OK, I just read a kinda SHTF book and it made me think a bit about everything I have. I have alot of things I could trade for stuff if currency became worthless. Lets face it, the dolar today is nothing but a belief in the US government. My family was in a SHTF senario when I was 12. (Just Google "Grand Forks 1997" and you will get the story.) We had a few hours warning, packed up, and went west to my uncles house.
Anyway, the banks were flooded and of course you know how that goes. I know my dad has some silver coins hidden away, probably for such an event. I don't think he bothered to take them because we could rely on my uncle.
Anyway, now I am an adult and have been thinking about things like this. Almost all my money is in the bank and I use my credit card 99% of the time to buy things. I pay it off every month and I get the cash back points so the CC company isn't making money off me. There is nothing wrong with this when things are working fine, but if something like 1997, or anything like it were to happen again and I didn't have someone to help me or to go to, I might be in trouble.
I am thinking that just like being prepared ammo wise and such, I should have some form of hard currency stored away for such a day. I am sure others have experience in this and I would like you advice.
Should I look at gold or silver? Both?
How much should I have? I'm only thinking about short term diasters where things are really crazy for a month at most. I have to be realistic, that should cover most disasters.
Right now, I would probably only be looking to have enough to support myself so I shouldn't need too much.
Where would I go to get it?
I thank you for your time and help. Don't mean to be paranoid, just prepared.
Gold/silver for SHTF currency? Where do I get it? Advice?
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3101
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I was in New Orleans post Katrina....
Credit cards, cash, and I suspect, gold and silver were useless.....
Fuel (gasoline) cigarettes, water, food were mediums of exchange.
In that order (you may be able to move fuel and cigarettes back and forth)
No electricity, no banks........I suspect it would take a lot of gold or silver to make a transaction
(rate of exchange that I personally witnessed)
5 gallons of gasoline for two cartons of smokes
Credit cards, cash, and I suspect, gold and silver were useless.....
Fuel (gasoline) cigarettes, water, food were mediums of exchange.
In that order (you may be able to move fuel and cigarettes back and forth)
No electricity, no banks........I suspect it would take a lot of gold or silver to make a transaction
(rate of exchange that I personally witnessed)
5 gallons of gasoline for two cartons of smokes
Mr. Burns: This anonymous clan of slack-jawed troglodytes has cost me the election, and yet if I were to have them killed, I would be the one to go to jail. That's democracy for you.
Smithers: You are noble and poetic in defeat, sir.
Smithers: You are noble and poetic in defeat, sir.
Of course this is just my opinion, but I think that if the SHTF 99% of the people who are starving to death won't have anything to trade, particularly anything valuable or even useful. If you had nothing but a family to feed, and the only thing stopping you from doing so was a lack of gold or silver to 'trade' with, what would you do? I think everyone who sees the results of such a situation can be confident that they have witnessed a very dark side of human nature.
On the other hand, if you manage to survive long enough, gold and silver may become valuable again.
On the other hand, if you manage to survive long enough, gold and silver may become valuable again.
I agree with the last two posts, gold and silver are bad choices. Food water, toilet paper, and other household stuff will be much better for barter in a SHTF situation. In normal times precious metals have a lousy rate of return for an investment compared to mutual funds. For more "barter currency" ideas, give this link a look.
http://survival.com/IVB/index.php?showt ... &hl=barter
http://survival.com/IVB/index.php?showt ... &hl=barter
OK, I see where you all are comming from and it makes sence.
A few ideas:
One of those hand water filters and plenty of filters. Clean water for yourself and to barter with. Peple will trade about anything for water.
Won't take much space and could get you alot of stuff
For personal use I should probably get a Lee hand press. I have thought about this and think it would be a good idea depending on how light you can get the kit to be. Pull the duds and reuse the components. Pull the components from calibers that you can get, but don't have a gun to fire. (Not the safest thing, but as long as you arn't going to max loads and know what you are doing, it shouldn't be a problem.) Carry components that can be used in multiple calibers. 124 grain 9mm bullets and AA #7, you might have a .357 now, but what if you come across a good 9mm. What if you need more .357 and can only find 9x19 or 38 Super ammo? The same for .30 calibers. (Again, not the safest thing to do, but it beats having no ammo.) This would probably only be practical if you had a car. If on foot, you would probably have to ditch that/burry it for later because of the weight. This also would be geared more for an economic SHTF rather than a natural disaster SHTF where you would have more time to plan and pack.
Solar Battery charger. For personal use and you never know if someone wants the AA's for their radio/flashlight charged. Flashlights would be invaluable and rechargeables + the charger are lighter than taking a bunch of alkaline (Take some alkaline for trade anyway.)
Handheld CB radio. If the ionosphere is just right you can pick up transmissions from a long way away. You can listen in to hear what people are saying, transmit and hope someone hears you. We all know how reliable the media can be and if the disaster is local you can hope that some HAM operators will be listening. A shortwave radio is also a good idea. Try to keep batteries interchangeable.
MP3 player with lots of different songs loaded + external speakers. Going to need to be powered by the AA/AAA batteries and flash card based for durability and maximum storage. Even in the worst of times, people are going to want entertainment and if letting people listen to a George Carlin routine or some Metalica can get you stuff, all the better. At the very least it will keep you entertained. During all the blackouts I have been in, having some music going really lessened how much being without power sucks. This one would be nice as it would be very lightweight and not take up much space.
Reading that forum brings up the good point that services are very valuable. Of course I would not rely on alot of these things I listed above as a sure fire way of getting stuff. I'm just brainstorming some unconventional things that might be usefull.
A few ideas:
One of those hand water filters and plenty of filters. Clean water for yourself and to barter with. Peple will trade about anything for water.
Won't take much space and could get you alot of stuffFor personal use I should probably get a Lee hand press. I have thought about this and think it would be a good idea depending on how light you can get the kit to be. Pull the duds and reuse the components. Pull the components from calibers that you can get, but don't have a gun to fire. (Not the safest thing, but as long as you arn't going to max loads and know what you are doing, it shouldn't be a problem.) Carry components that can be used in multiple calibers. 124 grain 9mm bullets and AA #7, you might have a .357 now, but what if you come across a good 9mm. What if you need more .357 and can only find 9x19 or 38 Super ammo? The same for .30 calibers. (Again, not the safest thing to do, but it beats having no ammo.) This would probably only be practical if you had a car. If on foot, you would probably have to ditch that/burry it for later because of the weight. This also would be geared more for an economic SHTF rather than a natural disaster SHTF where you would have more time to plan and pack.
Solar Battery charger. For personal use and you never know if someone wants the AA's for their radio/flashlight charged. Flashlights would be invaluable and rechargeables + the charger are lighter than taking a bunch of alkaline (Take some alkaline for trade anyway.)
Handheld CB radio. If the ionosphere is just right you can pick up transmissions from a long way away. You can listen in to hear what people are saying, transmit and hope someone hears you. We all know how reliable the media can be and if the disaster is local you can hope that some HAM operators will be listening. A shortwave radio is also a good idea. Try to keep batteries interchangeable.
MP3 player with lots of different songs loaded + external speakers. Going to need to be powered by the AA/AAA batteries and flash card based for durability and maximum storage. Even in the worst of times, people are going to want entertainment and if letting people listen to a George Carlin routine or some Metalica can get you stuff, all the better. At the very least it will keep you entertained. During all the blackouts I have been in, having some music going really lessened how much being without power sucks. This one would be nice as it would be very lightweight and not take up much space.
Reading that forum brings up the good point that services are very valuable. Of course I would not rely on alot of these things I listed above as a sure fire way of getting stuff. I'm just brainstorming some unconventional things that might be usefull.
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thunderhole
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This is from a man named Enzio F. Buche who grew up in post-war Germany:
"Frequently I am asked 'What were the most valuable items in the days of starvation in Germany?'
...As for what we needed, the food item we relied on most was vegetable oil. With a bottle of vegetable oil one could aquire nearly every other desirable item. It had such value that with a quart of vegetable oil one could probably trade for three bushels of apples or three hundred pounds of potatoes. Vegetable oil has a high calorie content, is easy to transport, and in cooking can give a tasty flavor to all kinds of food items that one would not normally consider as food - wild flowers, wild plants, and roots from shrubs and trees.
... let me offer this comforting idea based on past experience. We need to take into consideration that in difficult times, so long as there survives more than one family, there will be trading in valuable items. A free market will begin immediately to satisfy the needs of people, and items in greatest demand will set the set the price, bypassing the use of money. The ingeniousness of of mankind becomes evident in times of need.
...There are some other observations one could make: The true nature of people becomes obvious in times of real need. Good people become better; they get close to one another; they learn to share and become united. The strength that develops out of unity of the many good people becomes a real survival factor. On the other hand, people who lack emotional stability become cruel and ruthless under trying circumstances..."
"Frequently I am asked 'What were the most valuable items in the days of starvation in Germany?'
...As for what we needed, the food item we relied on most was vegetable oil. With a bottle of vegetable oil one could aquire nearly every other desirable item. It had such value that with a quart of vegetable oil one could probably trade for three bushels of apples or three hundred pounds of potatoes. Vegetable oil has a high calorie content, is easy to transport, and in cooking can give a tasty flavor to all kinds of food items that one would not normally consider as food - wild flowers, wild plants, and roots from shrubs and trees.
... let me offer this comforting idea based on past experience. We need to take into consideration that in difficult times, so long as there survives more than one family, there will be trading in valuable items. A free market will begin immediately to satisfy the needs of people, and items in greatest demand will set the set the price, bypassing the use of money. The ingeniousness of of mankind becomes evident in times of need.
...There are some other observations one could make: The true nature of people becomes obvious in times of real need. Good people become better; they get close to one another; they learn to share and become united. The strength that develops out of unity of the many good people becomes a real survival factor. On the other hand, people who lack emotional stability become cruel and ruthless under trying circumstances..."
"A long time ago being crazy meant something. Now everybody's crazy."-Charles Manson
A stockpile of hot chicks.
In any SHTF situation, there wil be more crazy-eyed, nutjob, horny survivalists who would give 6 gallons of vegetable oil, an AK, and 2 blocks of C4 plus caps just for one quality piece of ass. Trust me, there will be much more veggie oil and rice than hot chicks when Apocalypse strikes.
Think it through. Hot chicks are the answer.
In any SHTF situation, there wil be more crazy-eyed, nutjob, horny survivalists who would give 6 gallons of vegetable oil, an AK, and 2 blocks of C4 plus caps just for one quality piece of ass. Trust me, there will be much more veggie oil and rice than hot chicks when Apocalypse strikes.
Think it through. Hot chicks are the answer.
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3101
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Hot chicks require too much maintance for long term storage...
However, IMO, the next big SHTF situation is going to be the pandemic flu.
"Social distancing" will be the media buzzword. People who run essential services will either not report to work, or will be too sick to work. There will be issues with disposal of bodies, food and fuel delivery, delivery of medical services, etc....the government, local, state and federal will discourage gathering in any place that uses common air circulation (churchs, stores, schools, etc)
Bugging out ain't gonna be the issue, living at home will be. Waves of pandemic flu last from 6-8 weeks (if history is a guide)
for those who want to read more, visit www.pandemicflu.gov
For those of you who think I am crazy....I am on the local govt committee for pandemic flu planning....
However, IMO, the next big SHTF situation is going to be the pandemic flu.
"Social distancing" will be the media buzzword. People who run essential services will either not report to work, or will be too sick to work. There will be issues with disposal of bodies, food and fuel delivery, delivery of medical services, etc....the government, local, state and federal will discourage gathering in any place that uses common air circulation (churchs, stores, schools, etc)
Bugging out ain't gonna be the issue, living at home will be. Waves of pandemic flu last from 6-8 weeks (if history is a guide)
for those who want to read more, visit www.pandemicflu.gov
For those of you who think I am crazy....I am on the local govt committee for pandemic flu planning....
Mr. Burns: This anonymous clan of slack-jawed troglodytes has cost me the election, and yet if I were to have them killed, I would be the one to go to jail. That's democracy for you.
Smithers: You are noble and poetic in defeat, sir.
Smithers: You are noble and poetic in defeat, sir.
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chrismartin
- Silencertalk Goon Squad
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Food and "consumable vices" would be prime barter material.
Precious metals? Lead & brass ... already assembled. I don't see much point in focusing on reloading gear and cross-assembling rounds, as that's too much screwing around with stuff that is so easy to handle pre-assembled (so much easier to say "here's a box of '30-06" instead of "I've got some '30-06 brass, and could pull some bullets & powder from some .308 rounds...").
In a blinding flash of insight, it just hit me that the value of gold & silver is NOT in one having it stockpiled for trade, but in having more mundane stuff ready to trade for gold & silver. People are far more willing to let go of their precious metals if they're not convinced they'll last the week otherwise. If you've put your money into on-hand gold, you'll find it hard to eat ... but easy to trade for a couple cases of MREs I've got. You don't want to go into SHTF with precious metals, you want to come out of SHTF with the stuff.
A few cases of water filters, MREs, vodka, and condoms will probably get you a long way in a SHTF situation ... and used right, will leave you well-off when it ends.
Precious metals? Lead & brass ... already assembled. I don't see much point in focusing on reloading gear and cross-assembling rounds, as that's too much screwing around with stuff that is so easy to handle pre-assembled (so much easier to say "here's a box of '30-06" instead of "I've got some '30-06 brass, and could pull some bullets & powder from some .308 rounds...").
In a blinding flash of insight, it just hit me that the value of gold & silver is NOT in one having it stockpiled for trade, but in having more mundane stuff ready to trade for gold & silver. People are far more willing to let go of their precious metals if they're not convinced they'll last the week otherwise. If you've put your money into on-hand gold, you'll find it hard to eat ... but easy to trade for a couple cases of MREs I've got. You don't want to go into SHTF with precious metals, you want to come out of SHTF with the stuff.
A few cases of water filters, MREs, vodka, and condoms will probably get you a long way in a SHTF situation ... and used right, will leave you well-off when it ends.
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SwampGator
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Z..
Last edited by SwampGator on Sat Dec 30, 2023 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud." - Sophocles
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montanabound
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Anyone who has sense enough to rely on themselves are going to be the only ones civilzed enough to barter with.Depending on the event that puts us in this position I would not attempt to barter for/with food unless it was someone I knew I could trust and/or I had no other choice.Katrina pretty much set the standard for disaster on a small scale and I don't think I would let anyone know what I had to trade with for making sure my family was not going to be jeopardized by my/our actions. I would lead those around me to believe I was no better off than they are.
Just sit back ....wait ...and watch.
Just sit back ....wait ...and watch.
How about having extra firearms to trade/barter/give to a neighbor with? Katrina proved several things: 1) Do not ever say they wont come to confiscate your weapon because they did 2) How many people (who did not have their firearms confiscated) joined with their neighbors to protect their own. 3) Have a suppressed weapon as to not draw attention to a situation 
Peace through superior firepower><>
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MicroGuy
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I know this is an old thread but.....
You need to know your area. There is no one answer for this question.
For instance, if you live in or near the country, where you can offer base foods (grains or meat) for other items to the city dwellers, you're in business. You can ask what you want for your goods. (providing you can keep them from taking over, and they don't have anything you HAVE to have)
Possibly gasoline. Oil? Medical supplies?
It's always a matter of what you have, that the other guy wants.
Veggie oil does sound good for a starter though, general all around commodity. Remember that oil has more calories per gram than anything else. You'll live longer with one bottle of oil, than a guy with a side of beef. (sucks as a meal though)
Gold and silver IS a good investment, it's gone up at least 600% over the years. If my folks had invested in gold back when I told them to, we'd be millionaires now.
One probalem is, YOU have something THEY want. Not much of one, because I"m assuming your armed, heavily at that.
But you need something you can beak up. Most gold coins today come in large 1oz. coins, worth several hundred dollars in today's money. You'll have to cut it up. If you have a 1oz. coin, are you prepared to accept 500 gallons of gas? (will they have it?)
Gold and silver would be mostly for the long haul.
Water?? Get the First Need filter system. Takes out all sorts of "bugs". In New Orleans, most "filters" would have been useless because of the nasties in the water. The "First Need" from General Ecology is a water "Purifier", NOT a filter. Other are FILTERS, not PURIFIERS.
So I can pump toilet water into my First Need and get drinking water, you'd be sitting on the sideline drooling over my water. (or puking your guts up from that s--t you drank, and then dying a horrible death, because you're not getting any of my water, and I just took everything of value you had while you were incapacitated)
Personally, I think in times of bad, bug out etc... I want to be "alone". I'm hitting the road and heading up into the woods.
Because when it gets bad, it's gonna get really fucking bad, and it's gonna get a hell of a lot worse before it gets better.
For that reason, I want stuff to keep ME alive. Ammo, LOTS of ammo. You can trade ammo for anything, depending on if it's loaded in a mag or not.
Girls?? Maybe for the long haul again. If it comes down to it, trust me, that's the LAST damn thing I'm thinking about.
A dog would be a tremendous asset. I think they would be worth their weight in gold. Especially a good hunting dog, or some other trained animal, beagles, good with noses etc.... (and they can sniff out the girls for me)
If nothing else, they're meat, and they can support themselves, and protection, multi-use.
Just my 2 cents.....
(the idea is survival, not getting rich!)
Oh yeah, the above post is great. Better to have an armed neighborhood than an armed neighbor. Security in numbers.
And a suppressed weapon would be far better. Take the head shot and slink away, don't make a big deal of it. If they know you have it, they'll come for it.
If it comes down to it, I'm not putting a sign out there that says "I shoot looters". It's gonna say "I KILL looters".
You're gonna have to think and act like an animal, that's been civilized. You can't be an animal, but you have to be prepared to go down to that level.
You need to know your area. There is no one answer for this question.
For instance, if you live in or near the country, where you can offer base foods (grains or meat) for other items to the city dwellers, you're in business. You can ask what you want for your goods. (providing you can keep them from taking over, and they don't have anything you HAVE to have)
Possibly gasoline. Oil? Medical supplies?
It's always a matter of what you have, that the other guy wants.
Veggie oil does sound good for a starter though, general all around commodity. Remember that oil has more calories per gram than anything else. You'll live longer with one bottle of oil, than a guy with a side of beef. (sucks as a meal though)
Gold and silver IS a good investment, it's gone up at least 600% over the years. If my folks had invested in gold back when I told them to, we'd be millionaires now.
One probalem is, YOU have something THEY want. Not much of one, because I"m assuming your armed, heavily at that.
But you need something you can beak up. Most gold coins today come in large 1oz. coins, worth several hundred dollars in today's money. You'll have to cut it up. If you have a 1oz. coin, are you prepared to accept 500 gallons of gas? (will they have it?)
Gold and silver would be mostly for the long haul.
Water?? Get the First Need filter system. Takes out all sorts of "bugs". In New Orleans, most "filters" would have been useless because of the nasties in the water. The "First Need" from General Ecology is a water "Purifier", NOT a filter. Other are FILTERS, not PURIFIERS.
So I can pump toilet water into my First Need and get drinking water, you'd be sitting on the sideline drooling over my water. (or puking your guts up from that s--t you drank, and then dying a horrible death, because you're not getting any of my water, and I just took everything of value you had while you were incapacitated)
Personally, I think in times of bad, bug out etc... I want to be "alone". I'm hitting the road and heading up into the woods.
Because when it gets bad, it's gonna get really fucking bad, and it's gonna get a hell of a lot worse before it gets better.
For that reason, I want stuff to keep ME alive. Ammo, LOTS of ammo. You can trade ammo for anything, depending on if it's loaded in a mag or not.
Girls?? Maybe for the long haul again. If it comes down to it, trust me, that's the LAST damn thing I'm thinking about.
A dog would be a tremendous asset. I think they would be worth their weight in gold. Especially a good hunting dog, or some other trained animal, beagles, good with noses etc.... (and they can sniff out the girls for me)
If nothing else, they're meat, and they can support themselves, and protection, multi-use.
Just my 2 cents.....
(the idea is survival, not getting rich!)
Oh yeah, the above post is great. Better to have an armed neighborhood than an armed neighbor. Security in numbers.
And a suppressed weapon would be far better. Take the head shot and slink away, don't make a big deal of it. If they know you have it, they'll come for it.
If it comes down to it, I'm not putting a sign out there that says "I shoot looters". It's gonna say "I KILL looters".
You're gonna have to think and act like an animal, that's been civilized. You can't be an animal, but you have to be prepared to go down to that level.
"The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." Alexis de Tocqueville
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3101
- Silent But Deadly
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- Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2006 3:55 pm
- Location: Northeast Georgia...near UGA
and cigarettes....you are good to go when it comes to SHTF survival issues....radar wrote:BEER.
As a life long redneck and former union working stiff, I can tell you that an amazing amount of work, gear, equipment, etc is traded for beer now, no reason that it would change.
Mr. Burns: This anonymous clan of slack-jawed troglodytes has cost me the election, and yet if I were to have them killed, I would be the one to go to jail. That's democracy for you.
Smithers: You are noble and poetic in defeat, sir.
Smithers: You are noble and poetic in defeat, sir.
Alcohol, tobacco, toilet paper, purified water, condoms, guns&ammo.
Alcohol - beer is ideal but bulky; I'm thinking something more concentrated like whiskey or Everclear. One case of Jack could go a long way.
Tobacco - probably the best value-to-volume ratio. Not sure about storage. 2/3rds cigs and 1/3rd higher-end cigars.
TP - lousy value-to-volume ratio, but cheap to get and most widely needed base luxury. Pack your attic with a truckload for insulation ( ).
Water - if you can purify it, they will pay.
Condoms - 'nuff said.
Guns & ammo - great value-to-weight ratio. My only hesitation is it could easily become the last sale you ever make; I'll arm friendlies for free (watch my back & I'll watch yours), but kinda skittish about selling to strangers of unclear & fluid morals.
Gold etc. - again, it's something to trade for, not with. Precious metals are useless for survival per se, and the value will utterly plummet during the incident. Faced with impending doom, most will hand over the family jewels (no, not those, unless that's your thing) for a few gallons of clean water, a pack of cigs and a beer. It's during STHF that you'll want to obtain gold etc. - then sell it later for profit. Sure gold has gone up 600% of late - it probably won't continue that big rise, and certainly won't when few people have the financial liquidity for it.
Alcohol - beer is ideal but bulky; I'm thinking something more concentrated like whiskey or Everclear. One case of Jack could go a long way.
Tobacco - probably the best value-to-volume ratio. Not sure about storage. 2/3rds cigs and 1/3rd higher-end cigars.
TP - lousy value-to-volume ratio, but cheap to get and most widely needed base luxury. Pack your attic with a truckload for insulation (
).Water - if you can purify it, they will pay.
Condoms - 'nuff said.
Guns & ammo - great value-to-weight ratio. My only hesitation is it could easily become the last sale you ever make; I'll arm friendlies for free (watch my back & I'll watch yours), but kinda skittish about selling to strangers of unclear & fluid morals.
Gold etc. - again, it's something to trade for, not with. Precious metals are useless for survival per se, and the value will utterly plummet during the incident. Faced with impending doom, most will hand over the family jewels (no, not those, unless that's your thing) for a few gallons of clean water, a pack of cigs and a beer. It's during STHF that you'll want to obtain gold etc. - then sell it later for profit. Sure gold has gone up 600% of late - it probably won't continue that big rise, and certainly won't when few people have the financial liquidity for it.
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MicroGuy
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As a life long redneck, you should be able to build a STILL!!!!
Tobacco doesn't stay fresh very long. Ever smoked a really stale cigarette?? Ooofff!!! Might as well suck a blow torch. But cigarettes, by virtue of their manufacture, don't keep well.
(good thing I quit long ago! You can have 'em all, but once all the other people go into withdrawal, they'll be good barter material)
If you can store 'em, like maybe in a root celler, you'd be OK. Cigars keep longer under the right conditions, there's instances of a guy smoking over a million dollars worth of stogies that just happened to be stored under the right conditions (he didn't know the value, just that they were good smokes).
Turns out they were very old, and very valuable. He'd go down there once a day, to his private stash he found, and get a good stogie. Later when it was discovered, there were only about a case or two left, and those went for thousands of dollars.
Under the right conditions......
I started putting together stuff I would need, right after 9/11. And water was at the top of the list. Face it, without water, you die in a few days, or less.
Most people don't even know you can use bleach to purify water, or even boil it! Did you see those morons on the roofs after Katrina?? Surrounded by water, and they're begging for it.
Not to mention the fact that most people couldn't build a water filter. (sock, sand, and charcoal from a fire, stuffed in a piece of PVC or similar).
Self sufficiency, number one asset.
Tobacco doesn't stay fresh very long. Ever smoked a really stale cigarette?? Ooofff!!! Might as well suck a blow torch. But cigarettes, by virtue of their manufacture, don't keep well.
(good thing I quit long ago! You can have 'em all, but once all the other people go into withdrawal, they'll be good barter material)
If you can store 'em, like maybe in a root celler, you'd be OK. Cigars keep longer under the right conditions, there's instances of a guy smoking over a million dollars worth of stogies that just happened to be stored under the right conditions (he didn't know the value, just that they were good smokes).
Turns out they were very old, and very valuable. He'd go down there once a day, to his private stash he found, and get a good stogie. Later when it was discovered, there were only about a case or two left, and those went for thousands of dollars.
Under the right conditions......
I started putting together stuff I would need, right after 9/11. And water was at the top of the list. Face it, without water, you die in a few days, or less.
Most people don't even know you can use bleach to purify water, or even boil it! Did you see those morons on the roofs after Katrina?? Surrounded by water, and they're begging for it.
Not to mention the fact that most people couldn't build a water filter. (sock, sand, and charcoal from a fire, stuffed in a piece of PVC or similar).
Self sufficiency, number one asset.
"The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." Alexis de Tocqueville