9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

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lobo56
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9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by lobo56 »

Is this stuff ok to run with a can? 147gr so should be subsonic! How about reloadability?

Thanks for your input.
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Post by kalikraven »

As long as its boxer primed brass case then it should reload just fine.
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Post by JohnInNH »

I LOVE this stuff. CLEAN The brass comes out clean (no soot or unburnt powder) It is longer then the stubby AE stuff which is filthy. the Winchester has a little more umph is longer so it feeds well it is more like a FMJ but has a small flat.. It makes a nice SMACK when I hit large hard wood blocks. MUCH Quieter than Speer LAWMAN 147 gr FMJ IMHO.

I have a 3 K of this. Working on shooting up my AE Ammoman just cxled the 1K discount last night and I snatched up one more case at the old $280 K delivered before it ended. I JUST made it.

I got 5K at 12.50 a box but split it with a friend from a different place a few months ago.

Keep an eye out for it. It is the same as the "Ranger Practice Non HP ammo" as far as I can tell and can be got fairly cheep.

AE has an open Base lead base as does Special K The Winchester encapsulated does not.
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Abiqua
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Post by Abiqua »

Glad to hear a positive review as I bought a case from ammoman just before they uppped the price too.
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Post by JohnInNH »

Abiqua14 wrote:Glad to hear a positive review as I bought a case from ammoman just before they uppped the price too.
Good snag... Let us know how you like this stuff. I recall someone had an issue with it in his machine gun. ... I don't know why.
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Post by Snake-eater 1 »

I've been shooting it for a couple of weeks now, no issues in my Glock or XD.
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Post by TOOL1075 »

Yeah, enclosed base (or in other words, fully encapsulated) ammo is all I will shoot now.

If you shoot a lot of ammo that isn't encapsulated, through a 9mm can, you are going to get a lot of lead in your can.

I already have lead caked in my Trident from shooting FMJ ammo (special K, american eagle, etc).

I jumped on the deal Ammoman had a few weeks ago for the flat-nose fully encapsulated Winchester Ranger ammo. Pretty much the same ammo you are talking about here.

The next manufacturer who makes a take-apart 9mm pistol suppressor that is modular (i.e. can use 3-lug or threads) and has good performance (i.e. on par with the Trident) will be the one to get.

I'm never going to buy another sealed centerfire pistol suppressor.
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Post by JohnInNH »

TOOL1075 wrote:
I'm never going to buy another sealed centerfire pistol suppressor.
I tend to agree. I would like to be able to shoot all the 38 spl lead RN which I have tons of from my Dad AND the 1000's of bullets I have that are lead hard cast HEAVY 210 gr as they would be perfect for the 38 spl/357 mag at sub sonic speeds ..

The leading is an issue. SO a take apart 9mm can would be tits.

If the Ti-Rant 9 was take apart, 357 MAG rated and had a Tri-lug adapter it would be on order now.

I will not use AE or Spl K anymore. HP ammo or fully encapsulated from now on.

The Winchester is SOOOooo much cleaner than the AE it is ridicules.

I have about 800 rounds of AE and 400 Spl K ... IIRC I may sell it and order more "Winclean". It also shoots very well accuracy wise.

It is also MUCH quieter then the Speer Lawman 147 gr FMJ
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Post by Eight »

I must have missed it. Are we worrying about 9mm cans filling up with lead now, too? The mantra has always been that there is no need to clean centerfire cans.
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Post by JohnInNH »

A 9mm/357 can would be nice if we could take it apart to service it in the event we wanted to shoot cast bullets.... also open base FMJ bullets have exposed soft lead bases. The hot gasses do vaporize the lead and it will condense in your can. It may just mix with the powder and carbon fowling but that makes it difficult to rinse out.

A universal take apart can that could handle up to 357 mag or even 357 Maximum, and was serviceable, would open a whole new world of usefulness... It would need to be ACCURATE as it would be used on rifles as well as hunting pistols. If made of TI it would be light enough and probably strong enough.

Hot 38 super & 9x21 also are candidates for this can as well. Single shot pistols in 357 mag (maybe up to 357 herrett and 357 MAX), are begging for a silencer. In the cast gas checked selection there are heavy bullets that would work well.

Being able to clean the lube (maybe it would help to act like grease and help attenuate?) and lead would be required. (I have never had a gas check come off fyi)

I don't know if a Ti rant 9mm can handle a 357 mag.

I would consider it a light rifle heavy pistol can. It would NOT replace the evo-9 but fill the gap and be able to handle 9mm, 32 mag, 38 super, 38 spl, 357 mag ... and who knows maybe the hotter 35 cal single shot pistol bullets like the 357 Maximum and herrett.

On a 16.5" lever action rifle and a super 14 210 gr bullets at 1025 FPS would be pretty interesting. Full power 180 gr bullets at supersonic speeds would be have the muzzle blast significantly reduced and make shooting them much more pleasurable.

I can picture a 357 maximum with 225 gr jacked spire point bullets. out of a super 14 contender with a bi-pod and sand sock with a scope. The silencer would reduce muzzle flip and make kit a nice smooth push back. Only having to deal with the crack would make it sweet. Even sub sonics at that weight would dwarf the 9mm 147 gr. loading for power.

Just day dreaming.
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Post by Fireman1291 »

I have 500rds of 147grn winclean on hand, and my backorder of the other 500 just cleared midwayusa yesterday. Since my 9mm can is not inhand yet, I plan to shoot only fully encased ammo through it from the beginning. 8)

Im glad to hear it is very quiet!
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Post by Abiqua »

JohnInNH wrote:
Abiqua14 wrote:Glad to hear a positive review as I bought a case from ammoman just before they uppped the price too.
Good snag... Let us know how you like this stuff. I recall someone had an issue with it in his machine gun. ... I don't know why.
Yeah, just need to pick up a 9mm to shoot it in.

I threw it on the pile of good deal ammo for guns I don't own yet. :)
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by JohnInNH »

Just I case anyone searched about good 9mm ammo be advised after using the super unleaded BEB ammo I and others discovered it is not silencer friendly if your silencer has aluminum baffles... search "Winchester WinClean" or "Baffle Erosion" and look for my thread.

This ammo will sand blast your aluminum baffles and erode them. Still nice ammo for a SS baffle stack or unsupressed shooting.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by 700PSS »

JohnInNH wrote:Just I case anyone searched about good 9mm ammo be advised after using the super unleaded BEB ammo I and others discovered it is not silencer friendly if your silencer has aluminum baffles... search "Winchester WinClean" or "Baffle Erosion" and look for my thread.

This ammo will sand blast your aluminum baffles and erode them. Still nice ammo for a SS baffle stack or unsupressed shooting.
Does my AAC EVO-40 have aluminum baffles that can be damaged by using this ammo? I've got multiple cases of this stuff lying around.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by JohnInNH »

I believe if the Evo-40 is like an Evo-9 the blast baffle is steel, and the rest are AL ... Shoot the ammo and keep a close eye on the second baffle. If it starts to abraded it just stop using it in that silencer. The erosion is easily seen with a flashlight ...and in my case two pair of reading glasses.. 8)

Unfortunately I did not look till after I shot a few hundred rounds and the damage was done.... Now as a result I had Stalking Rhino recore it with new baffles, and left it take apart.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by 700PSS »

That sounds right. It's been a while since I confirmed that. I think I'll just shoot it and check it like you suggested. When it comes time, I'll probably have it re-cored and made into a take-apart also. I hear Thompson Machine does that well also.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by Thwik »

Is that this stuff?

Image


If so, Ive shot no more than 500rds through my multimount and this is what I found:

Image

I bought a case of it, so...I guess I'll just shoot the other half of it unsuppressed and look for something else to shoot through my can.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by Abiqua »

Thwik wrote:Is that this stuff?
Yes.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by thoppe »

I just found out about this thread today.

I have been shooting this Winchester 147gr Super X ammo through my Osprey for a while now. In fact, I've run north of 2,000 rounds through it over the past 12 months. As soon as I got home I ran a light down into the baffles to check things out. Surprisingly there was not much erosion at all. I was expecting to see quite a bit give the comments I read above but not so much.

I definitely wont be shooting anymore through it though. This topic really should be made a sticky.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by JohnInNH »

thoppe wrote:I just found out about this thread today.

I have been shooting this Winchester 147gr Super X ammo through my Osprey for a while now. In fact, I've run north of 2,000 rounds through it over the past 12 months. As soon as I got home I ran a light down into the baffles to check things out. Surprisingly there was not much erosion at all. I was expecting to see quite a bit give the comments I read above but not so much.

I definitely wont be shooting anymore through it though. This topic really should be made a sticky.
I agree.

Also.

Silencer companies should have a warning on their web sites, and an insert in the instructions cautioning owners to not use it. It does more damage than "reloads"
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by dan9591 »

Now I'm freaking out. Are we talking about this ammo?: http://sgammo.com/product/winchester/50 ... sonic-ammo ?

I have a silencerco osprey 9 waiting on a form 4. It will be paired with a glock 19. While waiting, I have been stockpiling this specific ammo. Now I am understandably concerned.

According to Sam from sgammo this is great ammo for suppressors. He's a very smart guy that deals with a lot of ammo and I would like to agree with him, but seeing the previous posts I am totally confused.

If this ammo is no good, what do you guys recommend? Cheap subsonic, no reloads and no steel. I prefer Winchester, but for plinking I could use something else. I just love the price of this stuff, $14/50 is outstanding, but I also don't want to kill my can... And I plan on doing a lot of shooting with it...

My carry ammo is Winchester ranger 147 grain. Also bought from sgammo. I am not on their payroll, but I have to say that every time I have bought from them has been outstanding. I once sent an email for something totally stupid at 11pm on a Saturday and they actually responded within 15 minutes! I highly recommend them...

Edited to add- I've emailed silencerco for their recommendation. They usually have excellent customer service, but 3 emails over 2 weeks about this topic have gone unanswered...
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by JohnInNH »

dan9591 wrote:Now I'm freaking out. Are we talking about this ammo?: http://sgammo.com/product/winchester/50 ... sonic-ammo ?

I have a silencerco osprey 9 waiting on a form 4. It will be paired with a glock 19. While waiting, I have been stockpiling this specific ammo. Now I am understandably concerned.

According to Sam from sgammo this is great ammo for suppressors. He's a very smart guy that deals with a lot of ammo and I would like to agree with him, but seeing the previous posts I am totally confused.

If this ammo is no good, what do you guys recommend? Cheap subsonic, no reloads and no steel. I prefer Winchester, but for plinking I could use something else. I just love the price of this stuff, $14/50 is outstanding, but I also don't want to kill my can... And I plan on doing a lot of shooting with it...

My carry ammo is Winchester ranger 147 grain. Also bought from sgammo. I am not on their payroll, but I have to say that every time I have bought from them has been outstanding. I once sent an email for something totally stupid at 11pm on a Saturday and they actually responded within 15 minutes! I highly recommend them...

Edited to add- I've emailed silencerco for their recommendation. They usually have excellent customer service, but 3 emails over 2 weeks about this topic have gone unanswered...

Yes, that is the baffle EATING, sand blasting ammo, I, and others, have been talking about.. Want to buy 6000 rounds of it?

I am selling mine at the gun club to convert back to $ so I can get Canned Heat 147 gr FMJ. It will run in my MG better too. The flat point will not run in my AR upper. The Super Unleaded Win ammo runs well in my Sig and G19 but ask Stalking Rino what it did to my Evo-9! I shot less than a case of it too. I now will only use my Mystic with this ammo.

This is WONDERFUL ammo if you have replaceable baffles or Stainless Steel baffles. It is the cleanest burning ammo I have seen. Amazing stuff.. Just don't put a sealed can with AL baffles on it!

If Silencer Co says they will rebuild you can after it gets chewed up let me know. I may start to shoot it in my 45 Osprey then to use it up.
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by dan9591 »

Man, this sucks.

For once the ATF is working in my favor. I'm still waiting on the form 4 for the suppressor, so I obviously haven't shot it yet.

I've heard nothing but great things about silencerco and their customer service and have no doubt that they would take care of the can if something happens to it, but are they aware of this issue? Do they have any comments or recommendations? I'm sure they will say "just try it out", but I hate being a guinea pig. Besides, they seem to do so much testing on their own that they may actually have a good suggestion.

I've already emailed them 2 or 3 times about this, but I haven't heard from them yet. I'm Going to post this in the industry thread. Hopefully they'll respond there...
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by dan9591 »

I spoke to Mike from Silencerco and he says there shouldn’t be a problem with this ammo. He says they haven’t heard of any issues with this specific ammo.

You gotta think that these guys have seen, heard and tested it all. I would tend to take their word for it, but then again, pictures don’t lie…

So confused….

Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions?
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Re: 9mm Winchester 147gr. Brass Enclosed Base (BEB) Ammo

Post by jh1990 »

dan9591 wrote:I spoke to Mike from Silencerco and he says there shouldn’t be a problem with this ammo. He says they haven’t heard of any issues with this specific ammo.

You gotta think that these guys have seen, heard and tested it all. I would tend to take their word for it, but then again, pictures don’t lie…

So confused….

Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions?
Use it all up; shoot the crap out of it. If it harms your baffles Silencer Co will have it back to you in a couple days good as new. Nothing to lose.
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