Tasered woman vegetable, cop cleared of wrong doing....

[kapkanimd]

http://www.baynews9.com/article/news/20 ... eing-woman

watched the video, fat ass cop just didnt want to run anymore.. WTF....

[Russian]

xx

[doubloon]

After the commercial http://www.baynews9.com/video?clip=http ... ys%20taser

Enter Stage Right

She hits her head pretty hard then sits up for a few seconds.

Running while handcuffed, destined for the Darwin files eventually anyway. Sooner than later maybe saves additional aggravation.

[Russian]

xx

[kapkanimd]

I don't think tasering was unjustified. She slipped her cuffs around to the front and was fleeing custody. The outcome was unfortunate but she brought it on herself.

I bet if that was a relative you would disagree. She was arrested for driving with suspended license and hit and run accidents.. The fat ass didnt want to run after so he took the easy route and tasered her. She wasnt very away from him, everyone knows she wasnt going to get very far handcuffed, she was at a police station, not arrested for a dangerous crime or had history of violience, etc etc etc. The fact that the rule states that fleeing is not a sole reason for tasering says it all, but they use some excuse about moving the handcuffs? wtf does that matter if they are fleeing anyway..

I find tasering to be very dangerous, both cause of risk of dangerous falls, and risk of interupting electrical function of the heart. Using it for a violent person as a last resort to avoid physical altercation in an unarmed person is one thing, but this girl posed no immediate danger to the officer or any anyone else in the area. The excuse about being close to a busy highway is just ridiculous as is the one about him tacking her would cause more damage...

[doubloon]

...
I bet if that was a relative you would disagree.
...

Unlikely.

And the rule is not as simple as you quote it third hand from a news article.

The FHP policy on flight states "active physical resistance" and "preparing or attempting to flee or escape" is justification for tasering.

I feel comfortable assuming there was some active physical resistance off camera before the target entered stage right in an obvious "attempt to flee or escape". So, physical resistance plus flee equals justification.

But if your heart still bleeds for this socially dysfunctional and rebellious destroyer of property you'd probably be better served focusing on 10.05.04-C.1.b

1. The ECD is considered an intermediate control device, and the decision to utilize it involves the same basic justifications as with the use of the ASR. Unless exigent circumstances exist, members shall not use the device in the following situations:
(b) On a handcuffed or secured prisoner;

But I'm pretty sure they still got justification on "exigent circumstances".

http://www.flhsmv.gov/fhp/Manuals/1005.pdf

You can't go around interpreting laws with your emotions, if you do then before you know it you'll have Pelosi bikini posters all over your bedroom.

Get your poster here Pelosi Upskirt

[bakerjw]

But then they have the video where she has the handcuffs off and slips one back on her hand. Tough call. The cop obviously didn't have the cuffs on tight enough.

[Russian]

xx

[kapkanimd]

http://www.baynews9.com/article/news/20 ... -handcuffs

and there is also audio of the cop explaining himself

In the video she tells him specifically she took her cuff off and he just replys with put it back on.... It never stated he put them back behind her back so I am assuming he probably just slipped that one back on in front. Either way that video is 40 minutes before she tried to run. You can tell she is very agitated/high/jittery in the cuff video though.

Either way its sad it had to end this way for her.. oh well.. I am still against unnecessary tasing people. The fact that his taken even one life makes it by definition not less than lethal. I agree it has its uses, but this was not one of them by a long shot..

[doubloon]

I'm not a fan of the taser either, I think it's too easily abused.

Do I think the girl in the video should have been tased? Not based on what I think I know.

But to try to make the parameters for deciding who to tase and who not to tase based on height, weight, mental stability, possible heart condition, hair color, boobs, no boobs and the infinite list of additional variables would be impossible to compile and enforce. It's not like the girl was sitting on a park bench not bothering anyone and somebody told her to move but she refused and got tased for it.

She was in custody.

She knew she was in custody.

She made a conscious decision to try to get away.

What if it had been a 6 foot, 300 lb, weed smoking, crack selling baby raper that entered stage right and got tased? Justified or not?

As for the interpretation of "less than lethal" the world is not black and white. If all it takes is one death to define "lethal force" then there are a lot more things out there we need to classify as "lethal".

A ride on a roller coaster is not generally accepted as lethal but people have died riding them. That doesn't make it by definition a "lethal ride".

Even the law isn't as black and white as everyone wants you to believe and after kindergarten there's no such thing as fair.

[continuity]

Tasers are the best thing since sliced bread.. applied correctly. This female did NOT end up like this from the taser deployment. And as a result of her poor behavior the chickens just came home to roost.

Today I deployed a taser in a hospital emergency area to stop a subject from gaining access to a +12 inch mirror shard. He had just head butted a mirror in a restroom, broken it, and was attempting to remove one of the pieces. If he HAD gotten control of a shard, I would have been forced to shoot him. All round.... it was a good day.

IMHO the only thing better than a taser for non lethal force application is the vulcan "death" grip, which applied correctly, only stuns. My Sgt. looked at me with the old " third eyeball in center of forehead" look when I turned in my request for training on that technique though. Told me to just use my taser.

meh.....

[ick]

If a 4 year old child suddenly sprinted from the sidewalk directly out into traffic moving at a high rate of speed... would you blame a driver that hit the child? That would be unfortunate, and you would hold the other driver to a reasonable standard of not driving recklessly... but some things just happen.

This young girl, who is old enough to KNOW better, put herself in the situation to get hurt.

It is very unfortunate, but the cop is not to blame.

[kapkanimd]

Tasers are the best thing since sliced bread.. applied correctly. This female did NOT end up like this from the taser deployment. And as a result of her poor behavior the chickens just came home to roost.

Today I deployed a taser in a hospital emergency area to stop a subject from gaining access to a +12 inch mirror shard. He had just head butted a mirror in a restroom, broken it, and was attempting to remove one of the pieces. If he HAD gotten control of a shard, I would have been forced to shoot him. All round.... it was a good day.
....

Well..... she did end up like this as a result from the taser being deployed whether you see it or not... she wasn't running away and tripped (AND even if she was she could of had the ability to stick her hands out and slow her fall).. I am the first one to admit when people are idiots. This was a 20yr old girl supposedly on drugs at the time (you can see how she is in the back of the cruiser). Not sure if you were just telling your story about the guy in the ER, but that is nothing like this situation. I see no problem with it being used in cases like that as I mentioned earlier.

Again I am not too bothered by this story. Just think it was a completely unnecessary and avoidable tragedy for a young person, who possibly with help could have lived a decent life. Or possibly not, I tend to try and see some good in people. However in my profession I end up seeing the complete oposite a lot of the time.

[kapkanimd]

If a 4 year old child suddenly sprinted from the sidewalk directly out into traffic moving at a high rate of speed... would you blame a driver that hit the child? That would be unfortunate, and you would hold the other driver to a reasonable standard of not driving recklessly... but some things just happen.

This young girl, who is old enough to KNOW better, put herself in the situation to get hurt.

It is very unfortunate, but the cop is not to blame.

Not really seeing you point with the child/driver story.. I agree some things just happen. And if the cop was forced to use his taser and this happened to be the result, then I might agree the cop is not to blame. If you dont agree then we can agree to disagree. The cop was clearly a lard ass and didnt want to chase anyone or whatever. Nothing can be done at this point.

[Libertarian_Geek]

Had the cop tackled her, the same result could have happened. She made the decision to run. That was the "first domino to fall".

Was the cop lazy? Yep.
Did she need to be stopped when she ran? Yes. She's a criminal, and she fled.
Should he have used the taser? No, he should have gotten a little exercise and tackled her ass.
Is it the cop's fault? No, just like it wouldn't have been his fault had he pursued her on foot and she ran into traffic and got hit by a bus.
Was the taser justified? No. But it's not the root cause of her being in her present state. It's only a contributing factor (like the pavement). Had she been behind the wheel of a car, and was paralyzed, you wouldn't say that the chase caused it.

Free-will is a bitch isn't it?

Dumb people should wear helmets.

[jupiterdraft]

Well..... she did end up like this as a result from the taser being deployed whether you see it or not...

I disagree.

She ended up like this as a result of (choose one):
- the blow to the head
- the fall
- the taser deployment
- the attempted escape from custody
- getting caught committing a crime
- committing a crime
- not staying home that night & watching South Park on TV
- smoking that first marijuana cigarette as a teenager
- hanging with the wrong element
- mommy didn't love her enough
- daddy let creepy uncle Dan eye ball her too much
- being picked on in second grade for being poor
- oxygen deprivation during childbirth
- mommy & daddy were stoned during conception

Where you choose to stop in this list will vary based on your personal beliefs. If you want to talk cause and effect, you have to determine the actual cause...

[doubloon]

... The cop was clearly a lard ass ...

I don't know why you keep going back to attacking the cop for his weight. The cops weight has no relevance whatsoever to the interpretation of the law.

So you're saying if the cop had been skinny it would have been OK to tase her?

Or if the cop was fit and on the job with a knee injury it would have been OK to tase her because of his injury?

Why do you keep getting your personal feelings all bunched up in this? Stick to the facts.

[doubloon]

...
Where you choose to stop in this list will vary based on your personal beliefs. If you want to talk cause and effect, you have to determine the actual cause...

[ick]

But she is injured. Sure she made mistakes, but she was a good girl. It can't be her own fault. It must be someone elses fault.

Someone must be made to pay.

[kapkanimd]

anyhow, you seem to keep thinking I have anything invested in this case. I dont really care about the girl or what happened to her. If the same thing happend to my 16 y/o daughter (I do not have any kids, just hypothetical) who got scared and panicked, I would obviously have my emotions involved and handled this differently. I am simply discussing the danger involved in the tazing and if it was really necessary in this case. I agree there are many reasons to why this particular case happened. The only part I am even discussing is the tazer being deployed on a non-violent person running away (Handcuffed on top of it). There are many possibilities for what could have happened if he didnt use the tazer, maybe she should have ran into traffic and died or gone home and committed suicide. I see those results more under her control and more of a darwin situation. However, being paralized while you are running on concrete with the inability to slow your fall is not under her control and a direct result of using the tazer. Again this is my opinion and I am entitled to it. Ick I am sorry if I am upsetting you, dunno if you are a cop or just a heartless dick who doesnt care about anyone else in the world, but if the situation involved you or someone you loved you would feel differently I bet. And I keep going on to the cop being fat as I see it as possibly a main the reason he tazed her, maybe not, but again my opinion. If you honestly believe he did it because he was going through the laws regarding the use of tazers and fleeing suspects in his mind, that is your opinion, but I highly doubt it.

[Trevor2011]

dont run from the police when you are under arrest and you won't

1. get tased
2. get shot
3. get maced
4. get beat with an asp
5. get tackled to the ground and mashed up
6. get a felony resisting charge put on you

[MJF1911]

In the last few years a few meth heads have died after being tasered, one in the county jail (extremely combative, tasered 9 times) and one on the street (running naked out in traffic, tasered 4 times).

Obviously it has different effects on different people. I work with a guy that is pretty muscular, when the cops tasered him he just grabbed the probes and pulled them out. A few seconds after he uttered, "thats it?" things got ugly fast. He deserved it.

[continuity]

... Not sure if you were just telling your story about the guy in the ER, ....

You need further understanding? I'll PM you a copy of the report narrative if you want. That's only because you actually appear to be articulate and have clarity in your position. Have no problem with your perception, just your grasp of reality.

[kapkanimd]

... Not sure if you were just telling your story about the guy in the ER, ....

You need further understanding? I'll PM you a copy of the report narrative if you want. That's only because you actually appear to be articulate and have clarity in your position. Have no problem with your perception, just your grasp of reality.

huh?? Did you read my full post? I am not confused about your story at all nor would I care for more details. I just said that it was nothing like this particular situation. I mentioned I agreed with it's use in violent situations like that.... I have a perfectly fine grasp of reality. The reality is that there is a clear danger beyond less than lethal force with the use of tazers and I disagree in their use in situations that do not warrant the possibility of someone dying or something like this situation because of it. I know they do not have the same effect on every person, but the possibility is that it could kill anyone you use it on makes it lethal force. That seems pretty factual to me and has nothing to do with emotions about this case. Feel free to comment if you disagree, that is the point of this forum, not to get your panties all bunched up.

[doubloon]

... necessary ...

Coming back to that.

Was he "going through the laws" in his head?

Nope, he has a boilerplate of situations where he's allowed to use either his taser or his gun that got ingrained in a class. It's ingrained correctly for some and incorrectly for others because they're human and not Commander Data. I have no doubt some police tasings are not at all within the guidelines even as generously as they are written but I'm sure nobody cares because it's some fat slob or some tattooed "freak" but because this was a young girl people are all upset.

Again, what if it had been a 6 foot, 300 lb, weed smoking, crack selling baby raper with a heart condidion but all they knew about him was hit and run offenses?

Should the police have access to someone's medical history before they react to any wrongdoing?

Back to necessary.

Was it "necessary" to arrest her at all in the first place?

Was it "necessary" to handcuff her?

The recent diabetic video is a good comparison to this story. The police on the scene mistook the muscular spasms for resistance and "subdued" the suspect. An unfortunate turn of events but "necessary" for the situation as assessed. But then this guy shows up and starts kicking the guy in the head while there are already four on his back, not necessary.

I think this sums it up nicely.
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