

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Post by Fro1911nut » Fri Aug 21, 2009 10:57 pm

Cara thank for the info...and thanks for the $ your gona cost me at the airsoft table ;)

There u go Mark..there is your loading surpa for the day! HAHA
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Post by Hootiewho » Sat Aug 22, 2009 8:10 am

Personally its the adults, not the kids that I saw problems with last year. One group on the line, a dealer that had a kid with them shooting frightened the s--t out of me last year. I personally saw an adult with the group load a .22 rifle, then sweep the kids head with the muzzle as he made way to let the kid shoot. About 4 others in my group witnessed this and we avoided that end of the range from then on.

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Post by mpallett » Sat Aug 22, 2009 10:57 am

This guy is safe He was 6 at the time.

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Post by Outsydlooknin75 » Mon Aug 24, 2009 9:34 pm

HUH why does Marky always get the smartassed kid to be his sherpa. Little s--t needs to tote my stuff for a change.
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Post by Fro1911nut » Mon Aug 24, 2009 10:37 pm

Outsydlooknin75 wrote:HUH why does Marky always get the smartassed kid to be his sherpa. Little s--t needs to tote my stuff for a change.
U dont own machineguns :wink: :lol: and u got Jess :P
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Post by ForestBeast » Wed Aug 26, 2009 3:27 pm

Cara - thanks for that update. I appreciate ya'll doing something cool for the kids with the raffle. One of you gave my boy a AAC skull and crossbones flag last year, it's still hanging over the door to his room :)

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