What about 3D printed silencers?

Yes, it can be legal to make a silencer. For everything Form-1, from silencer designs that are easily made, to filing forms with the BATF, to 3D modeling. Remember, you must have an approved BATF Form-1 to make a silencer. All NFA laws apply.

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Bienert
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What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Bienert »

Hi guys

Would appreciate your experience about 3D printed silencers. Anyone tried one of them? Maybe a form1 printed would be reasonable? It could be a huge expand of form1 designs as we can do almost anything in airflow terms, without the need of a monocore plus sleeve or individual baffles. Besides that it’s easier to share and even improve a model without huge machinery. I am not sure however about material durability and resistance. What’s your impressions?
Historian
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Historian »

The technology has progressed to the point where there
are services under the heading "Direct Metal Laser Sintering (DMLS) 3D Printing "

When Xerox introduced its laser printer in 1970s offices paid mucho thousands of dollars
to have one, technicians came once a week to clean out the dangerous micro
particles and maintain them. Now an Epson printer can be had to $200.00,
unlimited ink, etc.

The 3D printer costs will take a similar path, resins + ceramics + aluminum+ the metals
would serve the experimenter. Funny thought ... a GS 7 at ATF will pen in that as every
part of a suppressor is de facto a suppressor requiring a $200.00 poll tax, would this entail
that every layer of a can that is printed must be reported, back ground check made, and wait 9 months
for approval? :)

Example of logical principal Reductio Ad Absurdum .
alordnapa
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by alordnapa »

I can't imagine that too many people would want a Form 1 suppressor that will likely self-destruct or wear to the point of uselessness. Maybe SOT's, or military and police buyers would like them. 3d ( Plastic) printed suppressors would probably be a good thing for these buys, who don't have to pay the silly taxes, and won't shed any tears when their can becomes a molted puddle of goo. There are suppressors ( Like the secret Glock throw-away unit) that are made to be fully functional and disposable. They could advertise these as being good for the environment, and being plastic, they can be recycled...perhaps they can melt them down and make them into IUD's for liberals or something acceptable.
Bienert
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Bienert »

I am thinking about DlMS indeed.

As I see maybe with natural evolution of materials and printer hardware the technology will become more real for the common citizen. For now it’s not a big deal.

Does anyone had a thought about commercial polymer silencers btw?
Bienert
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Bienert »

Since even the disposable rubber baffles were considered supressor parts, seems to me it could be a concern about home made 3D printed silencers from ATF. Afterall PBS-1 like models are not rocket science today if you exclude durability. They were (considering what’s expected for the technology) effective.
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by alordnapa »

I suppose that you could send your melted puddle of goo back to your SOT manufacturer so that he can "repair" it after its too worn to use...
Bienert
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Bienert »

I respectfully do not agree, since DMLS we are talking about metal and pbf-1 was one battle proven silencer with disposable rubber baffles. Very crude indeed I agree but effective for a couple shots. For sure we are not talking about PLA or other low resistence polymer. I am more for the previous opinion side. Law enforcement, special ops, single shot users for almost disposable devices. Otherwise… plastic puddle. :)
Last edited by Bienert on Tue Jul 27, 2021 12:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
Bienert
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Bienert »

Btw does OSS supressors uses DMLS printing?
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Capt. Link.
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Capt. Link. »

I know little about evolving printer technology in the civilian sector. The government sector has been able to build fully functional items for decades including high stress items. Given time what you can imagine can be printed.
-CL
The only reason after 243 years the government now wants to disarm you is they intend to do something you would shoot them for!
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
Historian
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Historian »

Until the price drops to that of an Epson Printer many will still
be using a lathe.

Passage along 'gunsmithing kink': Having had quite a few cylinderical Neodymium Rare Earth Magnets
from the making of a magnetic coupling for a forearm to an 16.5" .45 barrel on a 1911A1 I
wrapped three in glassine sleeves used to protect 35mm film, placed them
on the lathe chuck at the jaws. This has worked exceedingly well in capturing
for example the small particles flying from machining cast iron rods.

At the end of the machine session all that was required was to remove the
magnets from the sleeve and toss the swarf away. The field radius of these
magnets is inches and collect hot sparks of metals that flew off the rods tangentially.

Best.
Scottish Kev
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Scottish Kev »

There are already 3D printed silencers commercially available and in the wild, most notably from CGS Group, who are able to use DMLS( Direct Metal Laser Sintering, as mentioned above) to print in Inconel and titanium.

The thought is that, because the printed material is perfectly uniform throughout it's construction and there can be no hidden weak spots or molecular problems in the material, they may actually be a little more durable than the same materials conventionally made. And the printing allows them to form complex internal geometries and shapes that would be difficult to impossible with traditional manufacturing. They're (CGS's) full size Hyperion silencer has been measured (by Pew Science) to be the quietest in its class/size by a noticeable margin out of the silencers that have been measured so far, head and shoulders above the Thunderbeast Ultra 9 which comes in second.

I would presume that the cost will be out of the reach of the average Form 1 designer in terms of actually buying their own machine. However if you were to learn how to use the 3D design software and make up the designs, I'm sure there would be companies who would be willing to do the actual printing for you, and that may be within a more achievable budget.
truenorth
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by truenorth »

DeltaP design has been 3D printing suppressors for years now. And tiny suppressors too!
quattro74
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by quattro74 »

Then there are these guys:

https://3d-printed-innovations.com/prod ... oming-soon

Too small a face for my 9mm can, yet, even if there was an option how would someone drill thru inconel?
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Capt. Link.
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Capt. Link. »

I have made crankshafts from it using HSS tools and oil via acid brush.
The only reason after 243 years the government now wants to disarm you is they intend to do something you would shoot them for!
http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895
Matt in TN
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Matt in TN »

My Thermal Defense Solutions suppressor was made this way, and it's the shiznet. Dunno how realistic it is for Form 1 people though...
22: http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=138952
30: http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=156481
9: http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=696697
Historian
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Historian »

Thought, 3D printing a tube whose diameter is ∆x > O.D. of thin wall SS tube*
inner wall reenforcing which becomes a strong liner. Then end caps threaded to central Don Walsh's
patent with its central barrel extension, compressing end caps to complete the can. No moving
parts. No Baffles. Easy to clean. Choice on how Long and Wide ==>> 'no noise'
Serial number etched around the rim of the back end cap making wall repairs
less hassle.The barrel extension's trunion is also the back end cap with all legal info etched.


* << https://www.oshwin.com/stainless-steel- ... -tube.html >>
jlwilliams
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by jlwilliams »

If it's like any other consumer technology, it's going to get a lot better and a lot more available. By the end of the decade you will be printing a can, running a tap through the threads just to clean them up and go shooting.
Historian
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by Historian »

jlwilliams wrote: Sun Oct 31, 2021 4:46 pm If it's like any other consumer technology, it's going to get a lot better and a lot more available.
By the end of the decade you will be printing a can, running a tap through the threads just to clean them up and go shooting.
Ancient Balkan compliment "May your words turn to gold".

Polaroid came out in 1950s with instant cameras ... expensive.
Though pricey they sold like hot cakes to home users for
'bedroom' candids that by passed sending films to drugstore
and having pimple faced soda jerks make extra prints. :)
The girlie industry took off, one might say, and the prices
came down rapidly.

The real issue will be how to get threaded barrels.

Will this hopefully lead to the demise of the racist $200.00 'poll tax' on suppressors
and relegate their purchase to be in line of acquiring a spare barrel?
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kyle matthews
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by kyle matthews »

Resin silencer?
schmellba
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by schmellba »

Radical Firearms has a Ti 3d printed suppressor that they have had for a while. FA rated, pretty impressive sound suppression. The thing with 3d printing is that you can create much more complicated/intricate internals that would be impossible to machine, even on a CNC.
0101silent
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by 0101silent »

There are creative ways to use inexpensive 3d printers to make metal parts. More is involved than making a drawing in Fusion 360 and pushing a button as with a DMLS machine.

For example, a metal rocket nozzle created with an inexpensive 3d printer, special filament, and and expensive oven. https://youtu.be/tw9VF1V-Lzc
Filament is available in 316 Stainless, 17-4, and inconel.

The filament can also be worked by hand.

A short video showing how a planetary gearbox was made using a 3d printed model and investment casting. https://youtube.com/shorts/F-wZgn63oWU?feature=share VOG has many good videos on lost resin and lost pla casting.

Models can be made by hand with wax, foam, or other materials. I've seen metal melted in a standard microwave for casting.

If you really want a DMLS printer but can't buy one can you make one? Lasers, stepper motors, servo motors, bottled argon, powdered metal, and control software have already been invented and are readily available.
anarchy99
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by anarchy99 »

I have a friend who has all the appropriate licenses, etc... He makes 3D printed .22 silencers using a special engineering resin called Siraya Blu. They thread directly onto the gun and come out of the printer ready to use. For greater durability, it's possible to epoxy an off-the-shelf metal flash hider, muzzle brake, or flash can into the rear of a printed silencer for perfect alignment, durable threads, and better dissipation of the initial muzzle blast. Keep in mind that printed cans aren't as strong as machined metal cans, so they need to have thicker sidewalls and baffles. That said, they're lightweight, disposable, and work great. Looks like the Fudds were wrong, as usual.
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by anarchy99 »

P.S.: The machine he uses cost him less than $200 on Amazon. Literally cheaper than a single tax stamp.
alordnapa
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by alordnapa »

...And in related news, vegan bacon reportedly tastes just as good or better as the actual pork version!

There are not many people out there willing to pay $200.00 bucks for a disposable suppressor, and one that, when it does fail, will embed plastic bomb-casing into anyone standing around. For free countries, or government agencies, disposable cans still leave a terrible problem with accountability. Its probably not wise just to throw them in the trash or drop them on the range where evil scavengers will doubtless rebuild or repurpose them.
0101silent
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Re: What about 3D printed silencers?

Post by 0101silent »

anarchy99 wrote: Fri Jan 28, 2022 2:30 am I have a friend who has all the appropriate licenses, etc... He makes 3D printed .22 silencers using a special engineering resin called Siraya Blu. They thread directly onto the gun and come out of the printer ready to use. For greater durability, it's possible to epoxy an off-the-shelf metal flash hider, muzzle brake, or flash can into the rear of a printed silencer for perfect alignment, durable threads, and better dissipation of the initial muzzle blast. Keep in mind that printed cans aren't as strong as machined metal cans, so they need to have thicker sidewalls and baffles. That said, they're lightweight, disposable, and work great. Looks like the Fudds were wrong, as usual.
A resin 3D core could also be epoxied inside a serialized metal tube than can be legally and easily recored.
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